It's Official - The South Won the Civil War!

11-3-04 | Always Right

[Always Right]

My history books said the south lost the Civil War, but apparently that was just a battle. The south lost the battle of 1861-1865, but now are winning the war.

Excuse the map, I could not find one that had all the states colored in.

[AndyJackson]

the address not only proclaimed ideals of freedom but stressed the importance of preserving the union even if it meant using force of arms against its citizens, Jiang said.

To this you commented "Well he got that wrong."

But that is exactly what the Gettysburg address states. Historians debate whether Lincoln was right or wrong, but no one has ever seriously doubted where where Abraham Lincoln stood on the issue of preserving the union by force of arms.

[Non-Sequitur]

Julia oftened wanted her husband to whip her slaves but Grant refused.

And Robert Lee whipped his, too.

[Non-Sequitur]

But that is exactly what the Gettysburg address states. Historians debate whether Lincoln was right or wrong, but no one has ever seriously doubted where where Abraham Lincoln stood on the issue of preserving the union by force of arms.

Lincoln spoke of the need to preserve the Union, but nowhere in the speech does he promote war as the way of accomplishing that.

[Non-Sequitur]

A lady who's not ashamed of being intelligent, honest, well informed, and classy.

Where?

[Gianni]

Nor us, my friend.

Amen.

[Non-Sequitur]

Show me where "Lee whipped his too"

"My name is Wesley Norris; I was born a slave on the plantation of George Parke Custis; after the death of Mr. Custis, Gen. Lee, who had been made executor of the estate, assumed control of the slaves, in number about seventy; it was the general impression among the slaves of Mr. Custis that on his death they should be forever free; in fact this statement had been made to them by Mr. C. years before; at his death we were informed by Gen. Lee that by the conditions of the will we must remain slaves for five years; I remained with Gen. Lee for about seventeen months, when my sister Mary, a cousin of ours, and I determined to run away, which we did in the year 1859; we had already reached Westminster, in Maryland, on our way to the North, when we were apprehended and thrown into prison, and Gen. Lee notified of our arrest; we remained in prison fifteen days, when we were sent back to Arlington; we were immediately taken before Gen. Lee, who demanded the reason why we ran away; we frankly told him that we considered ourselves free; he then told us he would teach us a lesson we never would forget; he then ordered us to the barn, where, in his presence, we were tied firmly to posts by a Mr. Gwin, our overseer, who was ordered by Gen. Lee to strip us to the waist and give us fifty lashes each, excepting my sister, who received but twenty; we were accordingly stripped to the skin by the overseer, who, however, had sufficient humanity to decline whipping us; accordingly Dick Williams, a county constable, was called in, who gave us the number of lashes ordered; Gen. Lee, in the meantime, stood by, and frequently enjoined Williams to 'lay it on well,' an injunction which he did not fail to heed; not satisfied with simply lacerating our naked flesh, Gen. Lee then ordered the overseer to thoroughly wash our backs with brine, which was done. After this my cousin and myself were sent to Hanover." Documented here.

Now, your documentation that Mrs. Grant demanded that her husband whip her father's slaves?

[Gianni]

[Gianni] The free men to whom they referred were not former slaves.

[cmurphy] Give me a break! The Republicans only issue when they started was to end slavery. And at the time, there was still slavery, so it's not talking about former slaves, but those who were slaves at the time.

Take all the breaks you want. The freesoilers intentions were not pure as the driven snow as you've implied. Slavery was to be ended for their benefit, that free white labor in the West would never need compete.

[Gianni]

Lincoln spoke of the need to preserve the Union, but nowhere in the speech does he promote war as the way of accomplishing that.

I've seen stories about the clean-up effort at Gettysburg in preparation for the arrival of the president. The stench of the dead supposedly hung heavy during the address. The entire speech was framed by the thousands dead, and given in their honor. If he felt that war was not justified, then the Gettysburg address is the greatest insult of all time.

[AndyJackson]

nowhere in the speech does he promote war as the way of accomplishing that.

Well let us look for a couple of clues - like where was the address given and on what occasion. What does last full measure mean? If there is a spark left up there somewhere you will get the idea and maybe able to take it forward. SHEEESSSH.

[GOPcapitalist]

Documented here.

...the "here" being www.templeofdemocracy.com, aka the home site of Ed Sebesta, a radical homosexual activist from Dallas who circulates conspiracy theories about GOP politicians belonging to secret "hate groups" and who seems to believe that the confederacy is the root cause of "homophobia" in America.

Put another way, Sebesta comes from the lunatic fringe of the south-hating leftist wacko movement and simply is not a credible source for a document that curiously doesn't appear elsewhere on the internet. For a time IIRC Sebesta was claiming that this letter was taken from Nolan's "Lee Considered," a vehemently critical biography of Lee that almost certainly would have included it if it were credible. Yet it is not there and now he's claiming another book, which very well could be apocryphal or non-existant. In short, non-seq, you've reached a low point in source material for even your wretched ilk. Quoting a nutcase like Sebesta is less credible that quoting Morris Dees or Pacifica Radio.

[BykrBayb]

You are so educated on American History, and the Civil War in particular. That's what makes you far superior to those hicks down south. They actually think Gettysburg was the site of a battle. They think the Gettysburg Address had something to do with that battle, and the war, and usurping states' rights to self governance and independence through force. Why don't you explain it to them?

[BykrBayb]

Obviously not in your family tree. I pity you.

[BykrBayb]

The boy's dumb as a stump.

[GOPcapitalist]

Check out non-seq's #407. He just inadvertantly revealed the source of all the garbage he posts - www.templeofdemocracy.com.

templeofdemocracy is the "home page" of Ed Sebesta - a left wing nutcase that Pacifica socialist radio uses as their "expert source" on south bashing. His politics are somewhere to the left of marx and his credibility is virtually nonexistant, yet along comes non-seq to quote him!

[BykrBayb]

I'm still cracking up over his Gettysburg statement. His whole scenerio is more like something Carol Burnett would have done in one of her skits. I know Tim Conway's short, but he would have to play Lincoln. As the rest of the cast is hiding the war dead behind trees and bushes, Tim Conway's the only one who could put the right feeling into Lincoln's big line. "War? What war?"

[AndyJackson]

The boy's dumb as a stump.

Wher'r you from? Such pithy common sense observations don't come from any of the blue places, I'll warrant you that. Its the whole problem with liberals. They are all dumb as stumps, so dumb they think there smart, but they couldn't pour used beer out of a boot.

[BykrBayb]

I got my common sense in Florida and Georgia. I got in-depth training on the stupidity of liberals in New Jersey.

[cmurphy]

The boy's dumb as a stump.

Why not try to argue your point without all the personal attacks.

[cmurphy]

BykrBayb,

Below are several quotes from your posts. They all appear to be personal attacks. Several of us here obviously disagree and that’s fine; however, we are not enemies and don’t need to act like we are. Let’s keep arguments at the level of ideas and facts, not on the level of accusations and name calling.

The boy's dumb as a stump.

I think capitan_kerryfagio has been operating under his bigoted assumption that Southerners are stupid. The more you prove him wrong, the tighter he will cling to his ignorance. He seems to have a death-grip on it now.

Anyone raised in the South would be unlikely to be stupid enough to ask that question. Now, would you please quit hounding me about own ignorance? It's not my fault you're stupid! Sheesh!!!

Get a load of this boob! How long since you've seen anyone this stupid?

I don't have to be ignorant, obnoxious, bigoted, dishonest and insulting as you are to know what you're saying.

Oops. I gave you credit for too much intelligence.

Have you stopped beating your wife?

You're not the brightest crayon in the box, are you? I don't know why you're trying to impress me with all your claims of accomplishment. I wouldn't be impressed even if your claims were true. You're a braggart and a liar. I'm not impressed.

I don't bother trying to teach them. They're incapable of learning.

Accepting the liberal agenda as proof that the truth is actually Southern myth is what makes you a liberal.

Deceptive people such as yourself usually don't last long here, though there are some exceptions.

Liars and liberals are not welcome here. If you intend to stay, you'll have to cover your lies and liberalism better than that.

It's not my fault that you quote the liberal agenda. Why do you insist on blaming me for your failings? Could it be that you really are... well... you know.

I see from your post that the lies are so deeply imbedded in your soul, you will probably never open your eyes to the truth.

I know I should stop. I know I should allow him to cling to his ignorance, as it's probably the only comfort he knows.

You can't even admit the truth that you're posting from a bastian of liberalism. How can anyone expect you to accept any other facts? If you have no facts to share, and reading the facts is too nauseating for you, go back to pushing your "small marketing/advertising firm" at DU.

Your problem obviously goes beyond ignorance for having been lied to. You must know the lies you were spoonfed while growing up are lies, but instead of accepting the truth, you try to snare everyone else into believing the lies. There are many events that Grant never mentioned. That doesn't prove they didn't occur. Your arguments are just too hollow to take seriously.

It's not my fault that the truth doesn't mesh with the fantasy taught to you by some liberal "teacher." You should be angry about being lied to, not about finally being told the truth.

If you're incapable of reading your own reply, I'm not sure it would do any good for me to repeat it.

Hello newbie. I find it amusing that you're sick of the whole North/South thing before you've even managed to learn anything about it. Must be the result of a liberal yankee education. I'm one of those Republicans living in the North, and I can attest to the fact that I'm surrounded by liberals like you.

You must be one of those poorly educated yankees who thinks all Southerners are pro-slavery and there was never a slave owner north of the Mason-Dixon Line.