ZOT!
Posted on 12/01/2004 6:04:00 PM PST by OklaRancher
I belong to a Methodist Church in a rural area with a small congretion of 30 or so. This past Sunday the Pastor started his sermon by saying how much good the Bush tax cut could have done if it had been used to alleviate poverty.
It was only my tired sense of humer, RW - a play on his tagline. I guess I should take a day off.
Forgive my typo - "humor".
Excuse me, but I do. The Nashville Center for Peace and Justice is a far left anti-American, organization that is supported by the US Communist Party AND the UMC.
Your church may buck the trend, and praise God that you do, but if your church sends money to the national UMC, national organization has endorsed homosexual pastors, homosexual marriage, government programs for the needy and a whole whost of other left wing issues.
Second thoughts about this comment. You are being disingeneous to yourself. On the one hand you want to compare to the status of the "poor" to the wealthiest people in the world but on the other hand refuse to consider their status to either the worlds poor or the average people in the world.
Whenever anyone uses this statement you have immediately won the argument. Simply ask them if they wish their ability to apply logic and reason to be based on that statement. If they say no, then scold them for arguing with a statement they won't stand behind. If they say yes, point out that the gap between the rich and poor always grows larger, logic and reason dictate it.
Take the case of the poor person making $15,000 per year and the rich fella making $2 million. The gap between them is $1,985,000. If the poor person making $15,000 per year doubles his income (100% increase)it grows to $30,000. If the millionaire increases his by 4%, it grows to $2,080,000. The gap between them has grown to $2,050,000. The gap between them has grown by $65,000 even though the poor person has increased his income by a rate 25 times greater than the rich person
Now, what is the logic that the minister would like to apply? The poor person isn't better off having twice the income? The rich person is evil for having increased his income by barely more than the inflation rate? Even if the millionaires income had increased by only 2%, less than the rate of inflation, the gap between them would still have grown by $10,000. The use of the "growing gap between rich and poor" as the basis for an argument is totally devoid of logic.
Make people defend their logic based on hard math and their argument will fall apart.
ZOT!
Your premises is all out of wack. What am I talking about? The way you ask the following question, "is the Bush tax cut good for the poor?" First you are assuming that its the government's money. Its not! All government does is take from the producers, and redistributes money for votes to remain in power. The Bush tax cuts simply allows people to keep more of their money they earned. Wow isn't that generous by our government! Not! Nevertheless, the short simple answer to that is yes. By allowing tax payers to keep more of the money. The better it is for the economy. That in turn is better for the poor for getting a job. Just ask your Preacher this? What is a better way to help a poor person. To make them dependent on government to take care of them, or to get them a job so they can provide for their selves. When someone is truly independent then their own confidence goes up. Its a win win for everyone.
Uhmm.... That isn't from the Bible. It's a paraphrase of a Chinese proverb from Confucius.
That was my first thought as well. Some ISPs allow a user to have multiple email addresses, so it would be a simple matter of stocking up on accounts then burning them off one at a time.
ZOT
I hope I am not totally uninformed here...
Obviously, you are correct in that had workers invested the same money they would reap much better returns. That, however, is not point of comparison. Some today are drawing far beyond what the wisest investment would ever return while others do not live that long. No, there is no free lunch because one must contribute into Social Security. It is not a math question but a social question.
Glad I get to be king for a day! First thing I'd do is understand how families have become successful economically in America and how families move from poverty to success that makes them more self-reliant and independent. Then, I'd ask people far smarter than myself if there is a way we can help to replicate this for the working poor of this generation.
At any rate...that is where I'd start.
Those were some of the first people who were covered. Most of them are dead or near death. The poor today are being robbed because of their shorter life spans while the wealthy are wasting there investment on a bad deal. This is not a program that helps the poor more than it hurts them.
Perhaps I could express myself more clearly. From where I stand, families in or close to poverty look at how they are doing by asking if they are making progress, that is, are they moving ahead, struggling more, or doing about the same. They also look at how others in similiar situations to themselves are doing. This is not having it one way only, as I think you imply.
Don't you think that process is happening for the most part or do you think most of the poor today will be poor 5 years from now ?
And they do this by comparing themselves to Donald Trump ? Because that is what you are doing.
Do me a favor and ask your pastor what the new slogan of the Methodist church means. "Open Hearts, open minds." I get the open hearts but just what do they mean by open minds???
Go Away, lefty!
bump for excellent responses, anyway.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.