Mark Steyn: Bush will not be mocked

The Spectator (U.K.) ^ | 02/12/05 | Mark Steyn

[Gritty]

...half of Nigeria has gone from living under English common law to Sharia. What’s the tipping point? And why would, say, Belgium be any more resistant than Nigeria?

Terrific writing, but this is the one of the most pessimistic views of the strategic position of Islam than I have seen flow from Steyn's pen. His conclusion that in the long run Islam may win out over a depopulated and flaccid West - unable to muster the strength or vision to resist - may either be ultimately true or stopped only by one of the most horrendous bloodbaths in history.

[Forgiven_Sinner]

"It’s an ambitious strategy, but so far it’s working out, and at a level of casualties that any previous generation, in Britain or America, would have recognised as the lowest in history."

When we went into Iraq, I was mentally prepared for up to 10,000 casualties. At the start of the WOT, I expected it to take at least 20 years to break down all state supported terror. I also expected 1-3 more terror attacks on the US. We're way ahead of schedule, and the losses are far lower than I thought.

As far as the great European demographic debacle, vis a vis Islamic immigrants, that is completely unstable over the long term. The Europeans will not give up their countries to sharia. At some point they will either embrace Christianity or fascism and fight back. My bet is on the latter, sadly.

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

Steyn-O-Mite.....Great phrase....

[Paradox]

Wow, this is it, absolutely. The Big Picture. You either get it, or you don't. This is a keeper. One to show your reasonable democrat friends.

[speekinout]

When we went into Iraq, I was mentally prepared for up to 10,000 casualties. At the start of the WOT, I expected it to take at least 20 years to break down all state supported terror. I also expected 1-3 more terror attacks on the US. We're way ahead of schedule, and the losses are far lower than I thought.

Even at that, you were more optimistic than many. Remember that people were criticizing DoD for "only" having 10,000 body bags? And tents and plans for "only" 1,000,000 Iraqi refugees? And the scare stories about how the "Arab street" would erupt?

[hattend]

bttt

[irv]

To modify Churchill, defeat may be an orphan, but defeatism has many fathers

And here I thought the defeatists (especially in the media) were all mothers.

[Cronos]

The Shias are NOT analogous to Protestants in ANY way: Originally when Mohammed was around, he was both spiritual and temporal head, so kind of like if he was Pope + Emperor. All later Caliphs took the same dual power -- so no separation of church/mosque and state. After he died, his son-in-law Ali took over, but the Ummayyad family (another powerful family) didn't like that, so they declared war on him -- the first muslim civil war. He got killed in a mosque by the Ummayyads.

Then Hussein declared war on the Ummayyads and he lost and died in battle (his 'martyrdom') but his followers lived on to form a rival sect of Islam and they were called the Shia'at Ali or party of Ali.

[secret garden]

bttt

[sunshine state]

Bump and thanks!

[Cicero]

It depends what you mean by analogous. The Shias represent a significant split within Islam, which could be compared to the split with the Orthodox Church or the split with the Protestants. I also said that history never repeats itself; of course there are major differences.

[Ruth A.]

(though I note that in the 1995 Egyptian elections more people were killed than on Iraq’s polling day) Steyn is a walking annotation and footnote to the goings on in the world.

[Stultis]

I don't understand the Tories. Are they simply trying to be different than Blair? If Bill Clinton had taken strong action against Iraq in the mid-90s, I would have supported it.

And the Tories promised (in a speech by Iain Duncan Smith when he was still in charge) they would support Blair on the war and where ever he was in the right. "If people want me to play political games with this," he said, "I say I'm sorry I will not do it. I will not do it because (the British people's) interests matter more than the short-term interests of any single political party."

But then the Duncan Smith did start playing political games. Watching him on C-SPAN you could hardly tell him apart from Tom Daschle but for the accent:

Tories turn on leader (Iain Duncan Smith Wavers On Iraq)

Lawmakers Attack Blair Over Iraq Warning [Stop sniping, Iain Duncan Smith!]

And many more, under both Duncan Smith and Howard. So the Tories aren't only losers, they're liars and oath breakers.

[Forgiven_Sinner]

"When we went into Iraq, I was mentally prepared for up to 10,000 casualties. At the start of the WOT, I expected it to take at least 20 years to break down all state supported terror. I also expected 1-3 more terror attacks on the US. We're way ahead of schedule, and the losses are far lower than I thought. "

"Even at that, you were more optimistic than many. Remember that people were criticizing DoD for "only" having 10,000 body bags? And tents and plans for "only" 1,000,000 Iraqi refugees? And the scare stories about how the "Arab street" would erupt?"

Yes, but my assessment was worst case realistic. Those assessments were worst case political.

[Stultis]

The Big Picture. You either get it, or you don't.

Yep. I happen to have a lot of liberal or even leftist friends. (Hey, I live in a college town. What can I say.) Asked a couple months ago in a room full of these types how I thought Iraq was going I said, "although there's heart breaking tragedies there every day, at the 'big picture' level I think it's going extremely well."

The response was either "are you from Mars" looks or derisive laughter. The strange thing (well, actually typical of leftists) is that no one in this room had the intellectual curiosity to wonder, at least out loud, why my perception was so different. So I shrugged my shoulders and left them to their MSM driven delusions.

Interesting story. Much earlier, just after the war started or just before, I did let fly at the leftists at a party. I was the only pro-war person there, but that didn't bother me in the slightest. There were several very intense, nose-to-nose, spittle-flying "discussions".

Later a friend of mine was very bitter about how I had "ruined the party." Yet the woman who hosted the party called a few days later to thank me. Her children were fascinated at the spectacle of adults arguing, with real passion, issues they had heard about on television (in contrast, presumably the usual leftwing whining in harmony) and were asking for reading materials on current affairs, something they'd never done before.

[lainde]

bttt