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1 posted on 05/02/2004 10:36:34 AM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: Dog Gone
We can only refine so much gas

Not true. We can refine all the gas we could ever need. We can build more refineries. We just have to curb the power of the enviro-nazis.

2 posted on 05/02/2004 10:51:34 AM PDT by blanknoone (How many flips would a flip-flop flop if a flip-flop could flop flips?)
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To: Dog Gone
bttt
3 posted on 05/02/2004 10:52:10 AM PDT by Pikamax
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To: Dog Gone
Our leaders...must now demonstrate courage and vision.

Hah, Washington is filled with nothing but cowardly, spineless wimps bent on being re-elected.

4 posted on 05/02/2004 10:52:40 AM PDT by xrp
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To: Dog Gone
We already burn more of this precious but cheap commodity...

This just demonstrates how woefully inept economics education is in the ranks of journalists (not to mention the rest of the country). Economics dictates that a commodity cannot be both precious and cheap. One of this conditions precludes the other.

5 posted on 05/02/2004 10:53:12 AM PDT by The_Victor
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To: Dog Gone
One of the reasons for gas shortages is lack of new refineries. If rationing were to become necessary, I think states should be rationed based on the number of refineries they have. Hellooooooo, California.
6 posted on 05/02/2004 10:54:20 AM PDT by mathluv (Protect my grandchildren's future. Vote for Bush/Cheney '04.)
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To: Dog Gone
Good article until the non-sequitur of the last paragraph.
9 posted on 05/02/2004 10:58:43 AM PDT by snopercod (I used to be disgusted. Then I became amused. Now I'm disgusted again.)
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To: Dog Gone
Gas at $2.00 Per Gallon May Seem Cheap by Autumn (industry analyst)
12 posted on 05/02/2004 11:01:53 AM PDT by snopercod (I used to be disgusted. Then I became amused. Now I'm disgusted again.)
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To: Dog Gone
Let the free market reign! If the supply of gasoline is truly too small for demand, prices will rise. Rising prices will increase the incentive for companies to increase production or manufacture more fuel-efficient vehicles. I, personally, dislike SUVs, but I support the right of every citizen to buy what they want, even if it's wasteful. The free market has an amazing way of encouraging people to be responsible citizens by forcing them to pay an increasing price for poor decisions. I know there are a lot of SUV fans here, but I think we can agree they are terribly inefficient, right? Most people really don't need them.
13 posted on 05/02/2004 11:03:18 AM PDT by CitizenUSA
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To: Dog Gone; Shermy
We already burn more of this precious but cheap commodity than U.S. refineries can make.

This of course is not an unstoppable force of nature. High prices under normal economic rules is the incentive to build and expand refining capacity. The inability to do so is purely political. You can ignore economics but you can't escape them. If you effectively outlaw expanding refineries you guarantee high gasoline prices. You can escape the political fallout by blaming the oil companies, but the energy bottleneck can't be finessed.

We buy more thirsty SUVs than thrifty sedans.

Oh, the SUV canard. People buy the vehicle they need and pay a price for it. The shortage of gasoline doesn't come because your neighbor needs a station wagon and can't buy one, it comes because your elected and unelected leaders won't allow a refinery in your neighborhood. The same problem applies to other energy projects. We have an existing generating plant in our town that is being shutdown because the local leaders won't allow it to operate anymore; they want the plant razed and replaced with shopping centers. Only a few months ago we were beset with blackouts and importing power at enormous cost; memories are short, though.

Most foreign refineries are unable to make gas that is suitable for sale in the United States

This again is not a law of nature. The problem of politically designed gasoline is self-inflicted. We can't import gasoline from one state to the other for the same reason. Elect morons to office and this is what you get. If you imagine that eggs come from the supermarket and electricity is your birthright, and gasoline is evil and should nonetheless be cheap, you are a candidate for manipulation by people who aren't fit to rule you, but will.

It takes three years to build and install those big, costly, complex units.

Three years is nothing. This is what a lot of people do for a living. Open the gates and get out of the way. The sky is not falling; people are throwing rocks in the air and blaming the sky.

An early warning could allow people of moderate means to buy efficient vehicles in time

People don't need to be encouraged to buy efficient vehicles. At three dollars a gallon people will do it without one dollar being spent on a PR campaign.

But if people don't get realistic about where oil and gas come from, the price will only continue to rise and no amount of bellyaching will prevent it. Only a change in political attitudes toward energy production can do that. Either you're for it or you aren't. If you aren't, get ready to pay a lot more.

14 posted on 05/02/2004 11:03:56 AM PDT by marron
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To: Dog Gone
Here in Hawaii, the Democrat-controlled legislature has passed legislation imposing price controls on gas. They were due to take effect this summer, but will apparently be delayed until after the election to avoid any political fallout. There is only one refinery in Hawaii (Chevron on Oahu) and regular gas here on Kauai is $2.40 a gallon. We spend between $200 and $300 per month on gas.
18 posted on 05/02/2004 11:23:11 AM PDT by KAUAIBOUND (Hawaii - a Socialist paradise)
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To: Dog Gone
"lead us toward reducing consumption."

High prices will take care of this.

They will also stimulate increased supplies.

Thank goodness for the invisible hand of the market place.
19 posted on 05/02/2004 11:25:08 AM PDT by jjackson
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To: LibreOuMort
ping
28 posted on 05/02/2004 1:21:11 PM PDT by Eala (Sacrificing tagline fame for... TRAD ANGLICAN RESOURCE PAGE: http://eala.freeservers.com/anglican)
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To: Dog Gone
One thing not often mentioned in articles of this type is the decline of the worth of the dollar compared to other currencies. Therefore, a barrel of crude oil costs more than it did a few years ago, other factors staying the same. Also, the terrorists are now starting their campaign to impact western fuel supplies -- first the attack on Iraq's oil terminal and then the attack on Saudi refinery managers.

None of these, however, go to the heart of the problem, which is that enviro regulation in both supply and refining limits supplies in crude and refined product. As one who has observed such battles up close in NM, it is obvious that Rats like Bill Richardson are taking direction from the leftists in preventing efficient and sound extraction and refining of the resource, which will lead to the very conflicts they profess they want to avoid. I see all of these issues coming to a head in the next few years and the winners will be those who want control of the resource in the hands of the anti-US socialist one-worlders.
29 posted on 05/02/2004 2:38:09 PM PDT by CedarDave (May God bless our brave sailors & all who have died serving our country, and comfort their families)
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To: farmfriend; BOBTHENAILER; Ernest_at_the_Beach; Grampa Dave
Big PING!
30 posted on 05/02/2004 2:39:55 PM PDT by CedarDave (May God bless our brave sailors & all who have died serving our country, and comfort their families)
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To: Dog Gone
Methinks Tuisani has a bit of an agenda.
32 posted on 05/02/2004 2:54:05 PM PDT by sauropod ("I am Locutus of Borg. Resistance is futile. You will service US.")
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To: Dog Gone
We can only refine so much gas

We can only put so much money in the banks.

33 posted on 05/02/2004 2:55:36 PM PDT by boothead
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To: Dog Gone
I made a few minor changes...

Let me stress an essential point. We must not pretend that a supply increase small cars can save us. Even if public opposition and economic impediments to refinery auto plant expansion should disappear today, the oil auto industry could not install new equipment fast enough to prevent a shortage two or three years from now. No company can order the major process hardware to make gasoline small cars -- pipe stills, catalytic crackers, alkylation units, cokers and reformers small engines, small transmissions, small body parts, small interiors, small mufflers and small windshields -- off the shelf. It takes three years to build and install those big small, costly, complex units. Add another year for design, engineering, bidding and funding. In the real world, securing operating permits would entail anywhere from a year to as long as it takes for one to lose hope.

Our leaders, who have debated energy policy for years without acknowledging any concern for a potential gasoline shortage allowing us to drill for oil, must now demonstrate courage and vision. They must admit that the nation's gasoline problem has no practical supply-side small car answer and lead us toward reducing consumption producing more oil.

40 posted on 05/02/2004 7:34:10 PM PDT by RJL
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