CONTROL OF THE FUTURE THROUGH CONTROL OF THE SCHOOLS

I think the most important factor leading us to a
secular society has been the educational factor. Our
schools may not teach Johnny to read properly, but the
fact that Johnny is in school until he is 16 tends to
lead toward the elimination of religious superstition.
The average child now acquires a high school education,
and this militates against Adam and Eve and all other
myths of alleged history.

Humanists know that the future of our country rests
with our children. Therefore, in order to control the
future of our country, they must control the minds of
our children. And the easiest way to control our
children is to control the schools.

Radical left-wing writers, including Alexander Cockburn
and James Ridgeway, incessantly rail against
parental "interference" in schools, because, as they
openly acknowledge, "The Left can't survive politically
without a public school system to spread leftist
attitudes."[3]

The future of any nation lies with its youth. So
corrupt them; since religion teaches moral virtue,
erode the churches and divert the young from religion.
Make them interested only in themselves. Get them
involved in drugs, alcohol, and sex. Get them addicted
to privileges and rights.

Vladimir Lenin's "Rule for Revolution" #1.

"Reading, writing and arithmetic" no longer figure
prominently in today's exotic public school curricula.
Children who attend public school will be compelled to
learn the following;

• that homosexuality is a perfectly acceptable
alternative lifestyle;
.....SNIP......

PART I I see that your tone has gone a little softer. I think this is a truer notion of the kind of person you are (this is a compliment). Therefore, I will try to do the same and be at least a little briefer. I think this thread has worn out its welcome so I see no need to continue it further.:)

Actually, I'm not angry - annoyed, perhaps. I don't complain about teachers in general - just in the particular :)

I have had similar feelings at times too, but I have taken it on a case-by-case basis. I know of many dedicated teachers who do a good job despite dealing with many obstacles. There are teachers who I don't get along with. In fact, I probably get along better on average with parents. But I do admire those who are trying their best and doing a good job at it--who really know what teaching is all about.

I would have to pay for everyone's schooling. While we're at it, I guess let's have our choice. I will pay only for my brother in the air force, not everyone else. I will only pay for how many times I use the highway each year, not everyone else--I need my choice. I will only pay federal taxes for projects in my own state, not anyone else's. I will only pay taxes for the 1 time I go to the zoo each year, not for everything else... We're talking welfare here, with a capital W.

I don't understand your point here. Yes, I think people should pay for their own. We did that in this country until about 1852. Same for roads. In fact even today in Texas a group is proposing a private highway to be paid for with tolls. The private sector is alive and well in all these areas. As for the military - no, defense, police, judiciary will always have to be paid for with taxes. I have no problem with that. I do have a problem with paying for other peoplealbeit my problem with other taxpayers subsidizing a personal choice like vouchers (not ones that come from private entities though--those don't use tax money) I'd rather pay for my expenses myself, as I'd rather you pay for yours yourself etc. We've spent trillions of dollars on the New Deal and Great Society, and the poor are still with us. Welfare is an incentive to use more of it - so we'll never be without the poor. My simple point was that there are all sorts of taxes that we pay for that often don't benefit us directly (at least in our perception). In fact, almost all of my taxes are that way.

No, I am not going to go into a long argument about vouchers now. I think that I have said enough. My other point is that sometimes we take the "choice" issue to an extreme--especially the liberals. I don't believe that a pro-abortion person should have a taxpayer-funded personal choice either. The choice has been made already when that person made whoopie and got pregnant. There are already other choices on what to do with the baby.

We have more choices in our society than ever before it seems. Along with that, the biggest influence (or lack of it at times) on most children are their parents. Every parent has a "choice" on how their children are educated and what they learn. It depends on effort and attitude. My mother and father didn't need a welfare subsidy for their kids--they taught us values and did things like help us with homework, limit TV (we never even had cable--we must have been "deprived"), put education as a priority in our house (no friends on weeknights), made us go to Church, had high expectations of us (my 7 siblings and I all got 3.7 or above and continued it in college too), supported us in extracurricular activities, and so on. We had no "choice" but to succeed. We were all publicly educated in somewhat "inner-city" schools. We have all gone on to lead productive lives after college too. That was definitely my mom's choice--she has said so on many occasions.

Yes, I know, I guess I will have to quit being so liberal.

I used this sarcastically. I am conservative and believe that my respect for education and teachers is too. I've met few teachers who aren't liberal. No offense intended, just an observation. Maybe so, though at my school most never really reveal their political persuasions as they are more concerned about kids, but I have met few (actually none) teachers who are the America-hating, gay-promoting, liberal indoctrinator communists that some claim all teachers are--please note this applies to my experiences with K-12 teachers, not college.

However, I don't think using CHILDREN for profit is.

This I think is where your liberal views lead you logically astray. We all make money (create value, even if non-monitarily) off interactons with each other. Doctors of all kinds make money off kids. So do drugstores, social workers (their paychecks), teachers of all types, babysitters, car companies (kids ride in cars, and buy cars when they turn 16) and on and on and on. What is the problem with that ? If you provide someone a good or a service, someone is making money whether as a direct payment or in a paycheck. As long as it's a voluntary transaction there should be no objection. Where I object is when you have no choice - such as, having to pay for 12 years of public teaching service if I don't want it. I'd have the same reaction if I had to pay for 12 years of medical services whether I wanted it or not - in this I have a choice, I can choose to be without medical insurance if I wish.

You are right, I really did not make my point clear here. I really don't have any liberal viewpoints here. I have nothing wrong with anyone making money at all. I do support good, honest profit--not those from pyramid schemes, money-launderers, and so on--in other words--money obtained illegally or when people use the mantra of getting profit no matter what the cost and no matter who(m) it hurts--more on this later.

The idea of not profiting from children is just a gut reaction to the perceived non-voluntary nature of the transaction - really thinking this thru shows the fallacy of this argument. As long as the child receives a value - a good or service - there can be no problem. I don't make fun of your story - I've met kids who were very brave in less-than-ideal circumstances not of their own making. What counts is that we all try to do the best we can and most importantly, be responsible for lessening the mess we see around us.

Part II As long as it's a voluntary transaction there should be no objection. Where I object is when you have no choice - such as, having to pay for 12 years of public teaching service if I don't want it. I'd have the same reaction if I had to pay for 12 years of medical services whether I wanted it or not - in this I have a choice, I can choose to be without medical insurance if I wish. Okay, back to profits. I make great effort to support some of the businesses in my town. My thousands of dollars spent (mostly for my job) probably do not support a full-time person, but maybe a part-timer or two.:). Again, making money is what drives our economy and supports us. What becomes a problem is when that becomes the chief aim in life for someone (e.g. when the rich man was unwilling to give up what he had to come follow the Savior or the passage about the camel going throught the eye of a needle). The other problem is when it is done dishonestly or with the attitude of "making money no matter who gets in the way" or with no regards to others. I know it's hard to understand my point here. When one makes money to provide the needs for his family, it is indeed noble. When one does so in neglect of his family (e.g. trouble distinguishing between a need and a want in some cases), then it is a different story.

Now about education--that goes back to my first viewpoint--we are not just paying for us and our families as many people think. We are paying as we do for other taxes for which we may not receive the "service." BUT everyone has benefitted from public ed in one way or another--whether it is our own kids, us ourselves, someone we know, etc. The ed-libs want to say--pay for my kid to attend a private school--many times if they can pay for it. Such is plain and simple welfare for a personal choice and puts the burden upon other taxpayers (especially ones like my wife and I) to pay the common tax.

I really do not want to go on and on about this so I won't. I think we've all had enough of this thread:).

I don't believe in PUBLIC money being used for the sole purpose of profitting from children. As for private money, that is private. I believe in keeping the two separate without the "purse strings" that sometimes come with public money. I do have problems with the sole object of using public money being to pay off stockholders or making money for the administrator of the school.

I talked to a former parent whose children I taught in first grade. He has invested in a private school for his children now. He had no idea what the curriculum was, who taught his children, what they were learning, etc. BUT he did think he was going to make a lot of money (despite two investors who had been embezzling money). It makes me wonder what my tax money would be used for. But then, they aren't required to disclose that. As for the person pulling his kids out of the public school, I did remember that they often missed up to 2 weeks at a time (in the two years I had them), that they rarely (if ever) did homework or read with the kids--if I called they did, that they were often late, that I had to do all the communicating, that they rarely came to parent/teachers' conference, etc. I busted my b--- to get his kids on grade level for reading (which they all achieved in my class) and to help them deal with some difficult circumstances. I did enjoy the contact I had with the parent, but it did bug me that he took the easy way out and blamed the teachers for any problems his kids had had.

I think there's too much whining from a lot of people nowadays--and that would apply to teachers and myself too. I almost never get my way. If I had my way right now, I would be raising a family. Fate has not been so kind, but I only can hope that someday I will get that privilege. Actually, that is what really matters to me and that is REALLY what it comes down to (along with my belief in and following the Savior). Do I sit and complain about it??? No. I have my health, a decent house, food to eat, and so on. My father and mother taught me to be thankful for the things that I have. How many times do we sit and think how lucky we are to live in our country??? How many times do we thank God for running water, toilets, heat, and the other things we take for granted?? It seems like many of us are never satisfied and want more, more, more. We should take the time to appreciate the little things in life.

I absolutely love your last statement and think that it attests to your character. That is what I have said over and over again. Instead of blaming and condemning all the teachers or complaining and whining, we should take a little time and see how we can make the situation better. That's what I decided to do--and that's why I became a teacher.

Yes, we may have a difference of opinion here, but I do appreciate your comments. I can get a little sarcastic at times, but my opinions do come from the heart. I learn a little each time from people I come into contact with and I have learned from you. I would agree with you probably on almost any other topic.

I remain committed to my students and try to do the best I can to educate them (I won't go into detail about the time I have spent or the things I do). That is what matters to me. I am sorry for taking up so much of your time. And now I bid adieu (hopefully:)

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