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Posted on 10/12/2004 8:58:00 PM PDT by nwctwx
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Somehow I don't think Osama's attack is going to be a power outage in Chicago.
11/1 is the date I'm worried about.
My first (but not last, I'm sure) post on this thread to say, "I agree...that was my initial reaction as well."
Disclaimer: Please excuse typos in subsequent posts. I just spilled coffee in my keyboard and I'm sure I'll be having fun trying to type on sticky keys in an hour or so.
Same here - A three day countdown?
I just heard Shep on Fox News mention that today is the 75th anniversary of Black Tuesday - The start of America's Great Depression.
I think the Imam makeover is significant (do you think the guy's from queer eye for the straight guy have visited?) There's no way this video isn't a prelude to an attack. Monday is my best guess.
He doesn't want an America where Kerry is in charge any more than an America where Bush is. He wants a third world America.
Soooo; I've done what alot of other people I've seen have seem to have done and/or suggested. I've stocked up on as many days worth of food and water as I can afford; bought some plastic film & duct tape, topped-off all my vehicles with fuel, have stocked up with ammo for my firearms and have a supply of iodide pills.........
Now I'm sitting here pondering on what I might be using my ammo for? Past terrorist actions don't seem to have been anything I could protect my family or self from with a gun and a box of ammo. Hmmm... if a 747 full of jet-fuel is spiraling down atop of me; I wonder how many blasts from my 9mm will take to stop it? What if they were to utilize a dirty-nuke or even a conventional explosive? By the time it happened; I would have never have had the time to even get to my gun. It would be all over by that time.
Hmmmmm....... Well; if a terrorist is going to do something; I would suppose they will have planted some devastating device and would be long gone; or, have martyred themselves and be dead anyway. So; what good is my kittle personal arsenol to do?
I'm not trying to be synical or anti-patriotic by any means; but, just really trying to understand other's perspectives....... Just wondering if anyone else has "pondered" an "after the fact" scenerio?
Would we then be using our guns & ammo to ward off a starving/dehydrated neighbor from begging a half a cup of water; or, will we be using our guns & ammo to shoot some wild game for our own survival?
He is right...but not in the way he implies ...We must protect ourselves...but with firearms rather than votes.The american Jihadi is much less believeable ..typical jihadi bluster...like EOM and his endless empty threats.These people,at least those in this country have the impression that,if apprehended,they will be in the merciful pc hands of the legal system rather than those of us who like them less than they like us.They may be right but perhaps not.
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/apelection_story.asp?category=1131&slug=Cheney%20Threat
Friday, October 29, 2004 · Last updated 9:57 p.m. PT
"Man charged with threatening Cheney"
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
GRAND RAPIDS, Mich. ARTICLE SNIPPET: "In the 911 phone call, the 51-year-old Shoup said, "I've turned my van into a bomb and I am going to crash it into the Capitol Centre and try to kill Cheney," according to a criminal complaint filed in U.S. District Court in Grand Rapids. The Capital Centre in Dimondale is where Cheney spoke.
Police tracked down Shoup at a park in Grand Rapids where they found in his van a propane gas tank, a full 5-gallon gasoline tank and three empty metallic trash cans.
Before making the 911 call, Shoup dropped off at Grand Rapids station WOOD-TV a videotape and letters that explained his plan, Chiara said."
Plan on stocking up enough to be able to offer some charitable help. You're firearms are necessary when the nature of the interaction changes from a plea for a little help into the intent to kill you to take anything you may have. Shooting some wild game is a plausible use. Plan on sharing the fruits of such hunting with your neighbors...you probably won't have refrigeration available to keep it for long. A little barter can go a long way to making life more comfortable. Will you have to become an active member of the unorganized militia to protect your country? Time will tell.
Grammar goes down the tubes when I'm tired.
Note: The following text is an exact quote:
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http://www.usdoj.gov/opa/pr/2004/October/04_crm_726.htm
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
THURSDAY, OCTOBER 28, 2004
WWW.USDOJ.GOV
CRM
(202) 514-2007
TDD (202) 514-1888
NINETEEN INDIVIDUALS INDICTED IN INTERNET CARDING CONSPIRACY
Shadowcrew Organization Called One-Stop Online Marketplace For Identity Theft
WASHINGTON, D.C. - Attorney General John Ashcroft, Assistant Attorney General Christopher A. Wray of the Criminal Division, U.S. Attorney Christopher Christie of the District of New Jersey and United States Secret Service Director W. Ralph Basham today announced the indictment of 19 individuals who are alleged to have founded, moderated and operated www.shadowcrew.com - one of the largest illegal online centers for trafficking in stolen identity information and documents, as well as stolen credit and debit card numbers.
The 62-count indictment, returned by a federal grand jury in Newark, New Jersey today, alleges that the 19 individuals from across the United States and in several foreign countries conspired with others to operate Shadowcrew, a website with approximately 4,000 members that was dedicated to facilitating malicious computer hacking and the dissemination of stolen credit card, debit card and bank account numbers and counterfeit identification documents, such as drivers licenses, passports and Social Security cards. The indictment alleges a conspiracy to commit activity often referred to as carding - the use of account numbers and counterfeit identity documents to complete identity theft and defraud banks and retailers.
The indictment is a result of a year-long investigation undertaken by the United States Secret Service, working in cooperation with the U.S. Attorneys Office for the District of New Jersey, the Computer Crime and Intellectual Property Section of the Criminal Division of the Department of Justice, and other U.S. Attorneys offices and law enforcement agencies. The undercover investigation led to the arrests of 21 individuals in the United States on criminal complaints earlier this week. Additionally, several individuals were arrested in foreign countries in coordination with the domestic arrests.
The indictment charges that the administrators, moderators, vendors and others involved with Shadowcrew conspired to provide stolen credit card numbers and identity documents through the Shadowcrew marketplace. The account numbers and other items were allegedly sold by approved vendors who had been granted permission to sell by operators and moderators of the Shadowcrew site after completing a review process. Shadowcrew members allegedly trafficked in at least 1.7 million stolen credit card numbers and caused total losses in excess of $4 million dollars. Victims of carding can include banks and credit card companies, which often suffer significant financial losses due to fraud, as well as individuals whose identities and credit histories are damaged by such identity theft.
Identity theft carries a heavy price, both in the damage to individuals whose identities are stolen and the enormous cost to America's businesses, said Attorney General Ashcroft. This indictment strikes at the heart of an organization that is alleged to have served as a one-stop marketplace for identity theft. The Department of Justice is committed to taking on those who deal in identity theft or fraud, whether they act online or off.
Identity theft by organized groups like Shadowcrew is a particularly insidious crime, said Assistant Attorney General Wray. Victims have their identities stolen and their credit ratings ruined. Identity theft defrauds banks and businesses of millions of dollars every year, endangering economic security and undermining consumer confidence. As todays indictment and the recent arrests in the Shadowcrew case demonstrate, the Department will use every available law enforcement tool to protect victims from this kind of criminal activity and to seek punishment for those responsible, wherever they are.
These individuals operated a virtual trading post for stolen identity and financial information, U.S. Attorney Christie said. They were international in their reach and we are pleased to say they are out of business. We look forward to hunting down and prosecuting more operators like them to spare consumers the nightmare of identify theft.
Information is the world's new currency, said Secret Service Director W. Ralph Basham. These suspects targeted the personal and financial information of ordinary citizens as well as the confidential and proprietary information of companies engaged in e-commerce.
The indictment alleges that Andrew Mantovani of Scottsdale, Arizona, David Appleyard of Linwood, New Jersey, and Anatoly Tyukanov of Moscow, Russia, conspired together and served as the administrators of the Shadowcrew website, controlled the direction of the organization, determined which individuals would be permitted to become members and moderators, and were responsible for the administration, maintenance and security of the servers upon which Shadowcrew was hosted. The indictment alleges that these individuals were responsible for creating and fostering the overall Shadowcrew marketplace.
The indictment further alleges that other Shadowcrew members, including Jeremy Stephens of Charlotte, North Carolina; Brandon L. Monchamp of Scottsdale, Arizona; Omar Dhanani of Fountain Valley, California; and Marcelo Del Mazo of Buenos Aires, Argentina conspired together, served as moderators for the website, and controlled the posting of information relating to credit card and identity theft.
Several of the individuals named above and additional members of Shadowcrew who were charged in the indictment are further alleged to have advertised and sold stolen credit card numbers, counterfeit identification documents and other merchandise, and to have provided the results of testing of illegal products offered by vendors on the Shadowcrew site.
The indictment charges one count of conspiracy encompassing numerous administrators, moderators and vendors on the Shadowcrew website. The other 61 counts of the indictment charge various members of the Shadowcrew organization with crimes including unlawful trafficking in stolen credit card numbers and other access devices, unlawful transfer of identification documents to facilitate unlawful conduct, transferring false identification documents and unauthorized solicitation to offer access devices. The charges carry penalties, upon conviction, ranging from three to 15 years in prison.
Members of the public are reminded that the indictment contains only charges. A defendant is presumed innocent of the charges, and it will be the governments burden to prove a defendants guilt beyond a reasonable doubt at trial.
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04-726
Ditto.
Note: The following text is an exact quote:
===
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http://www.usdoj.gov/opa/pr/2004/October/04_crm_724.htm
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
THURSDAY, OCTOBER 28, 2004
WWW.USDOJ.GOV
CRM
(202) 514-2008
TDD (202) 514-1888
SECOND FARC TERRORIST INDICTED FOR 2003 GRENADE ATTACK
ON AMERICANS IN COLOMBIA
WASHINGTON, D.C. - Attorney General John Ashcroft, Assistant Attorney General Christopher A. Wray of the Criminal Division and U.S. Attorney Kenneth L. Wainstein of the District of Columbia today announced that a second member of the Colombian terrorist group FARC (Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia) has been indicted on charges of attempted murder and use of weapons of mass destruction for a November 2003 grenade attack aimed at Americans in Colombia.
The eight-count superseding indictment, returned by a federal grand jury in Washington, D.C., yesterday, charges defendant Adolfo Toledo Medina and a previously indicted defendant, Arturo Montaño Torres, with conspiring in 2003 to murder U.S. nationals who were working in Bogota, Colombia. Count One charges Montaño and Toledo with conspiracy to commit murder of U.S. nationals, in violation of 18 USC Sections 2332(b)(2) and 1111(a). Counts Two through Six charge Montaño and Toledo with attempted murder of U.S. nationals, in violation of 18 USC Section 2332(b)(1). Counts Seven and Eight charge Montaño and Toledo with use of a weapon of mass destruction - a grenade - against U.S. nationals, in violation of 18 USC Sections 2332(a)(1) and (2).
Specifically, the indictment unsealed today charges Montaño and Toledo with the Nov. 15, 2003 grenade attacks at the Bogota Beer Company and Palos De Moguer - two dining establishments in a popular Bogota entertainment and shopping district known as the Zona Rosa. The grenade blasts killed a Colombian woman and injured 73 others, including five Americans.
Montaño was apprehended immediately after the attack by Colombian police - with the help of a local security guard - and he is currently in Colombian custody. Toledo was arrested on Oct. 15, 2004 by Colombian authorities and is also in Colombian custody.
The superseding indictment alleges that the grenade attacks were in retaliation against Americans for the killing of Teofilo Forrero Mobile Column (TFMC) commander Edgar Gustavo Navaro Morales, a/k/a El Mocho, by the Colombian army in October 2003. The TFMC, of which Montaño and Toledo are allegedly members, is responsible for specialized FARC operations in designated geographical areas of Colombia.
The indictment alleges that Montaño and Toledo, selected by unindicted conspirators in the FARC to travel to Bogota to attack and kill U.S. nationals, were provided grenades, other weapons, money and training in the weeks prior to the attacks on the restaurants in Zona Rosa. The indictment further alleges that Montaño and Toledo and others conducted surveillance on restaurants in the two days prior to the attacks. Montaño and Toledo allegedly threw or caused to be thrown a grenade onto an outdoor table at the Bogota Beer Company, killing Colombian national Paola Martinez and injuring dozens of others, including four Americans, and allegedly threw - or caused to be thrown - a grenade into the dining area of Palos De Moguer, where another American was sitting.
The FARC is an armed and violent organization that has been strongly anti-American since its inception in 1966, and has targeted American citizens who work in, visit or do business in Colombia. The group, which was designated a foreign terrorist organization by the Secretary of State in October 1997 and most recently in October 2003, engages in terrorist activity including murder, hostage taking and violent destruction of property.
The investigation of this case is being conducted by the Federal Bureau of Investigation, working with the U.S. Attorneys Office for the District of Columbia and the Counterterrorism Section of the Criminal Division of the Department of Justice.
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04-724
It sure likes a Russian suspect included in that group to me, too.
http://www.townhall.com/columnists/kathleenparker/kp20041029.shtml
"In praise of lizard brains"
Kathleen Parker
October 29, 2004
No, I haven't had the Yahoo e-mail, it is more than likely
an attempt to get your private info.
I have had the "are you a real person", when I forwarded a
lot of stuff, one after the other. that is to stop the spam, you have to read something that I can't even see
part of the time.
I always have trouble opening the box, since they upgraded,
but have figured out that if they play the "please retype the password", if you click the "sign in as a different
user" button, and do the sign in, it will go right on through.
For some of the OBL photos, that no one has the room for,
why not use the Yahoo mailboxes to store them in?
100MB of free space.
Thought...Is Arafat as sick as they say he is or is something big getting ready to happen and they want him out of there so Israel can't wipe him out in retaliation for something?
Guys - doesn't the recent video fall outside of the expected sequence of events that have been predicted here? (The UBL video was expected AFTER the next attack, wasn't it?)
I'm also curious on how much of the video wasn't shown by Al Jazeera. I've heard they showed about 1 minute of it, and that the whole tape was either 5 or 18 minutes.
Also - did you guys notice the demeanor difference in GWB and Kerry today in their responses? Kerry seemed full of bravado and confidence, while Dubya had what - a two sentence comment on how we "won't be intimidated by enemies of America". I got the impression George was either: a) not prepared for a comment at that time but forced into one by circumstances, or b) very concerned about what was on the other 4/17 minutes and didn't want to make an overly strong statement if he had knowledge of what might be coming at us from AQ in the next week or two.
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