Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

U.S. Loses Its Advantage In Technology Trade
Manufacturing News | April 2, 2004 | Charles W. McMillion

Posted on 04/06/2004 12:49:21 PM PDT by doug9732

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 141-160161-180181-200 ... 221-227 next last
To: palmer
You're looking to handwring about what is or is not the job of the government and in the meantime blame everyone else.
Why do you suppose that is. Political favoritism isn't supposed to be involved anymore than political slackness. But are you now going to say something is the government's fault while dodging something being the government's fault..
Gee, how interesting.
161 posted on 04/07/2004 11:52:46 AM PDT by Havoc ("The line must be drawn here. This far and no further!")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 143 | View Replies]

To: Clemenza
While were at it, kill inferior (and EXPENSIVE!) public schooling that gives no prep for the real world as well.

Says who? Where do you think the vast majority of students at US engineering schools come from? That's right, public schools, where the program they take to get into engineering school is rigorous and essentially begins in junior high school.

Students going to engineering school in my district usually begin taking either algebra or geometry (a few!) in eighth grade. Then in high school their program is as follows. They don't have to take both chemistry and phyiscs but many take both:

Freshman year:
Either honors geometry or honors Algebra 2 / Trigonometry
Honors Biology(which is equivalent to the college course which I taught labs for)

Sophomore year:
Honors Algebra 2 / Trig or Honors Precalculus
Honors Chemistry
Honors Physics

Junior year:
Honors precalculus or Calculus I (college credit)
Advanced Physics (college credit)
Advanced Chemistry (either can also be taken senior year)

Senior year:
Calculus 1 (college credit) or Calculus 2/Differential equations (college credit)

Another St. Louis district is offering Calculus 3 / Differential Equations 2 to its high school seniors.

Don't tell me how bad public schools are when it comes to providing the advanced classes needed to get into engineering schools. Better suburban districts *are* providing this preparation. Most students in any given district are not *intellectually capable* of pursuing this type of course of study.

What should concern us more is that students who *are* capable aren't doing it (EE and CS enrollment is down a third this year already) because *why work so hard* if you can't get a job easily, or if you do, your job is outsourced?

162 posted on 04/07/2004 11:55:55 AM PDT by valkyrieanne
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: rmlew
The problem with Free trade is that capital and skilled labor are exportable.

And Free Traders, apparently, are not.

163 posted on 04/07/2004 11:57:29 AM PDT by templar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: belmont_mark
Dollars to donuts? Pay up, I wasn't old enough to Vote.
164 posted on 04/07/2004 12:00:24 PM PDT by Havoc ("The line must be drawn here. This far and no further!")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 149 | View Replies]

To: ninenot
Good points. In addition to .30, I am also interested in .50 long range target rifle rounds. In the latest American Rifleman there is an article about how the Army adopted the commercial versions (e.g. the ones that all the Rats are trying to ban). Probably not a lot of volume but the markup is good. So many possibilities.... ! :)
165 posted on 04/07/2004 12:01:05 PM PDT by GOP_1900AD (Un-PC even to "Conservatives!" - Right makes right)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 158 | View Replies]

To: Havoc
Oh man, you got me there! Here you go ... $$$$$$$ . :)
166 posted on 04/07/2004 12:01:50 PM PDT by GOP_1900AD (Un-PC even to "Conservatives!" - Right makes right)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 164 | View Replies]

To: chimera
Then all the hamburger flippers and insurance salesmen and WalMart gladhanders in the world won't help us.

Why should the "CEO-wannabes" (love that phrase) care? After all, if borders don't matter, why not just clamber to the top of the heap of the One World Government?

Outsourcing manufacturing was bad - we have no domestic US men's shirt makers, for instance, and I really wonder if we do have the ability to make the materiel we would need for a long-drawn out war. But our really critical lack is going to be technically-trained people. Keeping engineering jobs in the US isn't just a protectionist issue - it's a serious national security issue.

167 posted on 04/07/2004 12:05:36 PM PDT by valkyrieanne
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 96 | View Replies]

To: lelio
I'm perplexed too about this "training" -- is it Bush's version of the WPA? What exactly are these people going to be trained to do? And what about the college educated people whose jobs are going overseas, are they going to be retrained to do something new?

Good question. I've been reading dozens of these articles/threads over the past few months, and *no one* has a cogent answer. Except for a few brief references to "biotechnology" and "new technologies" (unspecified), NO ONE interviewed from this administration has given any decent answer.

The "biotechnology" thing is especially lame. Most of the head work requires a PhD in biochemistry, genetics, etc. and the lab grunt work is done by people with 1-2 years at community college.

The basic message to 40-50 year old engineers - in fact, the whole technically-trained middle class - is f--- off. Too bad most of those being flipped off were George Bush's base in 2000.

168 posted on 04/07/2004 12:13:25 PM PDT by valkyrieanne
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 127 | View Replies]

To: funkywbr
No, you said It was funny as hell having my black manager comment one day about how she went into the coffee room and thought she was in another country.

The emphasis was on the color, so I asked you:

hmmm... what's that supposed to mean?
169 posted on 04/07/2004 12:22:41 PM PDT by Cronos (W2K4!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 138 | View Replies]

To: chimera
Indeed a good point here. Many believed that the peace of the 1870s was a portent of a new age of global commerce. And mind you, there was an even heavier hand, in the form of the European monarchies, to steer it, than there is today. If it failed then, then how can anyone argue that it will be any better this time around? I think the bugaboo here is that the current false peace has lasted so long. Arguably, it has been in place since 1945.

I personally do not count anything that has happened since then as an end of that peace - never were major great powers in direct shooting (vaporizing?) conflict over extended periods.

I attribute the length of the period to a number of things. Firstly, from the moment we nuked Japan, we feared great war so strongly, that we exhibited many behaviors that were not, from a historical perspective, at all normal. Appeasement, truce calling, detente, ongoing negotiations with no conclusive end point, etc. I issue no value judgement regarding those behaviors, I only am bringing them to light.

Secondly, we took the UN much more seriously than the League of Nations or any other earlier international body. In many if not most cases, much of our support of and engagement with the UN has been overtly antithetical to our true national interest; we have, in essence, taken the anti Clausewitzian approach. This is, in a way, another manifestation of the first item - our now near primal fear of great war (even, I might add, to the point of refusal to consider it in cases where, from a perspective of the long term survival of Western Civilization, it would have been the correct, ableit exceedingly painful, decision).

Thirdly, the advanced state of decay of the age old aristocratic structures, and, innate Judeo Christian Western institutions, fomented by the increasing influence of anti traditional intellectuals brought on by inexpensive media means, the bourgeiosification of higher education and the previously mentioned efforts to discredit Von Clausewitz' theses, resulted in a potent Leftist polity throughout the West with its own ill effects.

And finally, the change in monetary policy from one of relatively fixed (or at best, slowly changing and metal backed) money supply to one of elasticity and bourgeiosified debt incursion, gave rise to the historically unprecedented and unproven hyper commercial orientation of Western modernism. This last item clearly drives the mentality of the so called "free traders." Certainly it comes as no surprise that when that mentality is juxtaposed upon the first three factors, the current state of affairs is a predictable outcome.

Given that none of these four factors have a deep foundation and are certainly not part of the thousand plus year old underpinnings of the core of Western Civilization, any claim as to their stability and staying power must be suspect.

170 posted on 04/07/2004 12:25:59 PM PDT by GOP_1900AD (Un-PC even to "Conservatives!" - Right makes right)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 152 | View Replies]

To: WRhine
Indeed, it is not "Creative Destruction" for the reasons you stated but I like to call the deleterious effect of our One Way "unFree" trade polices "Senseless Destruction" because it does not have to happen. As you pointed out it has NOTHING to do with Innovation, only the search for cheaper labor to build EXISTING technology.

Software companies have moved south as well (and I don't mean Mexico) because they can get better value for money there -- the programmers there can work for less and live pretty good.
171 posted on 04/07/2004 12:26:40 PM PDT by Cronos (W2K4!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 151 | View Replies]

To: ninenot
Your number is wrong. China's growth last year was WAY in excess of 12%, and it's larger YTD 2004.

China's growth was less than 10% last year. That is nothign considering the base level or starting point. e.g. suppose you start up a company in the year 2000 and make a profit of $1000 that year. The next year you make $2000 -- that's a 100% increase in profit. Now, it's easy to make $1000 to $2000 but not that easy to make $2000 $4000. And hte US is much much larger economically so it's 4% GDP growth is massively larger than China's 10% growth.
172 posted on 04/07/2004 12:29:36 PM PDT by Cronos (W2K4!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 157 | View Replies]

To: valkyrieanne
Too bad most of those being flipped off were George Bush's base in 2000.

If Bush loses this election (which is looking more and more likely as those approval numbers drop), a big reason will be what you say. This is impacting primarily a conservative Republican demographic. Bush and the GOP are committing mindless political suicide on this jobs/offshoring issue. If they think the well-heeled corporate fat cats are going to save them with their big bucks they'd better think again, because there are very few of them and a whole lot of the middle class who have been screwed by offshoring.

173 posted on 04/07/2004 12:29:51 PM PDT by chimera
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 168 | View Replies]

To: belmont_mark
Given that none of these four factors have a deep foundation and are certainly not part of the thousand plus year old underpinnings of the core of Western Civilization, any claim as to their stability and staying power must be suspect.

You can say that again. They're about as substantial as a house of cards built on shifting sands. It won't take much to bring it down. Something like, say, China deciding to re-assert it's perceived historical right of hegemony over the Pacific Rim. They might not try it anytime soon, but in something like, maybe 20 or 30 years, when this country is only a shadow of its former military and industrial self, and has largely reverted to an agricultural base or, as the one Japanese business executive called it, an "entertainment nation", they can move on the vision. The Chinese are nothing if not patient. They'd rather see us destroy ourselves than take on a shooting war, but if it comes to that, they won't do it until they're sure they'll win. That may not be all that far off, given the trends.

174 posted on 04/07/2004 12:41:18 PM PDT by chimera
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 170 | View Replies]

To: Cronos
I thought you might have understood the 1st part of my post.

At my office, besides outsourcing we are also insourcing.

That means that we have about 40 Pakistanis working along side of the 50 of US varied Americans.

Now can you imagine the IRONY of a Black American saying that she went into the Coffee Room and thought she was in another Country?

It sounding so RACIST when she said that.

Don't worry I did not report her as I KNOW how in REAL LIFE whistle blowers are treated:-)
175 posted on 04/07/2004 1:00:47 PM PDT by funkywbr
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 169 | View Replies]

To: funkywbr
Got it! ARe they Pakis or Injuns? I distrust slammies
176 posted on 04/07/2004 1:07:51 PM PDT by Cronos (W2K4!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 175 | View Replies]

To: Cronos
Sorry my mistake, they are all from India (guess I made a racist assumption myself).
177 posted on 04/07/2004 1:23:00 PM PDT by funkywbr
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 176 | View Replies]

To: valkyrieanne
Ah, a member of the PS Teachers lobby.

While there are fine public schools out there (usually in affluent districts) your average public school s-cks in terms of preparation for the sciences (to say nothing about the other subjects).

178 posted on 04/07/2004 2:30:30 PM PDT by Clemenza ("Knowledge is Good" --- Emil Faber, Founder of Faber College)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 162 | View Replies]

To: valkyrieanne
BTW: Ask any Professor of Engineering which students are better prepared: Those from India and Korea or those from the United States.
179 posted on 04/07/2004 2:37:30 PM PDT by Clemenza ("Knowledge is Good" --- Emil Faber, Founder of Faber College)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 162 | View Replies]

To: belmont_mark
"I feel for you. I am taking it on the chin as well. Globalism made me rich during the 1990s, but today it has turned into a monster, I doubt my current line of business can continue without radical changes to the environment, or, some major externally imposed new conditions."

Thanks Mark.  Your experiences with Globalism gives your response added validity.  While I haven't become an all-out isolationist, my experience has made me a much stronger protectionist. 

180 posted on 04/07/2004 3:33:55 PM PDT by backtothestreets
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 135 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 141-160161-180181-200 ... 221-227 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson