Police Worried About New Vest-Penetrating Gun

WNBC ^

[TXnMA]

...I wouldn't be nearly as worried about a gun that penetrates vests as I would bullets that penetrate the vest.  Guns almost never kill people.  Bullets do.

You got that right! It ain't the gun -- it's the ammo...

From this website:

The SS190 ammunition looks like scaled down 5.56mm NATO round and boosts the 2.02 gramm (31 grains) pointed steel and alluminium core bullet to the muzzle velocity of 650 meters per second (ca. 2130 fps) from the pistol barrel. The key idea behind that ammunition and weapons is to provide good penetration against personnel, protected by modern body armour, while keeping weapons' weight, dimensions and recoil at the reasonable levels.

[Cyclone59]

I'm with you on that too! Gun companies should not even make this type of firearm, but they do and they do get in the wrong hands at sometime. We have concelled carry in MO and it drives my brother crazy (he's a state trooper), says that he has to treat everyone as armed. And before any of you bust my chops as a gun conrol advocate - know this.... My version of gun control is hitting what you aim at.

[HenryLeeII]

Mr. Mojo - don't worry, this is BS. There are .22s that will penetrate a lot of vests, and many rifles will penetrate a lot of vests. Besides, there are two types of this ammo: the civilian, which fragments very easily in order to help reduce "overpenetration;" and the LEO/military version which is available only on department letterhead. You won't be finding the latter version on the street in the wrong hands.

[The Electrician]

This would be devastating," said Chief Robert Troy, of the Jersey City Police Department.

. . .

"This does not belong in the civilian population. The only thing that comes out of this is profits for the company and dead police officers," Troy said. "I would like the federal government to ban these rounds to the civilian public."

Ignore for the moment the obvious point that he appears to think that these rounds would be just peachy keen for police officers to use. Should this really be one of his top priorities? Doesn't he have more pressing criminal justice needs to attend to? After all, just today four people were found murdered (throats slit) in Jersey City. Last that I've heard, though, no reported fatalities in Jersey City were ascribed to either this gun or its rounds. (yeah, I can already anticipate the rejoinder that Chief Troy wants to keep it that way - but that is a slippery slope that, well, you know where it leads)

[AdamSelene235]

Generally such word circulates long before police are aware of it, but I'm sure it's a good strategy to let them know you're afraid of it.

Yep, after the first anti-gunner vest hysteria session, head shots on officiers went UP.

Prior to this, it wasnt widely known that cops wore vests.

Thanks guys.

[ko_kyi]

OK, so an armor-piercing round will penetrate body armor. Uh, won't almost any armor-piercing round of any caliber do so? And aren't such rounds illegal for civilians to own?

[hiredhand]

Ya know...the muzzle flash in your pic brings up a curious subject.

I read that during the design and engineering of the Colt AR series rifle, that the gas system (which I loathe) was engineered to operate with a 20" bbl, so long as the gas port to the tube was a "certain" diameter, and so long as the gas tube itself was a "certain" diameter, and a "certain" length.

Anyway....The conclusion was that unless the components of the gas system were altered along with a reduction (or increase for that matter) of barrell length, that problems due to heat and pressure could result.

Somebody was telling me at work (and I did NOT verify this) that the failure rate of the M4 (AR-15 carbine) is much, much higher than those rifles having 20" barrells, and that the precision rifles having target (bull) have a very low failure rate.

I'm amazed that the AR is as reliable as it is (which isn't saying much) given that there is a complete path from the gas port, STRAIGHT into the upper receiver! No gas piston...just hot air and propellant residue blowing right into the bolt, and out the vents on the side. SHEESH!

I better quit here or I'll start to rant. :-)

[Brilliant]

This gun is very similar to several other guns that are already on the market, except that it was designed for the specific purpose of penetrating bulletproof vests. If you want a gun like this one, buy one of the others. You don't need a gun that is designed to penetrate a bulletproof vest--unless you're a cop or a criminal.

And the fact that you can hold a criminal responsible for his actions doesn't impress me. That doesn't bring a dead cop back to life.

[melbell]

Isn't the easiest way to breach a bullet-proof vest just to aim for the head?

They aren't concerned about law enforcement officers having a head though...go figure

[Gefreiter]

What about that S&W .50 revolver with the 4" barrel?

Too big AND too small!

[Daus]

Looks like Santa Claus is really mad at his reindeer....

How did you think he got reindeer to fly? :)

[blogbat]

I would be more worried about this getting into the hands of terrorists in Iraq.

[HenryLeeII]

The pistol is available to civilians now, for about $800 and up. Its the souped-up LEO/military ammo that is not available. The civilian ammo is about $18 per 50-round box.
But, for about $150 or less, you can get a Czech Tokarev that has as much penetrating power.

[Mr. Mojo]

Mr. Mojo - don't worry, this is BS.

Believe me, I know ;)

[Servant of the 9]

Everything I've been told gripes that the FN Five Seven is underpowered.
I'm not a pistol man, so I don't know.
But that is what I've read.

If they want to scare themselves to death, wait till they find out about the Casull CA3800.

It's already been out over a year.

So9

[Redcloak]

You don't need a gun that is designed to penetrate a bulletproof vest

Which part of the 2nd Amendment says that?

[Arkie2]

LOL!

[45Auto]

What I'd like is a *revolver* that shoots my .223 ammo

The problem with shooting high pressure rounds in revolvers is that the latter have the barrel-cylinder gap; high pressure gas and powder residues act just like sand blasting and cause excessive and premature top strap erosion. Its why Ruger only offered the .357 Maximum Blackhawk for a short time. These revolvers suffered greatly from this erosion.

[JoeSixPack1]

Black Widow .17 cal armor piercing.

http://www.naaminis.com/news12.html

[calex59]

The key to this article are the use of the words "armor piercing bullet. All armor piercing bullets are already outlawed.

Ok, now here is the real deal for you guys who think this is a bad thing. Any bullet from any gun can kill any police officer on any day, even if they are wearing a vest. The most vulnerable part of their body is exposed all the time, their head. shoot someone in the head with a .22 short and you will put them down. Kneecap them with any .38 and you will put them down. vests are not a gaurentee that the cops won't get killed. Yes it saves some lives, but it is not infallibel. If it was our guys in Iraq would not be in danger.

Also, criminals do not buy their guns and ammunition in a store. They get them on the black market. Ban this gun and it will still turn up on the street in the hands of criminals if they think it is any use to them. Ciminals don't obey the law. This might come as a surprise to some of you, but most of us here on FR should already know this. They will steal them if they have to, buy them on the black market or modify other firearms to do the same job. Gun bans do not work and it has been proven over and over, the libs simply do not want to admit it. They have an agenda, that is to disarm us all so we can be controlled easier.