Posted on 04/19/2004 10:48:06 PM PDT by Joe Hadenuf
Associated Press
WASHINGTON, D.C. — There's a log describing a tape - but no tape itself.
A Secret Service agent has testified that an agency document written shortly after the Oklahoma City bombing described security video footage and witness testimony - suggesting Timothy McVeigh may have had some help.
The log describes footage showing the federal building explosion, about three minutes after "suspects" exited the Ryder truck used in the blast.
But she says there's no evidence that the tape exists. The government has insisted McVeigh drove the truck alone, and that it had no tapes showing the bombing or the scene at the building before it.
Several people involved with the case say they've never seen footage described in the log.
The agent who testified today at bombing conspirator Terry Nichols' trial says the log was an internal document used to keep track of agents' activities during the bombing investigation.
She said the reports in it may have been based on speculation - and that the Secret Service doesn't vouch for its reliability.
Since you're a real live Okie who could possibly dispute your authority on the matter?
Do you know a real live Texican who can explain what happened to a 3-0 steel door logged as evidence in the Waco/Koresh case that disappeared without a trace? Perhaps if I take off my tinfoil hat I will realize that there never was a front door on their main building.
I lived in Midwest City for a while. I am an expert too. But I've had a tinfoil hat for a long time nevertheless.
I got my tinfoil hat back in the late 1940's during the "Mao is only an agrarian reformer who has dedicated his life to helping the little people" days.
It's old and tattered. I'd like to hang it up once and for all. I need your help.
You suggested that anything beyond the things the government told us are Internet "shadowy mutterings."
I want to believe you, a fellow expert, but given that DOJ was in the hands of the Clintons, Gorelick, et al. and their "shadowy mutterings" included "Rush made him do it" I'd appreciate some examples of "shadowy mutterings" and how they are wrong. TIA.
I'm curious. What in your opinion is "tinfoil-hat" about the notion that McVeigh could have had an accomplice we don't know about? Or that such a videotape could exist?
And what does your state of residence have to do with anything?
I'm afraid I don't understand the hostility here. As an Oklahoman, wouldn't you WANT to know if there is still an unpunished OKC bomber roaming around free somewhere? Why on earth would you want to cover that up or be hostile to incoming evidence indicating it?
There simply isn't any grand "conspiracy" hidden from public view beyond those already brought to justice, i.e., McVeigh, Fortier, and Nichols. Plain, simple, period.
What makes you so sure?
in *one* person's testimony (no context of the entire testimony is provided, of course)
Could you kindly explain how "context" could, even in theory, alter our interpretation of testimony which indicates that this logbook entry exists? Maybe the witness was relating a dream he had, is that what you mean?
If you really want to claim that there is more "going on" than we know about in the case, you should openly state so
Fine, I'll take you up on that. I think there is more going on (I don't know why anyone would put that phrase in quotes) than we know about in the case. And you... don't? So you think that you know everything there is to know about this case?
But there is simply not any "OKC bombing conspiracy," plain and simple, Period. End-of-sentence.
Holy cow that's a bizarre thing to say.
Even according to the official story, Mr. McVeigh and Mr. Nichols, BY DEFINITION, participated in a conspiracy together. I believe it's one of the charges against Nichols in fact. So how in the world you can say "there is simply not any OKC bombing conspiracy"??
Not even the one that bombed the OKC building in the first place???
Sorry, the existence of a CONSPIRACY is not even open to question. There WAS a CONSPIRACY, period, end of story. I would think you, as a person who has lived in Oklahoma his whole life except for his time in the service, would understand that.
What this evidence seems to point to, and what some of us would be interested to discover, is that this CONSPIRACY (which DID EXIST!!) involved more than the two people "McVeigh" and "Nichols".
I still don't understand why you, as an Oklahoman, would be so hostile to the possibility, or why you wouldn't be interested in catching any other CONSPIRATORS which may have existed.
It has to do with reliability of fed agents info to the public and other govt agencies -- can you answer the questions ?
Why didn't the FBI turn over all info to the defense ?
""The log *describes* footage showing the federal building explosion, about three minutes after "suspects" exited the Ryder truck used in the blast.""
First, I didn't "state" anything: I *said* it. At least follow the most pedestrian rules of the English language if you wish to communicate with me, please.
We'll if your going to get technical and split hairs Mr. Cad, if you *said* it, how could I possibly hear it? Don't you mean you typed it? Please, if you're going to communicate with me, stop making moronic statements.
Second, I'm not interested in the least by your "curiosity" about, well, really, anything regarding this matter.
Why would you even post then? No offense, but you seem slightly deranged.
Since you failed to answer even basic questions, I would suggest you stick to those board games you speak of.
You are obviously caught up in a *007 James Bond*-type fantasy regarding this topic, wherein only you and your hardy, noble band of followers are relentlessly pursuing some vague "truth" about this event to the end.
James Bond? My noble band of followers? Man, you are a strange one.
Like many convinced conspiracy fanatics you will find constant dead-ends in this pursuit of some vague "truth" about the matter
Huh? Conspiracy fanatics? Why, because I made a comment about a Secret Service agent documenting and describing a video tape that the Secret Service now says doesn't exist? This makes me a Conspiracy fanatic?
Yeowzaa!
and it will always be just out of your verifiable reach. The sad truth all the while will be that there was no "conspiracy", of course; that the proved facts on hand will always, even years down the road, be the currently accepted version of events. But you'll keep trying; keep muttering about dark events in some shadowy never-never-land of your own creation; keep flaming posts from people who point out your obvious intellectual deficiencies regarding the topic; and so on.
I suggest you see a doctor.
Which is all fine, of course. This is a free country, after all, even for the congenitally silly. But just don't act outraged or puzzled when someone calls you on your obsessive silliness from time to time: it's a free country for those of us who aren't obsessed with neurotic fictions about historical events, too.
Again, I don't know how, after reading my few posts on this issue, you've reached these conclusions. (Obsessed neurotic fictions)??
If you are indeed responding to my posts, you need to see a doctor. I have no idea what you are talking about, or what you are referring to.
Well, you would know. So, that ends it, then. We can all sleep comfortably tonight.
But since you are so well informed, you have an obligation to post summaries of info, so the less priviliged can understand this significant event in our history. You know that we would really appreciate your sharing.
So here is the truth about one aspect, John Doe II.
It appears that is was Clinton's Jamie Gorelick (still wearing her knee pads?) who put out the story that John Doe #2 was really a soldier named, Todd Bunting. You see Todd Bunting and Michael Hertig rented a Ryder truck from Elliot's Body Shop in Junction City (Kansas), the day after Tim McVeigh -- all alone and nobody within miles of him -- rented his truck. The stupid flyoverland average citizen working at Elliot's was confused dispite what the poor devil says. Employees of goverment in Washington D.C. have wisdom far beyond mere mortals and they know. Ms Gorelick was merely correcting the Elliot's employee's careless mistake. All is well. Can we just moveon?
Those other flyover country bumkins who saw John Doe II? Well, you know.. what can I say? Ms Gorelick of Washington has given us the answer. We should be grateful that she took the time away from what was probably her main duty.
Since I'm not a conspiracy theorist you won't mind my reply. I'm sure that no one here had any interest in reading your condescending baseless ad-hominem attacks which were totally bereft of any useful information and lacked completely a logical train of cogent thought.
By the way, the FBI lied. No conspiracy. No theory. They lied and it shows.
Yeah. Sure. You bet. And those religous nuts at Waco deserved what they got, and besides, it was for the children.
Oh yeah, and Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone.
Enjoy having Eyes Wide Shut?
Well you shouldn't.
I am going to ask you politely to cease and desist from polluting my inbox with anything further from this thread.
It doesn't work that way, cowboy. When you post a comment on the open forum you have invited everyone and anyone to reply. Especially when you offer a smarmy insult aimed at everyone that might have an interest in the topic at hand. Whether you respond or not is up to you. As far as being polite there is nothing polite about anything you have posted here.
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