Amir Taheri: "Islam Is Incompatible With Democracy"

Benador Associates ^ | May 19, 2004 | Amir Taheri

[UnbelievingScumOnTheOtherSide]

He makes a few errors like saying Christianity is not monotheistic, but those errors are small in number.

That is not an error.
That is a fundamental tenet of Islam straight from the Qur'an.

[9.29] Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.
[9.30] And the Jews say: Uzair is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!
[9.31] They have taken their doctors of law and their monks for lords besides Allah, and (also) the Messiah son of Marium and they were enjoined that they should serve one God only, there is no god but He; far from His glory be what they set up (with Him).
[9.32] They desire to put out the light of Allah with their mouths, and Allah will not consent save to perfect His light, though the unbelievers are averse.
[9.33] He it is Who sent His Apostle with guidance and the religion of truth, that He might cause it to prevail over all religions, though the polytheists may be averse.

[Freebird Forever]

They need to be converted to Christianity ASAP. (Judaism would be fine as well.)

Heck, replacing islam with almost any other ideology / belief system would be an improvement.

Animism, Budism, secular humanism, materialism, even European-style socialism are all vast improvements over the mental illness now inflicting muslims.

[rogueleader]

Yes, but I mean that it is an absolute error.

Within Islam it would not be an error, but then Islam is fundamentally error-ridden.

The Christian perspective (and the fundamentally correct one) states that it is an error to deny the Trinity.

(This is my last post on this topic.)

[UnbelievingScumOnTheOtherSide]

Lest us return to the issue of equality.
The idea is unacceptable to Islam.
For the non-believer cannot be the equal of the believer.

That's not our problem.
History[Dustbin] = Islam

[k2blader]

Bump.

[Mat_Helm]

Excellant post and cultural perspective on why the middle east and islam represents the antichrist.

[Smartass]

"I don't think the arm would be bared on the Statue of Liberty either."

She would definitely get a radical Islamofacist makeover!

[Flying Circus]

He makes a lot of very good points in this. Western, Christian history agrees with most of this. God's law, which can be recognized as the natural law, is truly sovereign and Men's laws are good and just only to the extent they are in accord with God's law.

Our own nation's founders rejected democracy in hopes of forming a republic because they recognized the dangers of democracy. In the past century the constitutional protections have been progressively abrogated and we have drifted closer to democracy and with it growing abuses and inconsistencies in the law.

Where he is mistaken is in thinking that Islam is a close reflection of God's law. Contrary to Islam, all humans are equal in dignity, man or woman, slave or free and we are all sinners.

Islam is restricted in its government just like it is limited in its language. Its regulations are rather particular to desert dwelling nomads, not suited to properly governing beyond that sphere. This key flaw stems from the fact it is the creation of a man of a particular place and time(Mohamed) and not the eternal and universal God.

[PhilDragoo]

A series of interesting points.

I think his citing Islam as the one true monotheistic religion is in reference to the Christian trinity of Father, Son and Holy Ghost.

Too little emphasis on historic reality: Islamic governments are without exception misogynist dictatorships.

The main problem of Islam vis a vis democracy is that pesky little death-to-the-infidel thing.

That and it's always run by blockhead micromanaging fascist perverts.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

An interesting passage:

The " common folk", however, must do as they are told either by the text and tradition or by fatwas issued by the experts. Khomeini coined the word "mustazafeen" (the feeble ones) to describe the common folk.

Khomeini shares the contempt for the untermenschen with patrician prick Jihad Fedayeen al-Keri who voted for fatwas before he voted against them.

America's founders held truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

In view of this I see no free future for mankind in any "religion-neutral" direction.

Secular humanism has no ethical problem with the extermination of Jews by Hitler, Christians by Sudanese Muslims, Tibetan Buddhists and home-worshipping Christians by Communist Chinese.

Freedom is God's gift which must be safeguarded by men.

Democracy is in general the rule by the people; representative government is the American way.

Anything which dilutes the diktats of the nomenklatura is despised by the Kerrys and Khomeinis.

The safety valve must be available to the Iranian people: The tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants.

And never forget: Mr. UN is not your friend.

[highlander_UW]

My major concern regarding the Iraq war was the exit strategy depended upon establishing a democracy...but I was already aware that Islam is not compatible with democracy.

[SAMWolf]

Freedom is God's gift which must be safeguarded by men.

Something the American Liberals and Socialists will never understand. They look on Freedom as something they allow us to have and they are the safeguards of the power.

[Eurotwit]

Thanks for the ping. Interesting article.

[potlatch]

Good post, Phil.

[VOA]

Taheri made the point often by Muslims that their religion is "truly" monotheistic.

IIRC, Wahhabists think that the other Muslims are actually polytheists...hence some of
the reason that they'll kill other Muslims.

This is my recollections from hearing Dore Gold discussing his book
on Wahhabism "Hatred's Kingdom" on The Dennis Prager Show.

[dennisw]

Technically, he has a point. From the Muslim point of view, shared, I might add by some western, i.e. Christian thinkers, the the Christian concept of the trinity makes Christian monotheism less "pure" than the radical monotheism of Islam.

Islam is more properly called Mohammedanism. All the crap in the Koran/Hadiths is derived from Mohammed speaks. Islam is hardly an idolatry free religion focused only on a transcendent god . The real focus is Mohamed, whose life they are commanded to emulate. Their idol is the Kabba rock they dance around in Mecca. Their idol (with huge feet of clay) is Muhammad

[Former Proud Canadian]

ROP bump

[Cold Heat]

Interesting, and common sense for the most part.

In my opinion, Mohamed corrupted Islam into it's current state.

Prior Islamic communities were thriving and productive.

But, unfortunately, no Muslim can go against Mohamed. He fixed that little problem.

The question is can they overcome it?

The answer is going to be long in coming.

[Cold Heat]

was the exit strategy depended upon establishing a democracy.

I never saw that in print.

The exit strategy is to get them on their feet, then help them as needed. We, as a occupation force, will be out of there as soon as there is a command and control by the Iraqi government.

That should happen by sometime in 06. Portions of our forces should be out before then, if the creek don't rise.

The Democracy, if it ever occurs will not look like ours. It will take a generation or so to shake out and then it may fall on it's ass a few times.

I don't think it will be Americans picking them up if it does. I don't know if you noticed, but the U.N. is being remade as well.

Interesting times for sure.

[Trinity_Tx]

Thank you. : ) I would have missed this one.

It's nice to see this coming from a Muslim. I only wish more of the moderate ones would speak out as he has.

You know... Between you & me ; ) I've known a few who were generally good people. Tho, when it came to certain issues, I could never relate to their "logic" about justice... and I had a hard time believing that they truly bought into even the watered-down version of Islam they followed.

I look at them as sort of like unitarian or other really liberal Christians, or Jews... only a weak reflection of the creed. What's different is that the liberal Christians & Jews don't hesitate to speak out against fundamental Christianity, while I see very little of that from their Muslim counterparts.

I honestly think many are just afraid to. Or maybe (cynical mode), they are more sympathetic to the extremists, and are just waiting til they have critical mass before they admit it.

I'm thinking about the ones who got the Muslim Call to Prayer in that Michigan town... Judging by that. the Islamic religion truly does conflict with the American way. Not that Christians don't make the same mistake... While I'd rather see Judeo-Christian ideas supported by gov't, like prayer in school, etc, I fear it'll bite us in the butt when we have to give equal treatment to *all* religions.

[highlander_UW]

I never saw that in print. (Exit Strategy - Democracy)

It may have not been stated clearly, but it was obvious they weren't interested in setting up a theocracy or another dictatorship.

The Democracy, if it ever occurs will not look like ours. It will take a generation or so to shake out and then it may fall on it's ass a few times.

I'm sure this is correct. The only democracies within Islam are Turkey (which has been kept that way because the military is secular enough, and threatens to overthrow any theocracies), Indonesia (which is rife with corruption to the point is it a sham democracy), Pakistan (democracy in name only).

The problem is, if you have a democracy, then the Imams can browbeat the rank and file into electing mullahs to rule, and they don't give up power easily and you lose the democracy....It's an Islam thing.

I don't think it will be Americans picking them up if it does. I don't know if you noticed, but the U.N. is being remade as well.

Big shaking going in in the EU as well. Don't rule them out...they're interested in becoming one of the big boys on the block if not THE big boy.

Interesting times for sure.

I agree, and it reminds me of that ancient Chinese curse...may you live in interesting times.