Action Alert: Oppose H.R. 418 (national ID)

The Liberty Committee ^ | February 8, 2005 | Kent Snyder

[Tolerance Sucks Rocks]

Action Alert:  Oppose H.R. 418 (national ID)

February 8, 2005


Are the terrorists winning?  When al-Qaeda attacked the United States on September 11, 2001, they made it clear they hate America and want to terrorize us into changing America.

If they could, the terrorists would destroy the unique American way of life.  But they can't.  Only we can do that.

Tragically, too much of the legislation enacted by Congress in a knee-jerk reaction to 9/11 does al-Qaeda's job for them.  The Patriot Act took the first, disastrous step toward fundamentally changing our way of life.  Then came the homeland security bill, followed by the 9/11 intelligence reorganization bill.  And now the Real ID Act of 2005 (H.R. 418) will be voted on Thursday, February 10th.

What's wrong with H.R. 418 -- a bill we are told will stem the flow of illegal aliens through our porous borders?  For starters, it does NOTHING to stem the flow of illegal aliens.  Instead, H.R. 418 will:

1.  Establish a national ID card.
2.  Establish a federally-coordinated database of personal information on American citizens with Canada and Mexico.
3.  Use the new national ID to track American citizens when traveling outside the U.S. -- and within the U.S.
4.  Re-define "terrorism" in broad new terms that could include members of firearms rights and pro-life groups or other such groups as determined by whoever is in power at the time.
5.  Authorize the secretary of the Department of Homeland Security to unilaterally expand the information included in driver's licenses, including such biometric information as retina scans and DNA information -- and even radio frequency identification (RFID) tracking technology.  Carry a driver’s license with RFID and governmental officials will know your whereabouts 24/7.

Incredibly, H.R. 418 does nothing to solve the growing threat to national security posed by people who are already in the U.S. illegally.  Instead, H.R. 418 states what we already know: that certain people here illegally are "deportable."  But it does nothing to mandate deportation.  H.R. 418 fails miserably on this most critical issue.

The Real ID Act or Real National ID Act will impose a Soviet-style internal passport on law-abiding American citizens.  Proponents of H.R. 418 say we must "make sacrifices" like this to control our borders and fight illegal immigration.  But H.R. 418 is a Trojan horse -- it pretends to offer desperately needed border control in order to stampede Americans into sacrificing what is uniquely American:  more of our constitutionally protected liberty.  H.R. 418 does what al-Qaeda could never do without our help.

H.R. 418 does what legislation restricting firearm ownership does.  It punishes law-abiding citizens.  Criminals will ignore it.  H.R. 418 offers us a false sense of greater security at the cost of taking a gigantic step toward making America a police state.  The terrorists will have won.

Urge your U.S. representative to vote "no" on H.R. 418.  Go to http://capwiz.com/liberty/issues/alert/?alertid=6938731&type=CO

Kent Snyder
The Liberty Committee

[eno_]

I would happily meet you and call you a Nazi to your face. Name a time and place.

[eno_]

I ask for no power over others, and I want noone to have power over me.

Is that the description of a bully?

Who here is advocating greater government control, which is certain to be abused, over people?

[Conspiracy Guy]

You are a delusional paranoid twit. Did you know that the ACLU supports your paranoia? They are against the ID too. In the house mostly Democrats voted against it. Good company you keep there slick. Do all democrats like yourself share such fear of man? Being a Christian I do not fear man.

Grow up little man and come out of your cave.

[Conspiracy Guy]

Birmingham City Hall. Main entrance. Today. 11:00 am. I'll be wearing chakis and a blue golf shirt.

Please confirm.

[Conspiracy Guy]

The bully reference is in regard to your brave name calling and ranting behind your perceived safety of a keyboard. You are not as safe as you think. I can trace you if I want to. But I have no reason to because you are a coward.

[Plutarch]

The facts are that the Nation has been invaded by millions of people from another country.

I don't see how any measures can curtail the practice of illegal residence in this country without distinquishing the citizens from the illegals. An ID is how this is done.

Could someone please explain how the nation cracks down on illegal aliens without positive ID?

[eno_]

Birmingham AL? I'll let you know when I'm in town. Let me know when you are in NYC or LA.

[eno_]

See #67. There have always been ways of tracking down criminals without intruding into everyone's lives.

[unlearner]

"The best way to exercise our freedom is to monkeywrench [sic, spell check is our friend] a government goon. Make their lives miserable. Break their morale. Government is NOT our friend."

You are advocating anarchy not conservatism.

Let me tell you what the Bible says about government:

"Let everyone be subject to the higher powers. For there is NO POWER BUT OF GOD: THE POWERS THAT BE ARE ORDAINED OF GOD. Therefore, whoever resists the power, resists the ordinance of God: and they who resist shall receive to themselves damnation."

"For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the power? Do what is good, and you will have praise of the same."

"For he is a servant of God to you for good. But if you do that which is evil, be afraid; for he does not carry the sword in vain: for he is the servant of God, a revenger to execute wrath on him who does evil." (Romans 13:1-4)

Rebellion does not weaken government, it makes it more forceful. It must use more force to do the job God intended it to do. If we neglect or abuse our freedoms, we will lose them.

Do not confuse government with the office holder. Office holders can change and need to be from time to time. Further, there are limits to governmental jurisdiction. One of those involves the right to worship God according to conscience. Office holders who abuse their authority will have to answer to an angry God as well. He does not take lightly the tarnishing of His reputation by those who abuse their governmental offices.

[eno_]

I respect your opinion, but Rome had fewer bureaucrats in Jerusalem than our Leviathan puts on our shoulders.

We live in an age where government operates on its own initiative, for its own purposes. In many ways that is worse than a monarch, and less likely to respond positively to good works.

The agents of our government are occupiers. They, and their families, should be treated as such.

BTW, "monkeywrench" as a compound word is widely used, and clearer, one could argue, than a two-word verb.

[hushpad]

Its our resposibility first.


Agreed.

[unlearner]

" BTW, 'monkeywrench' as a compound word is widely used, and clearer, one could argue, than a two-word verb."

I stand corrected.

"Rome had fewer bureaucrats in Jerusalem than our Leviathan puts on our shoulders. In many ways that is worse than a monarch... The agents of our government are occupiers. They, and their families, should be treated as such."

Rome was far more abusive than our government. Roman authorities authorized the crucifixion of Christ. They had more unjust laws regarding slavery. They trampled on many human rights. Yet, the command was to submit.

This was written by a man who was wrongfully imprisoned many times. He was wrongfully beaten. And yet he said that God commands submission to authority. Rebellion against government is rebellion against God.

There are times when we must engage in civil disobedience in order to obey the dictates of conscience, but make no mistake, we must also be prepared to suffer the consequences.

Your approach would cause our government to move in the direction of fascism. I wonder if you think your philosophy would work in modern China.

A better approach would be to develop a personal political position that is pro-freedom and then run for office. Instead of complaining about how bad our politicians are, show everyone how to do it the right way.

[Conspiracy Guy]

I stay out of NYC and LA. Haven't been to either since mid 90s. Let's just call it even and move on to other battles.

Regards

CG

[eno_]

Rebellion against government is rebellion against God.

The KJV was written at a time when the Divine Right of kings was centrally important. In fact, some scholars think the whole passage was out of character for Paul. You won't find Paul elaborating on these convenient-for-some directives.

In any case, governments should get all, and only, the respect they deserve.

[eno_]

I wonder if you think your philosophy would work in modern China.

China is on a different track, and I don't know what would work in China. But I know very well the way eastern europeans dealt with government stooges.

We are somewhere between the ballot box and the ammo box. Some people think it is one or the other. I do not. I think repressive government can be removed one bureaucrat at a time, and without using bullets.

[unlearner]

"We are somewhere between the ballot box and the ammo box... I think repressive government can be removed one bureaucrat at a time, and without using bullets."

Some things call for repressive government - terrorism for example.

But as far as abuse of governmental offices, there are three ways to deal with that politically. First, use our right to vote to get good people in office and get good laws on the books. Two, support fair and equal enforcement of the law (which includes removing corrupt officials). Three, put our lives on the line to forcibly replace a failed government that cannot be reformed.

I am not ready to advocate the third, ultimate option. But we need to keep that option available by protecting gun ownership, free speech, free enterprise, property rights, and by taking advantage of these opportunities without abusing them.

"The KJV was written at a time when the Divine Right of kings was centrally important... You won't find Paul elaborating on these convenient-for-some directives."

Contrarily, this is not an issue of translation. The principle of submitting to God-ordained authority is woven throughout scripture. Paul also repeated this teaching in many other places and practiced it as well.

Paul's doctrine mentioned earlier was also taught by Peter. (See 1 Peter 2:13-17.) The Old Testament has many examples of it as well. First Samuel 15:22-23 says, "... To obey is better than sacrifice ... rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry".

God invented government and speaking evil of it is disrespectful toward Him.

[eno_]

God invented government and speaking evil of it is disrespectful toward Him.

You have gone well beyond Paul's admonition to render what is due. You have a lot of history of Christian revolutionaries to reconcile that statement with.

[unlearner]

Me: "God invented government and speaking evil of it is disrespectful toward Him."

You: "You have gone well beyond Paul's admonition to render what is due. You have a lot of history of Christian revolutionaries to reconcile that statement with."

The Bible, Acts 23:1-5,

"And Paul, earnestly beholding the council, said, 'Men and brothers, I have lived in all good conscience before God until this day.'"

"And the high priest Ananias commanded them who stood by to hit him on the mouth."

"Then Paul said to him, 'God will strike you, you whited wall [decorated grave]; for do you sit to judge me according to the law, and command me to be hit contrary to the law?'"

"And they who stood by said, 'Do you revile God's high priest?'"

"The Paul said, 'I did not know, brothers, he was the high priest: for it is written: THOU SHALT NOT SPEAK EVIL OF A RULER OF THY PEOPLE.'" (See Exodus 22:28.)

This behavior is also rebuked in Jude verses 8-11. It condemns those who "speak evil of dignitaries". It even gives the example of Michael (the archangel) who did NOT rail against the Devil (because the Devil was given authority by God). It also warns of people who claim to be believers in Jesus who follow the path of Cain, Balaam, and Core. What these three have in common is that they were all religious but had their own agenda, rather than following God's agenda.

Do not claim to be a follower of Jesus while resisting and maligning the authorities God has placed over you. Doing so will bring the judgment of God on your life.

[eno_]

Do not claim to be a follower of Jesus while resisting and maligning the authorities God has placed over you. Doing so will bring the judgment of God on your life.

Well, if your position wasn't clear already, it is now. I stand unashamed and name our government what it is: a whited sepulchre, putrid inside. Let God judge me for that, and you for your Quisling rationalizations.

[unlearner]

"Let God judge... you for your Quisling rationalizations."

You are calling me a traitor for quoting the Bible and espousing a biblical world view. You might want to rethink your position.

"I stand unashamed and name our government what it is: a whited sepulchre, putrid inside."

You are confusing the liberals with government. They are two different things. OK. The liberals are not the only guilty ones, but you need to separate the people from the office.

Your tirade maligns not just the bad politicians, but the good ones, and our FORM OF GOVERNMENT in general, and our CONSTITUTION. Attacking the GOVERNMENT is too broad. If you want to say a particular party is guilty or a particular office holder, that is different.

For example, it is not slander but simply stating the facts to say, "President Clinton is a liar", or, "Howard Dean is an abortionist", or "Ted Kennedy is a murdering lush". Well maybe I went too far with the last example, but you get the point.

Do you think ALL government is evil? I assume you recognize that government is necessary (if you are an anarchist, please correct my assumption). If you feel so strongly why not get involved in electing good officials or even run for office yourself?

Quite frankly, you will need to mature a little before making it. You need to be able to argue your positions more persuasively (it helps to start with a defensible position). And, above all, you will need to grow a thicker skin. Because for someone who can hurl strong insults, you get offended very easily. Holding office in this country requires that much. You can dish it out, but can you take it?