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Spectre of Vietnam is stalking Bush
The Toronto Star ^ | 4-7-04 | TIM HARPER

Posted on 04/07/2004 7:45:02 AM PDT by Oldeconomybuyer

WASHINGTON—With U.S. troops fighting pitched battles on two Iraqi fronts last night, a question dismissed by the White House as naïve last summer has gained increasing currency this spring.

Is this George Bush's Vietnam?

The charge was made in a Monday speech by one of the country's most polarizing politicians, Massachusetts Senator Ted Kennedy, the 42-year veteran of Congress.

He struck a chord in this nation and the question was being put to the U.S. administrator in Iraq, Paul Bremer, on network television yesterday while most Americans were still digesting the latest Iraqi battles over their morning coffee.

By nightfall, with the Pentagon confirming at least 12 Americans dead in a firefight in Ramadi — and raging battles in Falluja suggesting the toll will rise — the Vietnam comparisons were everywhere.

"Oh, gee, I don't even know where to start with that comparison," Bremer told NBC's Today Show. "I think it's completely inappropriate. There's really nothing in common with Vietnam."

Others find much in common.

In strict terms, Iraq is not Vietnam, but the perception is taking hold and that alone could turn into a nightmare during an election campaign for Bush.

The differences are stark — some 58,000 Americans lost their lives in Vietnam in a conflict that lasted more than a decade against a well-entrenched and organized opponent.

When numbers are tallied from yesterday's fighting, the toll in Iraq will look like this:

More than 620 Americans dead in a conflict that's only in its 13th month, with most deaths the result of insurgents' guerrilla-style tactics.

"I completely agree this is Bush's Vietnam," said Terry Anderson, an expert on the Vietnam era and a veteran of the war who is now a historian at Texas A&M University.

"Just like (former U.S. president) Lyndon Johnson, (President George W.) Bush has totally misjudged the culture in which they are fighting," Anderson said in an interview.

"Just like LBJ, we are trying to bring democracy to people who are not particularly interested in U.S.-style democracy and just like LBJ, we are rotating out battle-hardened people with new troops. And just like LBJ, Bush is not telling Americans they are going to be there for years."

One difference, Anderson says, is that public support for the war in Iraq has ebbed much more quickly. He says the American electorate began turning against the Vietnam war only two years into the conflict, souring on it forever following the infamous 1968 Tet Offensive.

"You had massive rallies against this war even before Bush went in," he says, "because the Vietnam experience jump-started opposition to this war."

Two polls released this week show support for Bush's handling of the situation in Iraq hovering between 40 and 45 per cent, with mounting calls in Washington for a reappraisal of the June 30 target for handover of political power to Iraqis.

Bush was being briefed on last night's fighting at his ranch in Crawford, Tex., and the White House released a brief statement of resolve in response to reports of the U.S. deaths.

Bush will meet with his most steadfast ally, British Prime Minister Tony Blair, here next Friday, when the deteriorating situation and the June 30 handover will be discussed.

Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld said yesterday if military commanders seek more troops to try to stabilize a worsening situation, they will get the help, although he said the U.S. has an artificially high number — 135,000 — in the country now because of the troop rotation under way.

"You're starting to hear that `Q' word — quagmire," pollster John Zogby told the Reuters news agency yesterday. That word has become synonymous with the Vietnam war which drove Johnson from office.

"The public seems confused," Zogby said. "How do we get out? Do we send more troops? How do we cut casualties? It's all becoming a big problem for Bush."

Rumsfeld said troops are involved in "dangerous work ... we're going to have good days and bad days."

But last June, when the words `Vietnam' and `quagmire' were put to Rumsfeld at a Pentagon briefing, he was dismissive of the questioners, even rejecting a dictionary definition of quagmire read to him by a reporter.

Part of that reaction is what some believe is another analogy to the Vietnam era — disingenuous reports of progress and good news from political leaders.

"We have to tell the American people that we are in this for the long haul. We cannot say, as we did in Vietnam, that the light is at the end of the tunnel," Republican Senator John McCain of Arizona said in an interview published yesterday in the Detroit Free Press.

Republicans railed against Kennedy, charging him with offering support to the enemy with Americans in peril and using American casualties for electoral advantage. But, as the most high-profile member of the Kerry team, Kennedy's words take on more weight with the distinct possibility he was speaking with tacit approval of the presumptive nominee.

Kerry would not make the Vietnam analogy yesterday, but said Bush had made a mistake in setting the arbitrary June 30 deadline for a political handoff in Iraq. (U.S. troops will remain, but there have been no official estimates of troop levels.)

"I have always said consistently that it is a mistake to set an arbitrary date and I hope that the date has nothing to do with the election here in the United States," Kerry said following a campaign stop in Cincinnati, Ohio. "I think they wanted to get the troops out and get the transfer out of the way as fast as possible... The test ought to be the stability of Iraq and not an arbitrary date."

Former U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix also weighed in yesterday, telling a Danish newspaper the costs of the war in Iraq outweigh the benefits of removing Saddam Hussein.

"It's clearly the negative aspects that dominate," he Jyllands-Posten. "Bush declared war as a part of the U.S. war on terror, but instead of limiting the effects of terror, the war has laid the foundation for even more terror."

Additional articles by Tim Harper



TOPICS: Canada; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: bias; iraq; journalism; journalists; media; qwagmire; vietnam
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1 posted on 04/07/2004 7:45:05 AM PDT by Oldeconomybuyer
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
Earth to Toronto: Ted Kennedy is not "one of the country's most polarizing politicians". Ted Kennedy is an ineffective windbag who's becomming more irrelevant with each day.
2 posted on 04/07/2004 7:50:09 AM PDT by sarasota
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
"I completely agree this is Bush's Vietnam," said Terry Anderson, an expert on the Vietnam era and a veteran of the war who is now a historian at Texas A&M University.

What a big, steaming shovelfull.

3 posted on 04/07/2004 7:50:13 AM PDT by jtminton (<><)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
Spectre of Vietnam is stalking Bush

Only in your liberal wet dreams - wet with the blood of American GIs that you believe will lead to Bush's loss in November.

Do you know why the insurgents are fighting, Mr. Harper? Because of liberal nimrods like you, who help convince them that enough American fatalities will drive the U.S. out of Iraq. The terrorists still cling to the hope that they can create another Mogadishu reaction, because they see the petulant, morose whining from the left and actually believe it represents a majority in this country.

4 posted on 04/07/2004 7:51:10 AM PDT by dirtboy (John Kerry - Hillary without the fat ankles and the FBI files...)
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To: All


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5 posted on 04/07/2004 7:52:52 AM PDT by Support Free Republic (Freepers post from sun to sun, but a fundraiser bot's work is never done.)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
Hey Canaduh. Being that you don't have a dog in this fight, go hug a polar bear.
6 posted on 04/07/2004 7:53:09 AM PDT by Broadside Joe
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
What went on in Viet Nam is the reason I think Bush will not let Iraq become another Viet Nam. We will win this one.
7 posted on 04/07/2004 7:53:29 AM PDT by dalebert
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
"Former U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix also weighed in yesterday, telling a Danish newspaper the costs of the war in Iraq outweigh the benefits of removing Saddam Hussein"

Just so we are clear. Gassing your own people, torture, rape, murder is better than the realism of freedom. Is it me or did we fight for several years before getting a democracy in place and a constitution for America?

Damn Euroweenies.
8 posted on 04/07/2004 7:54:07 AM PDT by EQAndyBuzz
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
Is this George Bush's Vietnam?

No, it's John Kerry's who once again played politics with the US military for the sole purpose of advancing his career.

9 posted on 04/07/2004 7:54:12 AM PDT by Dolphy
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To: Oldeconomybuyer; M. Thatcher; holdonnow
"In strict terms, Iraq is not Vietnam, but the perception is taking hold..."

What a sickening admission of GUILT by this writer...he and TeddyK and the rest of the anti-American Left are trying to create the perception that Iraq is another Viet Nam, thereby providing aid and comfort to the mass-murdering thugs who aim to destroy our resolve. The Leftists who continue to give our enemies hope that America will give up are being seditious, plain and simple!! And Americans need to call 'em on it!!

FReegards...MUD

10 posted on 04/07/2004 7:54:38 AM PDT by Mudboy Slim (Become a monthly donor......"What good am I...if I fail to FReep?!")
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To: sarasota
The article doesn't address the key points.
For instance the geographic environment.
#1 - Tropical mountains are at least 10 times more favourable for guerrillas than a flat desert.
11 posted on 04/07/2004 7:56:01 AM PDT by Truth666
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
All this "wisdom" from one of the most pompus, windbags in the Senate. Teddy needs to remember that President Bush did not kill someone in his car by driving off a bridge and then try to get his cousin to take the blame, did not get thrown out of college for cheating on a test and did not engage in affairs while married, did not drive his wife to alcoholism, did not.......the list is too long to continue. Uncle teddy needs to shut up, he's a complete jerk.
12 posted on 04/07/2004 7:57:16 AM PDT by Lucky2 ( 2004 is the year the Yankees win the World Series!)
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To: dirtboy
I agree. It isn't the specter of Vietnam that's stalking Bush. DEMOCRATS are stalking Bush, and they are USING Vietnam.

The hanging issue, as ever since The Nameless One I and II, is: are Americans STUPID COWS enough to buy it?

Dan
13 posted on 04/07/2004 8:03:09 AM PDT by BibChr ("...behold, they have rejected the word of the LORD, so what wisdom is in them?" [Jer. 8:9])
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
All the more reason not to cut and run. Does anybody on the left remember what happened after we left Vietnam? It's called the Khmer Rouge and the same thing would occur in Iraq if we pulled out.
14 posted on 04/07/2004 8:03:33 AM PDT by mass55th
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To: All
I hope they have all the film of Kennedy's red bloted face spewing hatred everytime he opens his mouth. I hope they play it a lot during the campaign. Kennedy couln't be more wrong about President Bush and the world situation with terrorism. The whole western world is at war with these animals and the sooner they figger it out when a town blows up somewhere in Europe, the better. America has done, as usual, all the heavy lifting. It is time the rest of civilization comes to grips with what Islamic terrorists are doing. Kennedy is nothing but a blob on the footnotes of history. His anger at being out of power motivates his every move. He is sadly the runt of the litter than was really the one that should have been put out of its misery.
15 posted on 04/07/2004 8:03:54 AM PDT by cousair
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To: Dolphy
Oh where, oh where are Kerry's military/medical records?
16 posted on 04/07/2004 8:03:56 AM PDT by sarasota
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To: Mudboy Slim
Right. In "strict" terms Iraq isn't Vietnam, but for the purposes of the author creating a 'perception'--readers should simply ignore the facts. These people are shameless.
17 posted on 04/07/2004 8:06:24 AM PDT by unsycophant
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
It's almost like listening to a eunuch talking about self-examination for testicular cancer - all the empty words are based on absolutely nothing.
18 posted on 04/07/2004 8:06:34 AM PDT by trebb (Ain't God good . . .)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer
More than 620 Americans dead in a conflict that's only in its 13th month, with most deaths the result of insurgents' guerrilla-style tactics.

I'm not discounting the 620 brave souls, but c'mon, that isn't much considering we invaded and took over the entire country.

19 posted on 04/07/2004 8:07:42 AM PDT by TankerKC (Clogged Arteries and Still Smilin'!)
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To: Oldeconomybuyer

20 posted on 04/07/2004 8:07:43 AM PDT by cartoonistx
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