Posted on 11/13/2004 6:05:41 AM PST by cpforlife.org
Dear badmrbunny,
Hmm... I don't remember saying that. Thanks for putting words in my mouth. I guess that is what you're reduced to, in terms of debating tactics.
sitetest
The betrayal of perceived friends hurts more deeply than the expected hostility of known enemies.
This is the note I sent to all of the Republicans on the judiciary committed:
If you permit Arlen Spectre to chair the judiciary committe,
I am one of MILLIONS of Christians who will take it as a betrayal of everything we thought we were working for when we supported your party.
I can assure you -- if that happens, MILLIONS of us will either sit out the next elections, or give our votes to third or fourth parties.
It's not the open virulence of Democrats that hurts the most, BUT SUAVE BETRAYAL BY PERCEIVED FRIENDS.
Spectre today = loss of presidency, house, and senate by 2008. I can promise you that.
At one moment in time you were an infant, incapable of supporting or feeding yourself. You were reliant upon the protection and nurturing of someone else. Just an infant. Was it OK to kill you then? Why is it OK to kill a "fetus" or even an "embryo"? One day you will be an "invalid" or "terminal" or some other dehumanizing name for an elderly person incapable of supporting or possibly even feeding yourself. You may be reliant upon the protection and nurturing of someone else. Would it be OK to kill you then?
An embryo, a fetus, an infant, a toddler, a child - all are just titles for stages of human development. If you kill the human at infant stage, there is no more human - she is dead. If you kill him as a fetus, no human is born - he is dead. If you kill an embryo, you've still killed a human being - she will not progress to become a fetus, and infant, a child, an adult. You've denied her a chance to live and grow.
If you extract DNA from an embryo and analyze it does it appear to be monkey or cow DNA? No, it is human DNA. The embryo is a human being. At a very, very early stage in the development of that human being - well before most abortions are performed - the heart starts to beat and the brain starts to function. The exchange of oxygenated blood and nutrients takes place (albeit through the umbilical cord). He or she even moves independently. These are the very definitions of life and we've determined that the life is human. You can't deny that aborting a child is the taking of a human life no matter what de-humanizing euphemisms and rationalizations you attempt to use.
"When you're given the choice between quick euthanasia and extended torture ending in death, let's see you pick the latter."
Many heros, many Saints HAVE chosen the latter.
"The betrayal of perceived friends hurts more deeply than the expected hostility of known enemies."
Well said!
In fact the congress has had the authority to ride herd over these traitorous judged all along. One can only conclude they tacitly approve of the courts direction, while they safely hide their true aspirations behind those awful court decisions. All the while wringing their hands in agony over those awful judges, claiming their hands are tied.
It will continue until we the people become informed of our true heritage, but that is not likely. Check out the History book in your local Middle School, or High School. George Washington rates a single paragraph, Maya Angelou rates 6 pages.
Double dittos on that!
The churches did a good job in lining out the stark choices is the last election; and Christians and others informed by the Judeo-Christian patrimony made a difference.
We need to see some payback for that; otherwise, I do believe what the original post predicts will come to pass.
Well, ast least we agree on something.
Actually, while I agree with CPforLife's sentiment, I disagree with his tactics. Threatening the Republican Party will gain nothing. His tone defeated much of his argument. I was about to post something to him about that when I saw your posts and felt compelled to respond.
As for the volume on the rhetoric and trying to win some liberals to our side, he didn't post his message in a liberal site or on a news site - he posted it on a conservative web site. He wasn't trying to win liberals to the cause.
bttt
"Ok, so when the sperm hits the egg, that is the crossover point into being just as valuable and worthy of protection as a 2 month old or 20 year old?"
Yes - that is the point that a brand new, genetically complete human being is conceived. No other human being has the right to kill it.
Once we propose a right to kill the innocent, we forego our own humanity. We become no different in kind from the Bin Laden's and Al-Zarqawi's of this world - from that point it is just a matter of degree.
Dear Skywalk,
No, actually, you were never a sperm, nor an unfertilized ovum. Either that, or you were both an unfertilized ovum AND a sperm - in which case, you were two separate and distinct entities at the same time.
No, your unique individuality came into being, who you are, the start of your existence, when a sperm fertilized and ovum.
As to comparing "value" between one human being and another, I don't play that game. "All men are created equal..."
All individual human beings enjoy the same endowment of natural rights.
sitetest
sitetest
To read later.
At what point do you believe that abortion should be restricted?
On 9/11, God let us see in one hour what His omniscient eyes see happening in secret every day in American -- the slaughter of 3,000+ innocents.
And that is not opinion. It is a scientific fact.
The crux of the argument revolves around a recognition of Who is ultimately in charge, God or man. The Founding Fathers, to a man, all knew the correct answer to that.
The woe of the modern age is that men have forgotten God.
If you don't want to be pregnant keep your pants on, it's not a hard concept. It is the contraceptive mentality that regards pregnancy as a disease in need of a cure and the absolute right to promiscuity without consequences as sacrosanct.
There will be fewer "unwanted pregancies" if there are consequences for one's actions, as the article I posted makes clear. I encourage Christian charity to those that make mistakes, not to serial murderers.Charity is not always a handout, it is a spiritual work of mercy to rebuke the sinner.
Suppose an ObGyn aborts a fetus in an operation designed to save the mothers life. Do we bring him up on charges of murder and let a court decide his guilt or innocence?
First of all this is extremely rare, less than 1/2 of 1% of all abortions in the US have anything to do with the health of the mother.
There is a moral solution to this tho - it's called the law of double effect. The direct killing of an innocent is always and everywhere forbidden, however if you have a situation where the pregnancy would endanger the life of the mother (ectopic or similiar) removing the child intact is permitted, as an indirect consequence the child will die.
Maybe we just leave everything to nature as god intended it, and returning to a 10% death rate for pregnant women will be ok.
I don't know where you get your fabricated statistics but you have got it half right, leave everything to nature as God intended it.
While I would encourage all to choose life, rather than abortion, I fail to see the wisdom of forcing anyone..
Just as prohibition did not work for alcohol, prohibition will not work for abortion.
People will do what they feel is right for them, whether it is against the law or not.
And I will not force a victim of rape or incest (which is almost always,also rape) to go through 9 months of forced torture simply for the sake of the child. (especially in the case of incest, where often the mother is still a child herself )
The only true answer is a broad socially conscious change in attitude toward, and responsibility for the creation of life.
One way of doing that is to stop being so publicly "understanding" of people who choose to abort.
We must stress the importance of life without threat, but still refusing to condone it as a correct choice.
We must make people understand that abortion, simply for "convenience" is an immoral, despicable, sinful choice.
And we must hammer that into the skulls of everyone we meet, whenever the subject arises..
When enough people change the way they think about the unborn, and begin to respect the promise of new life, and then take responsibility for bringing it into this world, and protecting and raising it to adulthood, there will be no need for laws against abortion.
It just won't happen very often..
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