Posted on 02/14/2005 9:43:53 AM PST by jmc813
The U.S. House of Representatives passed a national ID bill last week that masqueraded as “immigration reform.” The bill does nothing to address immigration policy, however, nor does it propose deporting a single illegal alien already in our country. It does nothing to address the porous border between the U.S. and Mexico, which is the fundamental problem. In reality, the bill is a Trojan horse. It pretends to offer desperately needed border control in order to con a credulous Congress into sacrificing more of our constitutionally protected liberty.
Supporters claim the national ID scheme is voluntary. However, any state that opts out will automatically make non-persons out of its citizens. The citizens of that state will be unable to have any dealings with the federal government because their ID will not be accepted. They will not be able to fly or to take a train. In essence, in the eyes of the federal government they will cease to exist. It is absurd to call this voluntary, and the proponents of the national ID know that every state will have no choice but to comply. Federal legislation that nationalizes standards for drivers’ licenses and birth certificates creates a national ID system pure and simple.
It is just a matter of time until those who refuse to carry the new licenses will be denied the ability to drive or board an airplane. Such domestic travel restrictions are the hallmark of authoritarian states, not free republics.
This bill establishes a huge, centrally-coordinated database of highly personal information about American citizens: at a minimum their name, date of birth, place of residence, Social Security number, and physical and possibly other characteristics. The bill even provides for this sensitive information of American citizens to be shared with Canada and Mexico! Imagine a corrupt Mexican official selling thousands of identity files, including Social Security numbers, to criminals!
This legislation gives authority to the Secretary of Homeland Security to expand required information on drivers’ licenses, potentially including such biometric information as retina scans, finger prints, DNA information, and even Radio Frequency Identification (RFID) radio tracking technology. Including such technology as RFID means the federal government, as well as the governments of Canada and Mexico, could know where American citizens are at all times.
What will this mean for us? When this new program is implemented, every time we are required to show our drivers’ license we will, in fact, be showing a national identification card. We will be handing over a card that includes our personal and likely biometric information, information which is connected to a national and international database. This will further degrade our precious privacy, which is the hallmark of a civilized society. As Ayn Rand said, the “Savage’s whole existence is public.”
A national ID card will have the same effect as gun control laws: criminals will ignore it, while law abiding people lose freedom. A national ID card offers us nothing more than a false sense of security, while moving us ever closer to a police state. The national ID proposal should die a well-deserved death in the Senate, and it should be denounced as authoritarian and anti-American.
Not if you're already 65. How much older-looking can you get? And I think if we're relying on state drivers' license pictures to tell who the terrorists are, we're already in deep doo-doo, aren't we? I mean, we're talking about pulling people over or stopping them from flying after they're inside the country. That's not particularly protective.
And shouldn't Congress only be passing laws that deal with things the states SHOULDN'T handle Constitutionally, say, keeping the states from using federal money on illegals or giving licenses to illegals after they accept federal law enforcement grants? Why do we accept this anti-federalist encroachment when we wouldn't accept it were it from the Rats? Whatever happened to the Contract for America? Can't we do ANY of that stuff NOW instead of this b.s.? Passing the line-item veto alone would help the President refocus the country on what's important. Instead federal 'standards' are being handed down and federal programs to supervise them being kicked off willy-nilly. Real conservative, Congress.
Some cut & past from what I said here:
REAL ID BILL PASSES (Sensenbrenner's illegal alien bill passes, will be attached to Iraq bill)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1340612/posts
>>>> When the Iraq supplemental appropriations bill comes up, this measure will be attached to it <<<
If this bill is so great. Why can't it stand on it's own?
One more nail if this passes.
This nation has survived for 230 years without having to show your papers please.
It does not need this now! Don’t say we live in a different world now. Because people are the same now as they were 130, 230 or 2300 years ago. Basic human weakness do not change. We made it through Revolutionary 1812, Civil, WW I, WW II, cold war plus a host of others without it.
This has nothing to do with terrorism. Everything to do with controlling the masses.
The part about world wide tickets proves that! ( you don’t think they will stop at the three do ya)
Nothing like a good old speed trap when your out of state. Or ask that guy who is now a felon in the US because he got caught with a expended .22 caseing in his truck in Mexico.
Your driver license should be just for that. Driving. You want to zoom down a 25mph street with kids playing around it at 100. Then your driving RIGHTS should be suspended
for awhile. Not because you did not do your homework or some other BS like that.
This will not stop one terrorist act. No more that all the gun bans stop crime.
Why do I need a SS# to get a driver's license?
" Why are you so fearful of a dedicated supporter of liberty and the founding principles of our country?"
Freedom can be scary, especially for those who think the GOP is actually "conservative" in any fashion.
He raves about an ID card, but we already have them...they're called Social Security cards.
Ron Paul is a fraud and a fruit loop.
What's wrong with that is that you would take all the power away from the national courts, which would in effect make these 'important' nominations (you know the ones we keep hearing about incessantly) Bush is supposed to make moot. And that in effect would require 'conservatives' to judge Bush on the rest of his record...The Republican party would either have to return to its mantra from 20 years ago chasing out these faux conservatives or watch every real conservative, the ones that were still fooled and hanging on to the Republican party for this very issue, leave overnight..
That is a far cry from someone in Mexico logging into a database and pulling John Q Publics driving record, or any info for that matter.
A far cry? On the contrary, that looks exactly like it.
Actually he struck a bunch of little children and ended up emboldening the enemy. Not that pesky little facts matter any to someone who likes to deal in Clintonian propaganda.
You've been shown to be wrong about both your allegations about his positions now. That would make you the fraud and fruit loop.
As we all know, many illegal immigrants are now establishing residency using an illegally obtained fraudulent driver's license to gain home loans for mortagages - and banks are giving it to them. But only if they can show proof of residency via a valid driver's license.
I think we arrived quite some time ago.
Government is an unfortunate but necessary evil.
Government is an unfortunate but necessary evil.
=====
Yes it is. But it can be kept in line, for the most part, by the people. But they must get involved, they must watch the government, and they must care about their country -- yes, I know that leaves out 50% of today's America, but only 30% fought the American revolution and it worked...so don't be discouraged by numbers. Government can work..but it takes hard work to keep it honest and on track.
No it will not. The government doesn't rule us, we rule them. And they've been told almost yearly for 50 years that this is not to be. America has spoken on this issue over and over. The whole point of this is to make pretense of trying to do something while failing to do what they took oath to. If this is their answere for doing right by america after all the hell that's been brewing to get them to act, then there is no representation in Washington. And it's about time to start considering other options IMO.
bttt
Ron Paul is a fruit loop.
1) using an illegally obtained fraudulent driver's license
2) a valid driver's license.
so which is it? 1 or 2? it can't be both. sounds to me like the banks are breaking the law there.
Then prosecute them for fraud/forgery/perjury/etc. Hard.
Then prosecute them for violating immigration law. Hard.
There are laws. When someone violates them (serious crimes like ID fraud), prosecute the offender. Don't just go "oh well, we'll just have to inconvenience everyone else".
to gain home loans for mortagages - and banks are giving it to them. But only if they can show proof of residency via a valid driver's license.
That's the bank's problem. If they want to use unrelated IDs, they'll get wierd results. A mortgage has nothing to do with driving, so why do they accept driver's licenses? And so long as the mortgage gets paid, what's the problem as far as the bank is concerned? Of course, if the mortgage doesn't get paid, prosecute!
The thing that irks me about all this is the problem has nothing to do with driving. We're talking about driver's licenses: what the heck is a driver's license being used for non-driving issues for? And when using a driver's license to "secure" something (mortgage application, drinker's age, gov't benefits, etc.) are we, as conservatives, REALLY interested in securing the something in question? or is the problem the by-product of a socialist bureaucracy gone bad? Methinks turning driver's licenses into a National ID is a consequence of much worse problems: government control gone amuck.
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