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When Vietnam vets came home (Soldiers being spit on is just an urban myth)
News and Observer ^ | Nov 10, 2004 | JOHN LLEWELLYN

Posted on 11/10/2004 3:35:05 PM PST by mykdsmom

WINSTON-SALEM -- Last week voters went to the polls to select a vision for the future. Now Americans must find a way forward together. This week, as we honor service and sacrifice on Veterans Day, an image from this political season must be put to rest.

The presidential campaign featured the resurgence of a myth from the early 1990s. That myth is that soldiers returning from Vietnam were spit upon by citizens or war protesters. That claim has been used to turn honest differences of opinion about the war into toxic indictments.

As a scholar of urban legends I am usually involved with accounts of vanishing hitchhikers and involuntary kidney donors. These stories are folklore that harmlessly reveals the public imagination. However, accounts of citizens spitting on returning soldiers -- any nation's soldiers -- are not harmless stories. These tales evoke an emotional firestorm.

I have studied urban legends for nearly 20 years and have been certified as an expert on the subject in the federal courts. Nonetheless, it dawned on me only recently that the spitting story was a rumor that has grown into an urban legend. I never wanted to believe the story but I was afraid to investigate it for fear that it could be true.

Why could I not identify this fiction sooner? The power of the story and the passion of its advocates offer a powerful alchemy of guilt and fear -- emotions not associated with clearheadedness.

Labeling the spitting story an urban legend does not mean that something of this sort did not happen to someone somewhere. You cannot prove the negative -- that something never happened. However, most accounts of spitting emerged in the mid-1980s only after a newspaper columnist asked his readers who were Vietnam vets if they had been spit upon after the war (an odd and leading question to ask a decade after the war's end). The framing of the question seemed to beg for an affirmative answer.

• • •

In 1998 sociologist and Vietnam veteran Jerry Lembcke published "The Spitting Image: Myth, Media and the Legacy of Viet Nam." He recounts a study of 495 news stories on returning veterans published from 1965 to 1971. That study shows only a handful (32) of instances were presented as in any way antagonistic to the soldiers. There were no instances of spitting on soldiers; what spitting was reported was done by citizens expressing displeasure with protesters.

Opinion polls of the time show no animosity between soldiers and opponents of the war. Only 3 percent of returning soldiers recounted any unfriendly experiences upon their return.

So records from that era offer no support for the spitting stories. Lembcke's research does show that similar spitting rumors arose in Germany after World War I and in France after its Indochina war. One of the persistent markers of urban legends is the re-emergence of certain themes across time and space.

There is also a common-sense method for debunking this urban legend. One frequent test is the story's plausibility: how likely is it that the incident could have happened as described? Do we really believe that a "dirty hippie" would spit upon a fit and trained soldier? If such a confrontation had occurred, would that combat-hardened soldier have just ignored the insult? Would there not be pictures, arrest reports, a trial record or a coroner's report after such an event? Years of research have produced no such records.

Lembcke underscores the enduring significance of the spitting story for this Veterans Day. He observes that as a society we are what we remember. The meaning of Vietnam and any other war is not static but is created through the stories we tell one another. To reinforce the principle that policy disagreements are not personal vendettas we must put this story to rest.

Our first step forward is to recognize that we are not a society that disrespects the sacrifices of our servicemembers. We should ignore anyone who tries to tell us otherwise. Whatever our aspirations for America, those hopes must begin with a clear awareness of who we are not.

(John Llewellyn is an associate professor of communication at Wake Forest University.)


TOPICS: Culture/Society; US: North Carolina
KEYWORDS: academiccesspool; dorkofwakeforest; hanoijohnnyacademic; idioteducator; incivility; leftspeak; liberalcollege; myth; politicalcorrectness; spit; spitspeaksvolumes; vietnamveterans; whaledungexpert
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To: mykdsmom
After reading the posts (through 198)I realized how many FReepers were/are vets or veterans' family members. THANK YOU EACH AND EVERY ONE FOR YOUR SERVICE AND/OR SUPPORT FOR THE SERVICE OF LOVED ONES.
201 posted on 11/10/2004 7:31:46 PM PST by zip ((Remember: pingDimocRat lies told often enough became truth to 42% of Americans))
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To: Chieftain; 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub; kellynla; 68 grunt
In VN, most of the Vietnamese were nice, some weren't so nice, some were VC. Arriving back in the world, glad to be coming home, stepping off the Freedom Bird, we were briefed to report quickly to our processing centers. We were told to not react to protesters.

Before I'd left for overseas, waiting in an airport bar, someone I'd never met bought me a beer and wished me well. When I returned after 2 yrs & 4 mos, I found a few were nice, most were indifferent or not very nice and some were F***ing vicious nuts.

LLewellyn, the writer of the article above, hasn't a clue.

Chieftain, kellynla, and 68 grunt:

HAPPY BIRTHDAY UNITED STATES MARINE CORPS

202 posted on 11/10/2004 7:33:39 PM PST by BIGLOOK (I once opposed keelhauling but have recently come to my senses.)
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To: 68 grunt
We say "What goes TDY stays TDY"......I still love my Marines. I think they are quite a pretty bunch.......their uniforms fit well........if I do say so myself. I was an onsite Medic for some reserve Marines........interesting......then from Mar-Jul I got to bring home the Wounded Warriors. Their stories were sad and some where funny......for example did you know that when you hit a cow with a rocket it blows up like a video game? I really miss not being in the loop right now, but I will get my chance again.
203 posted on 11/10/2004 7:35:10 PM PST by marmar (Faith is a beautiful thing.....)
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To: marmar
I've been married to a Marine for 27 years and I thank the Good Lord every day for having blessed my life with such a man!!!


204 posted on 11/10/2004 7:36:27 PM PST by Zacs Mom ("In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Jefferson)
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To: mykdsmom
Only 3 percent of returning soldiers recounted any unfriendly experiences upon their return.

Even if true, it's three precent too many.

205 posted on 11/10/2004 7:37:05 PM PST by Fzob (Why does this tag line keep showing up?)
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To: MistyCA
I guess I was a mere country bumpkin. Around here, our guys came home to love and respect. I never saw any anger at our servicemen.

I did see a demonstration on Boston Common but they were weirdo hippies against the war itself.

206 posted on 11/10/2004 7:37:13 PM PST by Lady Jag (YAHOOO!!! W2!!!)
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To: MistyCA

This is a total load of crap, don't you think?


207 posted on 11/10/2004 7:37:27 PM PST by Howlin (I love the smell of mandate in the morning.)
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To: Zacs Mom
I know they are out there.......I have just seen the other side of the coin. They still fascinate me.
208 posted on 11/10/2004 7:37:47 PM PST by marmar (Faith is a beautiful thing.....)
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To: marmar
It used to be, I'm not sure if it still is, that the Marine Corps had tailors custom fit each Marine's uniform. Trouble was, they took the measurements at the beginning of bootcamp, and by the end, when you got to wear the uniform, your body had changed, radically.

Thanks for your kind words, and the work you do.

209 posted on 11/10/2004 7:39:04 PM PST by 68 grunt (3/1 India, 3rd, 68-69, 0311)
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To: 68 grunt

Your welcome and I am not complaining about the fit.....


210 posted on 11/10/2004 7:40:11 PM PST by marmar (Faith is a beautiful thing.....)
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To: BIGLOOK

OoohRah and Semper Fi


211 posted on 11/10/2004 7:40:17 PM PST by 68 grunt (3/1 India, 3rd, 68-69, 0311)
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To: Zacs Mom
We can never thank you enough for you and your Marine's service to this country. Bless you.


212 posted on 11/10/2004 7:43:35 PM PST by Lady Jag (YAHOOO!!! W2!!!)
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To: Freepdonia

'Twerent a myth my friend. It actually happened.


213 posted on 11/10/2004 7:44:37 PM PST by sport
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To: MistyCA

Not a Vietnam Vet, but I did get spit on and labelled a killer of babies, amongst other things, while wearing the uniform in the early-mid seventies. No myth, all fact. Every Vietnam Vet I've ever served with has a story similar or worse. This was a universally accepted practice by the general population of youth and young "adults" at the time. Another sorry attempt to revise history to meet a leftist agenda.


214 posted on 11/10/2004 7:45:23 PM PST by TADSLOS (Right Wing Infidel since 1954)
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To: PeterPrinciple

"Certified as an expert on the subject in the federal
courts"
___What stupid organization certifies stuff like
that?
--- My thought exactly. This is the kind of guy
who always includes the "PhD" after his name,
as if to say "None dare refute me!" ( As if there aren't tens of millions of PhDs foisting their expertise
everywhere)


215 posted on 11/10/2004 7:46:47 PM PST by willyboyishere
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To: MistyCA; All

I noticed you'd been absent. Good to see you back.

As far as the "myth" crap, what of the guy who was attacked at the Toby Keith concert about a month ago?


216 posted on 11/10/2004 7:47:36 PM PST by JoJo Gunn (More than two lawyers in any Country constitutes a terrorist organization. ©)
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To: marmar; 68 grunt
"I wasn't part of the story just an observer."

Hummm.....were you there that night that..........uh, well, maybe it's better to let sleeping dogs lie.

Not that you were one of the dogs, mind you!
My buddies had all of them occupied!
I'm glad it was dark.........and we were over-indulged in alcohol.

217 posted on 11/10/2004 7:48:13 PM PST by TexasCowboy (Texan by birth, citizen of Jesusland by the Grace of God)
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To: All
This isn't a spitting story, but I have a friend who was in Vietnam during the war.

He said when his tour of duty was over, he and others were flown to California. When he got off the plane, there was no fanfare, etc. There was one guy waiting there to greet them - Jimmy Stewart. He came out to meet them by himself, on his own.

He said it was probably his fondest memory of that time.

218 posted on 11/10/2004 7:49:05 PM PST by Mannaggia l'America
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To: mykdsmom
Dear Mr. Llewellyn. You are wrong. Many people who served during that time were treated in a hostile behavior. As a person in your position would have no idea of what happened during that period,many of my fellow servicemen were subjected to harsh treatment. Had I faced these morons, I would have reacted in a negative way.
219 posted on 11/10/2004 7:49:52 PM PST by ditto h
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To: andy58-in-nh

Republican offices were shot at? Really? I didn't see that story on CBS. 20 years from now it will be as widely known as it is now.


220 posted on 11/10/2004 7:51:50 PM PST by jwalburg (Those buried included children still clutching toys)
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