Posted on 09/12/2004 7:59:43 PM PDT by knak
For some Republicans it is the perfect political storm: a Senate vote on a constitutional amendment to protect the U.S. flag that would put Democratic presidential nominee John F. Kerry, running mate John Edwards and Minority Leader Thomas A. Daschle on the spot just a few weeks before the Nov. 2 elections.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...
I think people should get paid for beating flag burners!
you dont retire a flag in a corwd for 1000 people people in the middle of the street during a protest... I'm sure a crafty lawyer could word it correctly. Flag can be burned only to "retire" an old flag, a flag can not be burned in conjunction with a rally or protest.
You are absolutely correct! I have been against this kind of protection of the flag since the 1960's. The flag is a symbol and nothing more. I feel this way, and believe me, I'm more conservative than Ron and Nancy.
I wrote the following in 1968 when I was 14 years old (it's dumb, but you'll get the point):
Why can't I burn my flag?
I paid for it, didn't I?
And what if it's "just my bag"?
There's another one to buy.
But when it's done I'm held libel,
And thrown in a rocky pit,
But when I burned my Bible,
No one gave a sh*t.
No of course not when done properly..Even though I do find it hard to watch when I have to retire a flag! My post was directed towards the anti-american acid flashback 60s wannabes doing the unthinkable against a country who's brave men and women fought and died for their freedom and to see the disgrace the flag in this way makes me sick. I even have a problem when I see a flag touching the ground or a flag flying at night without a light on it!!!
Admirable sentiments, but the first amendment stands. Think about the days when President Clinton took daily bashing here on FR. He represented the country as our president. Yet we were free to criticize, lampoon, burn in effigy, and otherwise berate him. To some Americans, the office of the Presidency is just as important as the flag. Yet both your right to criticize the president and someone else's right to burn the flag (albeit not yours, or a publicly owned one) is protected. If you harm someone who is burning the flag, you are violating his first amendment rights. I would expect the police to arrest you.
I had some degree of admiration for a FReeper I once encountered who said he had gone to jail because of a similar case, and he had taken his punishment with his head held high. But he knew he had broken the law.
Put a "health care for seniors" rider on it. That'll make 'em implodeLOL! Assuming of course that they're not already imploding. :'D
George W. Bush will win reelection by a margin of at least ten per cent.
So what's the crowd limit and setting restrictions for a flag retiring then? No such regulations as you describe exist in the U.S. flag code.
I'm sure a crafty lawyer could word it correctly.
And a craftier lawyer will find a loophole in the wording. For my own part, I think the bulk of our problems are caused by lawyers, not solved by them.
Flag can be burned only to "retire" an old flag, a flag can not be burned in conjunction with a rally or protest.
Then we're not outlawing an action, we're outlawing an attitude. That's what the Left has been doing with their ridiculous "hate speech" laws. Do you really want to walk down the Left's path for this cause? I know I don't.
That said, I will risk jail to beat the hell out of any who tries to burn one around me
We are in total agreement!
I have no love for those jerks either. I think they're narrow-minded, egotistical, gimme-brat punks who need to get their butts kicked so hard that they won't be able to sit down for a month of Sundays.
All the same, I am leery of any law that seeks to outlaw not an action, but an attitude. We've already seen the fallout from the idiotic "hate speech" laws that the Leftists have put on the books. I would just as soon not see Conservatives sign on for laws that are identical in principle and application.
I don't think burning the flag should be illegal--after all, it IS a free country. I instead propose a law that anyone convicted of burning the flag, having shown their contempt for this country, have their citizenship withdrawn and be deported to France. That way, they can complain about the USA all they want without threat of consequences.
MOM? That you?
bttt - I wish more freepers had your "attitude" because with it, and its fire, we would always be free to express our love of country and spite toward its enemies without fear of censorship. As John Milton argued in Areopagitica, let ideas fall where they may. The marketplace will decide if they are valid or a waste of our time. Those who burn the flag will face our wrath in the currency of disrespect, mistrust, and ostracism. In the long run, those are far more painful than a blow to the ears or a stomp on the toes.
As a Scout leader, I've taught kids how to show proper respect for the flag. I certainly understand wanting to protect our flag, but disagree with any amendment to ban free speech. As a veteran, I served to protect the flag, and the Bill of Rights.
Nevertheless, I'm delighted the Amendment will be brought up before the election. Nobody loses my vote by being too patriotic, and I'm interested in seeing how others will try to weasel out of addressing the issue.
Don't think so.
What Zell said was it is the soldier who gives the right to protest and the right to ABUSE that protest by burning the flag.
He in no way indicated or said he supported burning the flag.
Desecrating our flag is very much like desecrating our Constitution. It's a way of dishonoring the men who've died for their freedom, not freedom to show betrayal against our country, but all of the freedoms we have from supporting our country. . Flag desecrators should be punished. And many who call themselves supporters of the Constitution are nothing of the kind. They lie about our Constitution in efforts to keep us from exercising our Constitional rights to return to some of the intentions of our founders and to usher us into social anarchy. They wish to weaken our country.
Attributed to Father Dennis Edward O'Brien“It is the soldier, not the reporter, Who has given us freedom of the press. It is the soldier, not the poet, Who has given us freedom of speech. It is the soldier, not the campus organizer, Who has given us the freedom to demonstrate. It is the soldier, Who salutes the flag, Who serves beneath the flag, And whose coffin is draped by the flag, Who allows the protester to burn the flag.”
I see your point...but....we're already restrained so much as it is [2nd Amendment usurped, taxation, immigration, licenses required, etc ad infinitum ad nauseum], outlawing flag burning just goes along w/ the marxist-lite government we already have doesn't it? So why not outlaw it?
*hypocrisy alert*
I've been in the middle of battalions of fighting men who unanimously cheered for legislative efforts to punish those who desecrate the Flag. As there are a few Viet Nam vets who would like to shut down all US defense, I'm sure that there are few other REMFs who want to figuratively spit on the graves of soldiers who died for their freedom.
But most fighting soldiers by far--especially those before 1965 and after 1985--want to make Flag desecration illegal.
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