Posted on 07/24/2004 4:05:17 PM PDT by HostileTerritory
Undercover federal air marshals on board a June 29 Northwest airlines flight from Detroit to LAX identified themselves after a passenger, “overreacted,” to a group of middle-eastern men on board, federal officials and sources have told KFI NEWS.
The passenger, later identified as Annie Jacobsen, was in danger of panicking other passengers and creating a larger problem on the plane, according to a source close to the secretive federal protective service.
Jacobsen, a self-described freelance writer, has published two stories about her experience at womenswallstreet.com, a business advice web site designed for women.
“The lady was overreacting,” said the source. “A flight attendant was told to tell the passenger to calm down; that there were air marshals on the plane.”
The middle eastern men were identified by federal agents as a group of touring musicians travelling to a concert date at a casino, said Air Marshals spokesman Dave Adams.
Jacobsen wrote she became alarmed when the men made frequent trips to the lavatory, repeatedly opened and closed the overhead luggage compartments, and appeared to be signaling each other.
“Initially it was brought to [the air marshals] attention by a passenger,” Adams said, adding the agents had been watching the men and chose to stay undercover.
Jacobsen and her husband had a number of conversations with the flight attendants and gestured towards the men several times, the source said.
“In concert with the flight crew, the decision was made to keep [the men] under surveillance since no terrorist or criminal acts were being perpetrated aboard the aircraft; they didn’t interfere with the flight crew,” Adams said.
The air marshals did, however, check the bathrooms after the middle-eastern men had spent time inside, Adams said.
FBI agents met the plane when it landed in Los Angeles and the men were questioned, and Los Angeles field office spokeswoman Cathy Viray said it’s significant the alarm on the flight came from a passenger.
“We have to take all calls seriously, but the passenger was worried, not the flight crew or the federal air marshals,” she said. “The complaint did not stem from the flight crew.”
Several people were questioned, she said, but no one was detained.
Jacobsen’s husband Kevin told KFI NEWS he approached a man he thought was an air marshal after the flight had landed.
“You made me nervous,” Kevin said the air marshal told him.
“I was freaking out,” Kevin replied.
“We don’t freak out in situations like this,” the air marshal responded.
Federal agents later verified the musicians’ story.
“We followed up with the casino,” Adams said. A supervisor verified they were playing a concert. A second federal law enforcement source said the concert itself was monitored by an agent.
“We also went to the hotel, determined they had checked into the hotel,” Adams said. Each of the men were checked through a series of databases and watch-lists with negative results, he said.
The source said the air marshals on the flight were partially concerned Jacobsen’s actions could have been an effort by terrorists or attackers to create a disturbance on the plane to force the agents to identify themselves.
Air marshals’ only tactical advantage on a flight is their anonymity, the source said, and Jacobsen could have put the entire flight in danger.
“They have to be very cognizant of their surroundings,” spokesman Adams confirmed, “to make sure it isn’t a ruse to try and pull them out of their cover.”
I am confused, are citizens supposed to be vigilan tand point out suspicious actions or not? Where is the Homeland Security guidelines for passengers? How was she supposed to know there were AM on the plane? How about the Captain just telling the people to remain in their seats because of turbulence? Are the Air Marshalls just saying Annie overreacted because the situation was written about and the AM didn't look so hot? What if they were assemblying a bomb in the restroom? An how much faith can you have in officials who let foreigners go who have expired visas?
What will come of this to prevent future problems like this?
Should their be surveillance cameras on planes so they can be studied later? Has the possible making of a bomb by different individuals been examined and a course of action put into policy guidelines by HS? What would be a proper course of action if diferent individuals brougt pieces of a bomb and one or more of them then assembled it say in the restroom? Unlike a hijacking, no visible crime until the bomb goes off....What is the proper procedure to handle something like this? Only way I know is to prevent it from happening...How much c-4 explosive can one person sneak on an airplane? Multiply that by 14. (Same as use to blow up the USS Cole)
If someone can steal our most top-secret documents right out from under our noses, should we put all our faith in someone else protecting us? I'm glad I wasn't on that plane, I would probably have been arrested for telling the "musicians" to sit down and shut up.
Sycuan is definitely not an Arab casino...run by Indians here in the east county of San Diego... Sometimes they have bigger name groups in, other times it's smaller groups. I was shocked to hear that that concert was supposedly here...it just doens't seem like the kind of thing that used to be here from ads I've seen for the casino. And why on earth they wouldn't have flown into San Diego, especially since NorthWest does...unless they were elsewhere as well, I have no idea...
(Haven't finished the thread to see if you've gotten much of an answer on this one, so sorry if you did already!)
I guess the fact that Islamacists want to KILL us has escaped your notice. They have alread tried to blow up one plane that we know about (shoe bomber). I think they probably did blow up flight 800 and the one that went down in Queens...Islamacists were arrested in Ohio because they planned to plant a bomb in a suburban mall! Where I live, Atlanta area- they had a suspicious package that tied up traffic for hours last week. I never heard if the package was dangerous or not. All I know is if I get on a plane with 14 Arabs, I will be very nervous. If they start jumping up and running to the bathroom with bags I will be scared to death. It has been reported that Islamic pigs are planning to assemble bombs during airplane flights. I have a degree in chemistry; believe me it's not that difficult. I would like to know how air marshalls are any protection if they are too pc to investigate Arabs who are behaving strangely. Last time I flew, the stupid security people lost my license. I had to have my husband send me all kinds of documentation and obtain a police report ( which made no sense since my license wan't stolen) in order to fly home. Yet, they let Arabs with expired visas on an American plane
-total insanity. I believe President Bush and the idiot Democratic hold over (Mineta) have completely ignored the threat that Arabs-yes Arabs pose to the American public. This PC crap is going to get us killed. I would rather see marshalls over-react than ignore what could be a very real threat. As a caller on the Neal Boortz show said the other day, "if they can learn to fly airplanes, they can learn to play musical instruments". As for "flushing out the air marshalls" doesn't seem to me, they were particularly useful.
No I didn't! I just said they quite understandibly had a very different take on the situation! I have respect for the very hard job the Air Marshalls have, respect that ~should~ be more prevalent on this board, considering this is our country they are trying to protect, and I for one am grateful that they are on our side. That doesn't lessen my empathy for the plight of the woman and her husband who really felt something was wrong and could not know what the right thing to do was under questionable, but not certain circumstances. But to the Air Marshalls, she was a factor to contend with, that either might cause a situation, or be in the way of it, if something did go down. Nothing did happen. This was a non-event that has everyone postulateing about what the right thing to do was, when in fact, the right thing might be ~nothing~.
This whole story is about perceptions in an uncertain situation. The Syrians, no doubt, would tell a different version of the flight, that would also be accurate, no matter what their true motive was.
I guess the fact that Islamacists want to KILL us has escaped your notice. They have alread tried to blow up one plane that we know about (shoe bomber). I think they probably did blow up flight 800 and the one that went down in Queens...Islamacists were arrested in Ohio because they planned to plant a bomb in a suburban mall!
Where I live, Atlanta area- they had a suspicious package that tied up traffic for hours last week. I never heard if the package was dangerous or not. All I know is if I get on a plane with 14 Arabs, I will be very nervous. If they start jumping up and running to the bathroom with bags I will be scared to death. It has been reported that Islamic pigs are planning to assemble bombs during airplane flights. I have a degree in chemistry; believe me it's not that difficult.
I would like to know how air marshalls are any protection if they are too pc to investigate Arabs who are behaving strangely. Last time I flew, the stupid security people lost my license. I had to have my husband send me all kinds of documentation and obtain a police report ( which made no sense since my license wan't stolen) in order to fly home. Yet, they let Arabs with expired visas on an American plane-
total insanity. I believe President Bush and that idiot democrat hold over (Mineta) have completely ignored the threat that Arabs-yes Arabs pose to the American public. This PC crap is going to get us killed. I would rather see marshalls over-react than ignore what could be a very real threat. As a caller on the Neal Boortz show said the other day, "if they can learn to fly airplanes, they can learn to play musical instruments". As for "flushing out the air marshalls" doesn't seem to me, they were particularly useful.
Very true.
Seriously, I believe the authorities are well aware that assembling a bomb would have little overall effect to a terrorist. They wouldn't be able to hijack a plane with one, or with a razor blade even, since that could only work on one horrid day. No one would believe them if they were to say to remain calm and everything will be okay. A bomb on a plane can kill a planeload full of people, but that is small potatoes to a bomb placed in a baseball stadium, or a busy street corner at lunch hour.
1) He's not Middle Eastern.
2) The other passengers attacked because he was in the act of attempting to do something obviously dangerous, and the flight attendant hollered for help.
No such laws are on the books.
you can make an explosive by mixing some liquids brought on in your toiletry kit, disguised as harmless bottles of shampoo or cologne. is that "obviously dangerous"? if I see some ME guy doing that, should I be concerned? should someone try to stop him? Is mixing some liquids from your travel kit a typical thing that a passenger on a plane does?
I'm sure if terrorists blow up another flight, the FAA will determine it was the tail rudder.
Lady: I just said [that] respect ~should~ be more prevalent on this board The woman really felt something was wrong and could not know what the right thing to do was under questionable, but not certain circumstances. To the Air Marshalls, she was a factor to contend with, that either might cause a situation, or be in the way of it, if something did go down.[Everyboby else] is postulating about what the right thing to do was, when in fact, the right thing might be ~nothing~ [that is, not bothering the Air Marshalls].
* * *
You said -- you repeated and emphasized exactly what I called you on. The woman's life was on the line. She had a duty to do something BECAUSE the air marshalls were doing NOTHING. That is in fact what they did. Nothing.
You give them magical powers -- that their nothing was magically something. But is was because the passengers and stewardess took a far more active and pro-active role -- were functioning adults -- on Flight 63 -- the the 2nd shoebomber was stopped.
You would have had them hold back -- and wait -- for some one more magically authorative to do something. That's suicide, ma'am. Suicide.
Surely you do you NOT advise your children to play Russian Roulette?
For six times out of seven NOTHING happens. Why then advise such suicidal behaviour here?
and there is also no constitutional right to fly on a plane. if we had an El Al type security system, these Syrians would never have even been able to board that plane.
Using the lavatory: 30 lashes! Talking among your friends: Cut out the tongue! Checking storage compartments: Chop off the hand!
Freepers can always count on you to make nonsensical posts. UberKonservative? Are you German by any chance?
Do your parents know that you are on the internet? Honestly, are you 12 years old? Enough with the drama. I'm a military officer with 24 years in service--I don't need you to be my mom. I'm doing my part every day. You are talking big on 'net.
Tell me, how do you tell the difference between an Arab Muslim and, say, a Hindu Indian? What about a Jew from Israel -- how do you know that he's not an Arab Muslim? How about a Christian from, say, Lebanon? How, pray tell, do you discern the differences?!
And then there are the Muslims from Chechnya and Central Europe (Albania). They are, mostly European in appearance and ethnic origin. I used to work with a gentleman who came here from Albania. Blond hair and blue eyes -- and raised Muslim.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.