Chicoutimi hearing postponed

Canadian Press via Sun Media ^ | 2005-02-18 | Murray Brewster

[Clive]

Chicoutimi hearing postponed

By MURRAY BREWSTER

HALIFAX (CP) - The renewed investigation into the fatal fire aboard HMCS Chicoutimi has been put off until next month while the submarine's captain and two officers seek legal advice, The Canadian Press has learned.

Closed-door hearings that were supposed to take place next week in Ottawa have been postponed until March 1 as Cmdr. Luc Pelletier, Lieut. Sebastian LaTullipe and Lieut. Brendan Ryan talk to lawyers, military sources say.

All three were slated to testify about a decision to leave a hatch open as the British-built warship plowed through rough seas on Oct. 5, off the coast of Ireland.

The opening of the hatch is believed to be a key link in a series of events that led to the electrical fire, which claimed the life of Lieut. Chris Saunders of Halifax, and injured eight other crew.

The prevailing opinion among Canadian submariners is that Pelletier and the officers are being set up as scapegoats, said a military source.

The intent is to "deflect attention away" from the British, who failed to inform the Canadian navy about the warship's electrical faults, the source added.

"It's now a witchhunt," he said. "Pelletier is getting a raw deal."

A second military source said the navy is anxious to avoid a diplomatic row with Britain.

As a result, questions about why the British failed to repair certain electrical defects on Chicoutimi are getting lost "in the call for somebody's head," said the second source.

The military board of inquiry, which completed its initial investigation in December, was re-opened on Feb. 1 to look into why a hatch was left open while sailors tried to repair a conning tower vent.

A spokeswoman for the board of inquiry would not confirm who had been asked to testify.

But Lieut. Diane Grover confirmed that under military regulations those asked to appear have the right seek legal counsel.

Grover said she understood why navy personnel were concerned about the fate of the captain and officers.

"I can appreciate where they're coming from," she said in an interview from Ottawa. "These people are concerned about their shipmates. However, I would like to say that the board of inquiry is nothing more than a fact-finding tool."

Grover then made a direct appeal to Canada's sailors: "Have some faith in the process," she said.

The inquiry has heard that a rogue wave swept over the warship, pushing sea water through the open hatch and into the control room, submerging an electrical junction box in the captain's cabin.

That caused a short-circuit, a shower of sparks and a major fire.

The Victoria-class submarines have two conning tower hatches, one of which is usually sealed when the boat travels on the surface.

The decision to leave that hatch open could have only been made by the captain.

The two officers, Ryan and LaTullipe, are being questioned because they were the designated officers of the watch, which means they were on the bridge at separate times during the repair operation, said the second source.

Current and former Royal Navy submariners have said the practice of "running open" in rough seas is considered unsafe.

But Canadian submarine crews dispute that claim, saying the practice is common on Chicoutimi's three sister ships, all of which were acquired from Britain in an $897-million lease-to-purchase deal.

"I've sailed on the old (Oberon) boats opened up and I'd do it again," said one source.

It remains unclear whether the Canadian navy officially endorses the practice.

An ex-submariner, who now teaches at Nova Scotia's Dalhousie university, said there is no clear-cut answer.

"It depends upon the class of submarine, its design and construction," said retired commander Peter Haydon. "Running a submarine on the surface is complex.

"You have to get air into them and some submarines are built with a separate air induction system that they can draw air in from the conning tower. Older boats did not have that separate induction valve and just drew it through the hatch."

Haydon declined to comment on the Chicoutimi case, saying he wasn't familiar with the design.

Meanwhile, serving members of Canada's submarine community say the questions surrounding the hatch are just a distraction. The key question, they say, is why the British did not waterproof the junction box on the floor of the captain's cabin.

"Submarines are susceptible to water," said one source. "They're designed to get wet a lot and we still go about our business."

The Canadian investigation has revealed that engineers in Britain had raised concerns about the integrity of specific, high-voltage junction boxes throughout HMS Upholder, the submarine that would later be renamed HMCS Chicoutimi.

The problem was fixed on the three other Victoria-class submarines by applying vulcanized rubber and shrink-wrap plastic, members of the navy's SubSafe program confirmed during a briefing in Ottawa last fall.

But the junction box in the captain's cabin of Chicoutimi was not touched.

The Canadian navy found out about the repair job as it sifted through technical papers in the aftermath of Chicoutimi tragedy, the briefing revealed.

[Clive]

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[SilentServiceCPO]

Steely-Eyed Killers of the Deep ping!

[Doohickey]

Steely-Eyed Killers of the Deep ping!

Here's a pic of HMCS Victoria, first in this class:

[SmithL]

BTDT. We were on sound trials in the Potato Patch coming out of Mare Island. One of our JOs was going to the bridge and had both hatches open, when we got hit by a wall of green water. I was on watch up in the Torpedo Room, seeing the surf go back and forth in the Crews Mess. Down in Berthing, they were throwing mattresses over the Battery Access hatch. We spent days on the surface trying to dry out. It was miserable. I was SO glad when we finally pulled the plug and dove.

[BykrBayb]

I thought the Canadians did extensive repairs on those subs before the went underway. Shouldn't they have identified the problem and fixed it?

[Clive]

The refit was being done by a Brit drydock prior to acceptance by the Canadian Forces.

But it would normally be Canada's responsibility to oversee the work as it progresses under command of a Canadian naval officer.

This vessel was the last of 4 delivered and it was on its first crossing under Canadian command.

The vessel has now been transported to Canada in the same manner that the USS Cole was brought home and all work will henceforth be done in Canadian drydocks.

The intention is that these diesel-electric subs will be fitted during future refits to a Canadian designed air independent propulsion system. Now that Chicoutimi is laid up and needs a lot of work, it might be an opportune time to install a prototype.

[deaconjim]

"Submarines are susceptible to water," said one source. "They're designed to get wet a lot and we still go about our business."

And submariners are trained to put out fires, too. Sounds to me like the Canandians are in the habit of running around with that hatch open, and perhaps they are finding out why that's not a great idea.

[PogySailor]

BTDT2. The worst I remember was during SEAL training on Billfish. We had a "bathtub" built in OPS/UL under the Weapons Shipping Hatch and were practicing doing a rapid surface and deployment/recovery of a team. We had done this several times when on one attempt there was a large wave which broke over the deck. We took several thousand gallons of water down the hatch.

I was in radio/ESM with 6" + water running through the door and over the ladder to Crews Mess. Knocked out CAMS and we spent several days cleaning and repairing all the rack fans from the WLQ-4.

[NorthOf45]

I wouldn't say it is a "habit". There was a reason for both hatches to be open ... repairs. Was it legitimate? I don't know. Also, I don't believe they were actually running around either.

[deaconjim]

But Canadian submarine crews dispute that claim, saying the practice is common on Chicoutimi's three sister ships, all of which were acquired from Britain in an $897-million lease-to-purchase deal. "I've sailed on the old (Oberon) boats opened up and I'd do it again," said one source. It remains unclear whether the Canadian navy officially endorses the practice.

That part of the story leads one to that conclusion.