Man charged with murder after pregnant woman's fetus dies

San Diego Trib. ^ | 12/27/04

[KidGlock]

Man charged with murder after pregnant woman's fetus dies

1:06 p.m. December 26, 2004

SAN JOSE – A man who was arrested for assaulting his pregnant girlfriend was being held on a murder charge Sunday following the death of the fetus the woman was carrying, police said.

The 25-year-old woman was 18 weeks pregnant when the male fetus was delivered dead Saturday, said San Jose Police Sgt. Steve Dixon. She was hospitalized early Saturday after she told police that her boyfriend, Clifford Beane Watkins, allegedly choked her and kicked her in the stomach at a local motel, he said.

Dixon did not know if the assault sent the unidentified woman into premature labor, caused a miscarriage or required doctors to induce labor. An autopsy will be conducted to determine why the fetus died, he said.

"We think the cause of death is going to be the kick to the stomach, so that is why we booked (Watkins) for murder," Dixon said.

Watkins, 44, was being held without bail in the Santa Clara County Jail.

[shibumi]

PING!

Another example of just what will give the baby killers fits! The baby is human if attacked by its father, but non-human if attacked by its own mother and a "doctor". Note that the article mentions "cause of death", an admission the the baby was alive.

[Texan5]

Fetus, fetus, fetus-what problem do these reporters have with the word "baby"? But I'm glad they arrested the sorry SOB of a boyfriend for killing the BABY...

[Grut]

Another example of just what will give the baby killers fits!

Only if you believe in logic. But since most people really believe in 'having your cake and eating it too', this'll be seen as 'empowering women' when attacked, just as access to abortion 'empowers' them in another context.

[Smokin' Joe]

Yep. If he had been an MD with a shop-vac, he'd be sending her a bill.

[shibumi]

My natural bent toward logical optimism did not see that at first, but you're probably right. Sometimes it's difficult for me to think the way they do.

[Texan5]

The irony is sad, isn't it? As if the unborn baby exists solely as an advantage for the mother-if it is perceived as a disadvantage, it can be disposed of with callous disregard.

[R. Scott]

How long before the unborn are included in the population count for the census? Will child abuse include anything that might possible harm the unborn?

[NewHampshireDuo]

Remember, an 18 week old (or any other age) fetus is only a piece of protoplasm. But, also remember that a fish does have feelings and should not be harmed. (/sarcasm)

[TheRobb7]

You guys are SO right. They call it a fetus because to do otherwise would be admitting it's human.

Where's is the ACLU in this? Why aren't they jumping to this man's defense? Wouldn't they have an 'airtight' case?

They could argue: "If it's not human (a baby), how can you be arrested for murder?"

If it doesn't fit, you must acquit..(Massive sarcasm)

[rdb3]

Lady and gentlemen, please follow my logic here if you will.

If this man is charged with murder for killing an unborn baby, would it not be beneficial for the pro-life side to argue that this man should be set free? Sounds ludicrous, I know, but hear me out.

The argument should be this: Whereas a pregnant woman can conspire with her doctor to murder an unborn child, or "terminate" her pregnancy, why can't the man who sired the unborn do the same thing if he doesn't want the child? If it is legal for the woman to decide, wouldn't it be a violation of the XIV Amendment (Equal Protection) to prosecute the would-be father for ending a pregnancy?

This is absurd. But why not be absurd to demonstrate quite clearly the absurdity of abortion laws?

[Smokin' Joe]

Whereas a pregnant woman can conspire with her doctor to murder an unborn child, or "terminate" her pregnancy, why can't the man who sired the unborn do the same thing if he doesn't want the child? If it is legal for the woman to decide, wouldn't it be a violation of the XIV Amendment (Equal Protection) to prosecute the would-be father for ending a pregnancy?

Nope. If the "lump of tissue" logic is applied to a fetus, he would have no more right to remove it forcibly (or have it removed) than he would have to remove a wart from her without her consent, assuming he gave her the papilloma virus.

Her body, not his choice.

The only way to defeat abortion is to call it what it is: the taking of a human life.

As it stands, that can only be done by a doctor with the woman's consent, which is, IMO, one scenario too many.

[imskylark]

I saw a program on tv many years ago that had a woman who's baby was lost while pregnant because her boyfriend assaulted her. There were no laws to punish the man so she sought help from a women's group. (It might have been NOW or something similar) They threw their support behind the man.

[monday]

"Fetus, fetus, fetus-what problem do these reporters have with the word "baby"? "

The difference between a fetus and a baby is that babies are old enough to survive on their own outside the womb. Fetuses typically are not. I don't think they have an aversion against using the word baby. It just isn't technically correct when referring to a fetus.

[monday]

"You guys are SO right. They call it a fetus because to do otherwise would be admitting it's human."

Thats absurd. A human fetus is just as human as a human baby.

[monday]

"As it stands, that can only be done by a doctor with the woman's consent, which is, IMO, one scenario too many."

Exactly. It boggles the mind that rdb3 would argue for more.

[unlearner]

"It just isn't technically correct when referring to a fetus."

Wrong. Fetus is a clinical term. It is "technically correct", but why be so technical?

I'll tell you why. Because serial killers have detached emotions toward their victims.

MSM is complicit in the killing of millions of babies.

You are using nomenclature as a ruse for the real issue. We are discussing an individual human life.

It is ALSO correct to refer to an unborn baby as a "child", hence the term "with child". This has been commonly used in English for many centuries to refer to pregnancy.

[bedolido]

you can't have it both ways...

if the woman says it should live it's murder if killed. If she says it should die... it's a choice.

[monday]

"MSM is complicit in the killing of millions of babies. "

Right...... You know, many other people would complain if the MSM used baby and fetus interchangeably.

The only people who use "with child" instead of "pregnant" are those for whom proper language usage in reference to all things sexual is icky or whatever. They also make up code names for male and female reproductive organs etc. They are silly people.

I don't understand why would you prefer the MSM use terms that are not accurate when discussing babies and fetuses? A human fetus is just as human as a human baby. I suspect you are trying to blame abortion on the media when the real blame lies with feminists.

[farmfriend]

I agree. I think it will come down to that eventually.