Israel downed 2 Syrian MiGslast September over sea

www.worldtribune.com ^

[lnbchip]

Israel downed 2 Syrian MiGs last September over sea

SPECIAL TO WORLD TRIBUNE.COM Friday, February 11, 2005

Diplomatic sources said Israel Air Force F-16 multi-role fighters intercepted and downed two Syrian MiG-29 fighter-jets last year. The sources said the dogfight took place in September 2004 over the eastern Mediterranean Sea.

This was the first engagement between Israeli and Syrian fighter-jets since the 1980s. The sources said the air battle took place when Israel Air Force fighter-jets buzzed the Syrian city of Latakia, a port used by Iran for the shipment of weapons to Hizbullah.

The Washington-based Reform Party of Syria first provided details of the Israeli-Syrian dogfight. RPS said the air battle took place on Sept. 14, 2004, adding that both downed pilots were rescued by Syrian military helicopters, Middle East Newsline reported.

RPS, quoting a European source, said the Israeli fighter-jets used an Israeli-origin Python-4 air-to-air missile to down one of the MiG-29s. The other Syrian MiG-29 was shot down by a U.S.-origin AIM-9M Sidewinder.

The pilots of the MiG-29s were identified by RPS as Maj. Arshad Midhat Mubarak and Capt. Ahmad Al Khatib.

Diplomatic sources said the Syrian losses led President Bashar Assad to accelerate efforts to procure advanced anti-aircraft systems from Russia.

Syria has requested a range of anti-aircraft systems, including the SA-18, TOR-M1, S-300PMU2 and the S-400 systems.

The most likely Russian sale to Damascus is that of the SA-18, the sources said. They said Russia would supply the first SA-18 short-range systems – either directly or through a third country – within several months.

In January, Russia and Syria – overriding objections from Israel and the United States – agreed on the sale of the SA-18 to Damascus. Russian officials said the sale of the SA-18 would not violate any international arms agreement.

"Russia has cooperated with Syria for decades, and my country is convinced that Syria has a strong right to get defensive weapons," Russian ambassador in Tunisia Aleksei Tserub said.

[JewishRighter]

Answering myself, check this out:

http://www.f-16.net/f-16_forum_viewtopic-t-1931-sid-359ef4274170957f79adb00787fa500b.html

seems to be cut in total number of planes, not program.

[bill1952]

How are we countering IR?

[IAF ThunderPilot]

I was amazed with the article until I reached the following:

"This was the first engagement between Israeli and Syrian fighter-jets since the 1980s".

Sorry but thats not true. There were some later engagements, the last one occured in 2001 when two IAF F-15 shot downed two Syrian Mig-29.

This false info, together with the reason that I have never heard about that engagement, makes me believe that the story is a fake.
The source looks fishy too.

FRmail me to be added or removed from this Israel Defense Forces and Israel ping list. Here you will find news, articles and fascinating stories about the IDF and Israel.

[AppyPappy]

Flares

[IAF ThunderPilot]

P.S,
The names of the Syrian pilots that were written in the article, are the same names of the Syrian pilots who were shot downed by the two IAF's F-15s in 2001.

A super fishy story!

[Edgerunner]

Keep the pics commin'

[Optimist]

Here is a link that will let you access the pic MiG29 and F16

[Bombardier]

It might be fishy, but the Israeli AF still kicks butt! I'd be happy to have an IDFAF F-15, F-16 or Kfir fly escort for me ANY day!

Keep checkin' six, light burners, and keep 'em flying!

[Stonewall Jackson]

Either there is something fishy going on here or someone is better at telling tall tales than I am.

[papertyger]

Wow! Those same poor bastards have been doing interception for three years?

;)

[Thebaddog]

Is it really the case that nothing is as it seems coming from the Middle East?

[Tommyjo]

Blame World Tribune's dubious news sources. They claim that the info came from "The Washington-based Reform Party of Syria" I've e-mailed them with the original story that was on the web a couple of years back. Looks like one of their journalists needs to do some explaining to the editor!

[Tommyjo]

The following are images of Polish MiG-29s in Israel. The Israelis borrowed Polish MiG-29s in the late 1990's for evaluation. If you look closely on the tail you will see a patch that once had the Polish national insignia. The MiGs were returned after the evaluation process.

[Frumious Bandersnatch]

This could be true, but I should note that the Israeli pilots generally prefer using their cannon in dogfights.

[Tommyjo]

That was a long time ago with cannon kills. Think 67 and 73. With the advent of reliable all aspect AAMs the kills with cannon are rare. We are not talking practice air combat scenarios here. The last large use of cannon combat kills usage was during the Falklands war by Sea Harriers.

[Frumious Bandersnatch]

In the last Israeli-Syrian contretemps in the '80s, a surprising number of kills were done by cannon. It turns out, that even today, when engaging an enemy in a dogfight under three miles, cannon is the best. Missiles are generally best at the 7+ mile range, otherwise they have a tendency to overshoot.

[Tommyjo]

As with any research it is open to speculation. The number of confirmed missile kills exceeds gun kills in 82:

LINK

[Thebaddog]

Your story is much more plausible than the original posting. At least there is a reality filter on this site.

[Frumious Bandersnatch]

True, but an amazingly high number of kills were done with cannon. The Israeli designers originally wanted to do away with the cannon, considering it obsolete. However, the pilots insisted that it stay. Seems the pilots knew what they were talking about.

[NY Attitude]

Ah yes, a little tongue in cheek remark.