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Evolution's 'Dictatorship' -- Student Struggles to Get Opposite Viewpoint Heard
AgapePress ^ | 16 August 2004 | Ed Vitagliano

Posted on 08/16/2004 9:40:47 AM PDT by PatrickHenry

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To: balrog666
The odds of what (exactly) and as formed how (again as described as precisely as possible)? How can anyone compute the odds of an unknown event?

Do you honestly expect me to believe that, in the past 40 years, no one published any reliable work on probability of evolution because it is "too difficult"?
501 posted on 08/17/2004 5:39:10 PM PDT by bluejay
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To: balrog666

He sent only one, His only begotten Son. Jesus fulfilled the Law and the Prophets, doing all that the Father, the prophets, and He said that He would do. There were no others.


502 posted on 08/17/2004 5:39:34 PM PDT by D Edmund Joaquin
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To: D Edmund Joaquin

I choose not to comment on prophecies that have supposedly come to fruition at the right time, when they have happened in the past.

Because I can say just about anything I want, I can put in a book that The shuttle will be destroyed and make it look like a prophecy from the past, and make all the conditions of that prophecy look like I called them out before the event, and it just happened to happen at the right time.

But, you take it on faith that someone did not do that to the book of Jeremiah, you take it on faith, that God indeed told him about the future and the circumstances relating to Jesus' coming.


503 posted on 08/17/2004 5:41:41 PM PDT by Jaguar1942
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To: Right Wing Professor

bmp


504 posted on 08/17/2004 5:42:08 PM PDT by shield (The Greatest Scientific Discoveries of the Century Reveal God!!!! by Dr. H. Ross, Astrophysicist)
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To: Junior; general_re; Jaguar1942; balrog666

This is my last post on this topic - I need to get some work done today. Thanks every one and good night.


505 posted on 08/17/2004 5:42:34 PM PDT by bluejay
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To: bluejay
Do you honestly expect me to believe that, in the past 40 years, no one published any reliable work on probability of evolution because it is "too difficult"?

Duh. How many people have pointed that out to you so far? Of course "evolution" covers a broad range - do you mean to cover early procaryotes, eucaryotes, amphibians, reptiles, marsupials, mammals, humans? Are you including abiogenesis? The Big Bang? Everything?

506 posted on 08/17/2004 5:44:16 PM PDT by balrog666 (A public service post.)
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To: Jaguar1942
I have no idea which hypothesis on abiogenesis is correct, or if the ones that exist are correct at all.

But you are saying abiogenesis is what happened without knowing which theory about it is correct?

I am most willing to say though, that abiogenesis will not have the statement "god did it" anywhere within it, when and if it is ever fully developed

I can certainly believe that, at least for a couple of generations or so.
507 posted on 08/17/2004 5:45:36 PM PDT by microgood
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To: D Edmund Joaquin
He sent only one, His only begotten Son. Jesus fulfilled the Law and the Prophets, doing all that the Father, the prophets, and He said that He would do. There were no others.

Other religions disagree with your specific interpretation.

508 posted on 08/17/2004 5:45:42 PM PDT by balrog666 (A public service post.)
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To: Jaguar1942

Well you can ask the Jews when they first received the book. I don't believe any of them will say they rewrote it to coincide with Jesus' coming.


509 posted on 08/17/2004 5:48:43 PM PDT by D Edmund Joaquin
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To: balrog666

Some other religions actually agree that Jesus was the Christ, and that salvation is of the Jews. If you are talking of Baal religions, and of all other man-made religions, their being not from God, of course they disagree.


510 posted on 08/17/2004 5:51:55 PM PDT by D Edmund Joaquin
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To: bluejay

Yes, I know of him, as well as others.....

The bible should not be questioned is the basic tenet of many fundamentalist Christian groups, it is to be taken literally in all aspects, which I find a little ridiculous, but that's me.

The literalist cannot handle scientific dealving into these questions, because it will take their literalism and turn it on it's head, and in the process hurt their faith in their bible.

Others do not take the book as literally, and take it as it relates to them, and what they need to know, they need something, they open the book and God relates to them directly through the bible what they need at that specific point in their lives, to them, the bible is a book of God's stories that he uses to relate directly with us on a personal level.

The first have real problems with science, the second have no problems with science, because it cannot question the bible directly because the bible was never meant to be literal in any sense of the word.

It all depends on how you look at the bible, is it a personal gate to your own personal relationship with God, or is it a book telling you how to live every aspect of your life?

With literalists, science and religion are not compatible, with the other, science and religion are one and the same thing. It's thier own personal journey in which God is leading them.

Have I straightened that out?


511 posted on 08/17/2004 5:52:26 PM PDT by Jaguar1942
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To: microgood
But you are saying abiogenesis is what happened without knowing which theory about it is correct?

If you have physical, testable evidence that God did it, please present it. Understand, however, that "God did it" is not the default position. Any claims of Divine Intervention will have to meet the same standards of evidence as any other claim.

512 posted on 08/17/2004 5:54:06 PM PDT by Junior (FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC)
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To: Jaguar1942
BUT, evolution is not a religion, and by calling someone who understands evolution, an evolutionist, is basically putting them on the same level as a creationist, and the 2 are totally incompatible.

Did not mean to offend. So I should call you a person that believes in evolutionary theory or what? BTW, that same level talk almost sounds derogatory. But since I am not a creationist, I do not take offense.

Evolution is science, based on facts and conclusions based upon those given facts.

That depends on what part of evolutionary theory you are talking about. There are no facts behind either abiogenesis or speciation, and a lot of facts behind microevolution, which I consider to be very good science.
513 posted on 08/17/2004 5:55:14 PM PDT by microgood
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To: D Edmund Joaquin
...and of all other man-made religions...

Others would claim they were the one-true-religion and that yours was "man-made."

514 posted on 08/17/2004 5:56:43 PM PDT by Junior (FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC)
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To: microgood

Yes, scientifically I can say that Abiogenesis happened, otherwise we would not be here.

The answer is a positive, something happened.

For me personally, I can say that God did it, without any trouble at all, but I also realize that it's not science, nor scientific.

Nor will I argue with science when it finally does come to a conclusion, because science is based on facts, and my religion is based on faith. So science can explain it, but God could still have done it to my mind.

Because it is my faith we are talking about, not science.

There is a difference, the problem is that a lot of you are unable to separate the 2.


515 posted on 08/17/2004 5:59:16 PM PDT by Jaguar1942
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To: Jaguar1942

Who made this placemarker?


516 posted on 08/17/2004 6:02:28 PM PDT by PatrickHenry (If I never respond to you, maybe it's because I think you're an idiot.)
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To: Junior
If you have physical, testable evidence that God did it, please present it. Understand, however, that "God did it" is not the default position.

I certainly do not have evidence to present. But does there have to be a default position of abiogenesis given the lack of theories to support that position? Or can there still be scientific inquiry into other possibilities?
517 posted on 08/17/2004 6:02:50 PM PDT by microgood
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To: PatrickHenry
Who made this placemarker?

And what is it made of?

518 posted on 08/17/2004 6:05:22 PM PDT by Ichneumon ("...she might as well have been a space alien." - Bill Clinton, on Hillary, "My Life", p. 182)
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To: PatrickHenry

And would Barney Frank like it? ().()


519 posted on 08/17/2004 6:08:45 PM PDT by Jaguar1942
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To: microgood

Scientists can enquire into whatever directions they desire. Nothing is stopping anyone from testing for the Almighty's hand in the origins of life. How would you go about setting up such a test?


520 posted on 08/17/2004 6:08:54 PM PDT by Junior (FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC)
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