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I am a swing voter

Posted on 08/12/2004 12:05:29 AM PDT by Lepidopteran

I am a swing voter, neither Republican nor Democrat. I supported President Bush in his response to September 11 and I supported the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. But I like John Kerry's message about the need to do something about the people in this country who have no health insurance. It's a hard choice.


TOPICS: Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: alsharptoniniraq; deadnewbieposting; drugs; hardchoice; mobyisthatyou; standorgetonknees; swingvote; zot; zotbait
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To: OrthodoxPresbyterian

the (slight mis)quote of Marcus Aurelius is a good place to start, but I like Cicero better: "Cui bono?"


421 posted on 08/12/2004 11:13:10 AM PDT by King Prout ("Thou has been found guilty and convicted of malum zambonifactum most foul... REPENT!)
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To: OrthodoxPresbyterian

and, btw - that is an excellent post.


422 posted on 08/12/2004 11:16:00 AM PDT by King Prout ("Thou has been found guilty and convicted of malum zambonifactum most foul... REPENT!)
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To: Watery Tart; BamaAndy; John Stuart Mill; Descartes; socrates; aynrandfreak; Yellow Rose of Texas; ..
I like it.

But if we're going to tackle this from a Utilitarian perspective, where is that John Stuart Mill quote THAT EVERY SINGLE PERSON HAS ON THEIR PROFILE PAGE?(!)

Just curious is all.

423 posted on 08/12/2004 11:21:26 AM PDT by The Scourge of Yazid ("Sit Ubu. Sit. "(Woof!) "Good dog. ")
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To: Remington Rebel

"If you're seriously thinking about who to vote for based not on the good of the country but your own pocketbook, you should probably vote for kerry"

you think Kerry taxing us death would be good for our wallets how?



I was being sarcastic to this obvious Kerry voter.


424 posted on 08/12/2004 11:30:04 AM PDT by Darkwolf377
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To: Darkwolf377; sarcasm; Xenalyte
Obvious sarcasm:

Oh, that leisure suit looks great on you!

(Rolls eyes. Snickers under breath.)

425 posted on 08/12/2004 11:36:39 AM PDT by The Scourge of Yazid ("Sit Ubu. Sit. "(Woof!) "Good dog. ")
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To: The Raven

"Did the Post Office discover the internet?

The libs want a govenrment monopoly for heath care...and it doesn't get any worst than that. The "free" care will increase demand and naturally long lines result. The government will then determine that the cost is way too high. Then the pharmaceuticals and doctors will be told how much money they can keep."

-- That's already happening in the UK (rationed care) and just around the corner in Canada.

I read a theory a while back that stated that political markets are no different than any other kind of market. Politicians offer handouts and protection, and the citizenry bid on these services with votes and campaign contributions. In the UK, liberals have essentially saturated the market with large social programs and there's not much left to "sell" without destroying the market itself and going full throttle to marxism. Since they have nothing left to "sell", they're instead focusing on cutting costs.


426 posted on 08/12/2004 11:38:06 AM PDT by Remember_Salamis (Freedom is Not Free)
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To: Darkwolf377

oh good :^)


427 posted on 08/12/2004 11:38:47 AM PDT by Remington Rebel
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To: Remember_Salamis

What's a swing voter? Bi-electional?


428 posted on 08/12/2004 11:40:12 AM PDT by mict42
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To: Lepidopteran

Have you ever tried to access health care in Canada or the UK?

Pick John Kerry's favoritie Socialist or Communist friend in the EU and then contemplate what life in the next economy will be like, when everyone becomes dependent on the government.

This nation can survive very well without privatizing health care, or any other industry.

It can't survive the DemocRATs and our other foreign enemies simultaneously in the present configuration of Party leadership.

Are you a redistributionist?


429 posted on 08/12/2004 11:41:45 AM PDT by ApesForEvolution (DemocRATS are communists and want to destroy America only to replace it with the USSA)
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To: Lepidopteran
But I like John Kerry's message about the need to do something about the people in this country who have no health insurance.

You might like the message, but you won't like the mechanics, that's assuming he'll tell you, but he won't. Libs make promises but never tell you that'll your taxes will have to skyrocket to fund their liberal utopian schemes.

430 posted on 08/12/2004 11:44:33 AM PDT by 1Old Pro
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To: Lepidopteran
The health insurance issue is really a non-issue. I have my own business...that means I don't have a company paying my insurance for me. I went with a high yearly deductible. There is plenty of insurance available if you don't opt for the 10-20 dollar co-pay scheme that is VERY affordable. There are also catastrophic policies that only cover you if you become extremely ill...they're also very cheap per month, and all it means is that you pay your doctors visits as you go. Along with that sort of policy you can join a health consortium( not insurance) where your group pre-negotiates the same rates the insurance companies pay for treatment.

Remember if lawyers like John Edwards weren't in the business of suing doctors, we wouldn't be paying these higher rates anyway.

431 posted on 08/12/2004 11:46:16 AM PDT by Katya (Homo Nosce Te Ipsum)
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To: mict42

Yes, they swing both ways, preferring to have their cake and eat it too.


432 posted on 08/12/2004 11:46:20 AM PDT by Remember_Salamis (Freedom is Not Free)
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To: wolicy_ponk

LOL! Red...


433 posted on 08/12/2004 11:47:24 AM PDT by ApesForEvolution (DemocRATS are communists and want to destroy America only to replace it with the USSA)
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To: Lepidopteran

This has to be some kind of a joke, right? Ask the 3000 people who died on 9/11 if the cost of health care matters to them right now.


434 posted on 08/12/2004 11:47:55 AM PDT by Fishface (teach a man to fish...he eats for a lifetime.)
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To: Americanwolf

The media is as much to blame for this Liberal lunacy as anyone. They have overstepped their Constitutional Rights IMO...spoon feeding socialism/communism to a stupid or intellectually dishonest potential electorate. Amazing how there isn't a single requirement other than being an American and a breath...soon to be including illegal invaders amongst us I hear (CA).


435 posted on 08/12/2004 11:51:28 AM PDT by ApesForEvolution (DemocRATS are communists and want to destroy America only to replace it with the USSA)
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To: Lepidopteran

Go ask Canada about Hillarycare. Great for colds and flu. But you'll die waiting for anything significant. Don't take my word for it, do the research.


436 posted on 08/12/2004 11:55:07 AM PDT by DAC21
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To: Katya

There is a really solid private Health Association designed to reduce out of pocket costs underneath high-deductible, catastrophic type policies. Meds, Visits, on and on.


437 posted on 08/12/2004 11:55:45 AM PDT by ApesForEvolution (DemocRATS are communists and want to destroy America only to replace it with the USSA)
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To: Lepidopteran

Consider the following bit of wisdom from centuries past:

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent force of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse [benefits] from the public treasury [other people's hard-earned dollars]. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits from the public treasure. , with the result that democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always foiled by dictatorship." - Alexander Tytler

Or, this wise observation by historian Edward Gibbons of the Athenian society:

"In the end, more than they wanted freedom, they wanted security. They wanted a comfortable life, and they lost it all--security, comfort and freedom. When the Athenians finally wanted not to give to society but for society to give to them, when the freedom they wished for most was freedom from responsibility, then Athens ceased to be free."

Those charlatan politicians who sense our weaknesses and our tendencies to want things we cannot afford appeal to those weaknesses with promises to give us what they think we want most. The problem is they are not intending to give us out of their millions, or their billions. No, they are going to TAKE from every working person. WHY DO THEY DO THIS??? Is it out of a heart of love and caring? No, it is out of a desire for POLITICAL POWER.

Locate a copy of Congressman (1827-31, 18333-35)Davy Crockett's speech to Congress on the Constitutionality of such actions (Foundation for Economic Education publication entitled "Not Yours To Give"). Crockett said that his fellow Congressmen were not willing to give out of their own pockets for what they were so willing to vote out of others' pockets. He concluded,

"Money with them is nothing but trash when it is to come out of the people. But it is the one great thing for which most of them are striving, and many of them sacrifice honor, integrity, and justice, to obtain it."

They trade their PROMISES for our VOTES, and if elected, they amass power unto themselves. (In other words, their political currency is PROMISES, assuming they will exchange them for our VOTES. If held to some of their promises, they simply lay a tax on the people to pay for them. There is no altruism there, just a crass desire for power.

Are we better off with politicians who want us to become self-sufficient or those who want to keep us dependent on government?

You decide.


438 posted on 08/12/2004 12:26:02 PM PDT by loveliberty2
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To: The Scourge of Yazid
...where is that John Stuart Mill quote THAT EVERY SINGLE PERSON HAS ON THEIR PROFILE PAGE?(!)

This quote?

The general opinion of men is supposed to be, that the natural vocation of a woman is that of a wife and mother.

439 posted on 08/12/2004 1:53:14 PM PDT by Watery Tart (“…I can't imagine that al-Qaida is going to be impressed by sensitivity." ~~LYNNE Cheney)
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To: Watery Tart; tiamat
Not quite.

Good research though!

I suppose that John Stuart Mill was the first "equity" feminist.

440 posted on 08/12/2004 2:15:08 PM PDT by The Scourge of Yazid ("Sit Ubu. Sit. "(Woof!) "Good dog. ")
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