[First_Salute]

I am given to understand that the no. 1 reason that there are IED kills of such armored vehicles that you noted, is because the troops leave the doors open/off. They are "more concerned about making a speedy entrance and exit of the vehicle."

[Cannoneer No. 4]

That is not my understanding. The troops strip down the unarmored Humvees. Much effort is made to acquire improvised armored doors so I doubt they are taking them off.

IEDs can take out tanks. No matter what we put our troops in, the enemy can build an IED powerful enough to destroy it.

[Cannoneer No. 4]

Because the light-skinned HMMWVs provided no protection whatsoever, we removed the doors from them and sat side-ways, facing perpendicular to our direction of movement, with weapons oriented outward. We were vigilant and aggressive and always on the lookout for rock piles, any trash bags near the road, burlap bags, wires, etc.

An Up-Armored HMMWV, on the other hand, gives a lot of protection, but it does not allow you to scan your sector, during movement, and only the man in the turret can lay down any kind of well-aimed fire. The windows are tiny and the space inside is cramped, especially when you're wearing an interceptor vest with inserts and you've got ammo pouches, canteens, grenades, your assigned weapon, etc

[Cannoneer No. 4]

M998 HMMWV's, modified with steel plates on the floor and sides, may be better than the the M1114 for many tasks.

[Criminal Number 18F]

I dunno. We ran uparmoreds with doors shut, lost one to an IED, crew of five survived, all injured.

The vehicle was blown to junk though.

My impression is that the IED would have been sufficient to blow a Stryker or Bradley to junk as well, and would have been a solid mobility kill on an M1 Abrams requiring recovery and substantial repair. We did observe another IED that did not completely detonate and in plain English it was bad news for any vehicle made.

The enthusiasm some have for the obsolete M113 puzzles me, unless it's simple old-soldiers' nostalgia, like those guys 100 years ago who sniffed at the newfangled 03 Springfield and clung to their trapdoors.

Track vehicles always are less reliable, less economical, and shorter-ranged than wheeled. An M113 would have been logistical nightmare to fuel that far from friendly lines, and would not have had much durability (the tracks wear rapidly). Plus, it is much harder to get out of in a hurry, and the troops are blind in the back. It was a fine machine in its day, which was forty years ago. And it was a significant improvement over its predecessor, the White halftrack. (Yeah, I know about the interim M59). But it's scrap on the roll in 2004.

d.o.l.

Criminal Number 18F