Skip to comments.
NEWSWEEK: Study Suggests 1 in 4 Would Be Alive Today Had They Been in Properly Armored Vehicles
Prnewswire ^
| 4/25/04
Posted on 04/25/2004 7:52:32 AM PDT by Brian Mosely
Press Release
Source: Newsweek
NEWSWEEK: Study Suggests One in Four Soldiers Killed in Iraq Would Be Alive Today if They Had Been in Properly Armored Vehicles
Sunday April 25, 10:38 am ET
Light-Skinned Humvees Were 'Never Designed To Do This,' Says General, About Facing Vast Roadside Bombs
# NEW YORK, April 25 /PRNewswire/ -- An unofficial study analyzing the casualty figures in Iraq suggests that many U.S. deaths and wounds simply did not need to occur, Newsweek reports in the current issue. According to the study by a defense consultant, that is now circulating through the Army, of a total of 789 Coalition deaths as of April 15 (686 of them Americans), 142 were killed by land mines or improvised explosive devices, while 48 others died in rocket-propelled grenade attacks. Almost all of those soldiers were killed while in unprotected vehicles, which means that perhaps one in four of those killed in combat in Iraq might be alive if they had had stronger armor around them, the study suggested. Thousands more who were unprotected have suffered grievous wounds, such as the loss of limbs.(Photo: http://www.newscom.com/cgi-bin/prnh/20040425/NYSU005 )
The military is 1,800 armored Humvees short of its own stated requirement for Iraq. Despite desperate attempts to supply bolt-on armor, many soldiers still ride around in light-skinned Humvees. This is a latter-day jeep that, as Brig. Gen. Mark P. Hertling, assistant division commander of the 1st Armored Division, concedes in an interview, "was never designed to do this...It was never anticipated that we would have things like roadside bombs in the vast number that we've had here."
(Excerpt) Read more at biz.yahoo.com ...
TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: armor; iraq; mediadistortions; uparmoredhumvee; wheeledarmor
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20, 21-40, 41-60, 61-72 next last
To: Brian Mosely
The military is 1,800 armored Humvees short of its own stated requirement for Iraq. Disgraceful.
41
posted on
04/25/2004 12:46:03 PM PDT
by
Wolfie
To: Criminal Number 18F; Cannoneer No. 4
I am given to understand that the no. 1 reason that there are IED kills of such armored vehicles that you noted, is because the troops leave the doors open/off. They are "more concerned about making a speedy entrance and exit of the vehicle."
42
posted on
04/25/2004 1:18:29 PM PDT
by
First_Salute
(May God save our democratic-republican government, from a government by judiciary.)
To: Brian Mosely
It's all Bush's fault and Kerry has the voting record to prove it. /sarc/
43
posted on
04/25/2004 1:24:50 PM PDT
by
TADSLOS
(Right Wing Infidel since 1954)
To: First_Salute
That is not my understanding. The troops strip down the unarmored Humvees. Much effort is made to acquire improvised armored doors so I doubt they are taking
them off.
IEDs can take out tanks. No matter what we put our troops in, the enemy can build an IED powerful enough to destroy it.
44
posted on
04/25/2004 1:40:17 PM PDT
by
Cannoneer No. 4
(I've lost turret power; I have my nods and my .50. Hooah. I will stay until relieved. White 2 out.)
To: Brian Mosely
45
posted on
04/25/2004 1:42:42 PM PDT
by
Cannoneer No. 4
(I've lost turret power; I have my nods and my .50. Hooah. I will stay until relieved. White 2 out.)
To: prairiebreeze
46
posted on
04/25/2004 1:51:33 PM PDT
by
Cannoneer No. 4
(I've lost turret power; I have my nods and my .50. Hooah. I will stay until relieved. White 2 out.)
To: First_Salute; Voice in your head
Because the light-skinned HMMWVs provided no protection whatsoever, we removed the doors from them and sat side-ways, facing perpendicular to our direction of movement, with weapons oriented outward. We were vigilant and aggressive and always on the lookout for rock piles, any trash bags near the road, burlap bags, wires, etc. An Up-Armored HMMWV, on the other hand, gives a lot of protection, but it does not allow you to scan your sector, during movement, and only the man in the turret can lay down any kind of well-aimed fire. The windows are tiny and the space inside is cramped, especially when you're wearing an interceptor vest with inserts and you've got ammo pouches, canteens, grenades, your assigned weapon, etc
47
posted on
04/25/2004 2:02:28 PM PDT
by
Cannoneer No. 4
(I've lost turret power; I have my nods and my .50. Hooah. I will stay until relieved. White 2 out.)
This:
or
this?
Both have their uses
48
posted on
04/25/2004 2:07:39 PM PDT
by
Cannoneer No. 4
(I've lost turret power; I have my nods and my .50. Hooah. I will stay until relieved. White 2 out.)
To: Agnes Heep
The Germans had us completely outclassed in their tanks and armaments, and their soldiers
were, by all accounts, better trained.
During the 50th anniversary commemoration of D-Day, CSPAN carried a panel discussion
arranged by Stephen Ambrose.
One of the panelists was a Panzer commander who was involved in the Germans'
failed attempt to contain the Allied beachead.
IIRC, he said something like "facing 10 Sherman tanks was no problem; the problem
was that there was always an eleventh Sherman.".
I guess that in many ways it was the revved-up assembly lines of America
(along with all the blood, sweat and tear of the Allies) that neutralized any
quality advantage of the Nazi armament and soldiers.
49
posted on
04/25/2004 2:10:30 PM PDT
by
VOA
To: First_Salute
50
posted on
04/25/2004 2:21:13 PM PDT
by
Cannoneer No. 4
(I've lost turret power; I have my nods and my .50. Hooah. I will stay until relieved. White 2 out.)
To: King Prout
The cast includes Ken Watanabe, Michael Caine, Gary Oldman, Morgan Freeman, Rutger Hauer and Liam Neeson; the director did Memento, which was fantastic; from what I understand, the story takes major cues from Frank Miller's acclaimed Batman: Year One storyline/graphic novel, so I've got really great hopes for it.
51
posted on
04/25/2004 2:29:55 PM PDT
by
mhking
To: mhking
ok, that does sound promising.
I just hope they have abandoned the hallucinogenically inflated derivatives of the lunatic original vision of Tim Burton.
Also (something which pissed me right the hell off from the original movie onwards) they had better get back to one of the central truths of the Batman: Batman does NOT kill.
52
posted on
04/25/2004 2:36:12 PM PDT
by
King Prout
(poets and philosophers should NEVER pretend to Engineering... especially SOCIAL Engineering!)
To: Cannoneer No. 4
Back on April 3rd, I collected a lot of the articles and references that you have posted, of the various models available.
I think that some of the alternative models that you referenced (directly or indirectly) are obviously good alternatives and available, without us having to wait around for armored Humvees --- some of which we are apparently doing because of the "bond" between procurement in the Pentagon and various owners of "pork futures" in the Congress cum UAW (for Kerry, BTW, says the link at the AM General website).
Brits, Danes, Swedes, and that "Dingo" from Cincinnati, all looked good enough, and probably we could scrounge up a hundred, if only ...
53
posted on
04/25/2004 2:40:08 PM PDT
by
First_Salute
(May God save our democratic-republican government, from a government by judiciary.)
To: First_Salute
Solving the problem deprives certain people of a club with which to beat the President.
54
posted on
04/25/2004 3:07:02 PM PDT
by
Cannoneer No. 4
(I've lost turret power; I have my nods and my .50. Hooah. I will stay until relieved. White 2 out.)
To: First_Salute
55
posted on
04/25/2004 3:09:27 PM PDT
by
Cannoneer No. 4
(I've lost turret power; I have my nods and my .50. Hooah. I will stay until relieved. White 2 out.)
To: Brian Mosely
And if my Uncle had boobs, he'd be my Aunt.
56
posted on
04/25/2004 3:15:59 PM PDT
by
Crankbait
(I put the FUN in Dysfunctional)
To: Feckless; Qatar-6
57
posted on
04/25/2004 3:23:51 PM PDT
by
Cannoneer No. 4
(I've lost turret power; I have my nods and my .50. Hooah. I will stay until relieved. White 2 out.)
To: Starboard
58
posted on
04/25/2004 3:58:47 PM PDT
by
Cannoneer No. 4
(I've lost turret power; I have my nods and my .50. Hooah. I will stay until relieved. White 2 out.)
To: Cannoneer No. 4; First_Salute
Solving the problem deprives certain people of a club with which to beat the President.Postponing a solution does no one but our national enemies any good, The several hundred troopers that will be casualties over coming months because of inexcusable delays which can be rectified. Resolve the matter asap. Don't pretend it doesn't exist. The actions taken last week will move production by July to 300 per month and hold it there until March if funding is approved versus 220 for 5 months and then a decline in production as proposed in the FY-05 budget proposal. A step in the right direction.
Plant capacity without expansion in hiring is 450-500 per month. We need about 12,000 of these things system-wide and the Iraq-Afghanistan count will rise over 5000 and needs are re-emerging in Kosovo, Haiti and elsewhere that have been depleted of any available inventory.
Let's just get on with it. Let's also outsource to private contractors the production of retrofit kits so that the lead time required on that item can be slashed as it was with the body armor delays a few months ago.
This is a resolvable problem so let's resolve it and move on.
59
posted on
04/25/2004 5:41:31 PM PDT
by
Ranger
To: Ranger
The several hundred troopers that will be casualties over coming months because of inexcusable delays which can be rectifiedDoes the enemy bear any responsibility for our casualties?
60
posted on
04/25/2004 5:54:02 PM PDT
by
Cannoneer No. 4
(I always thought the Yankees had something to do with it)
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20, 21-40, 41-60, 61-72 next last
Disclaimer:
Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual
posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its
management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the
exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson