Kerry Friend Beau Dietl 'Shocked' by Assassination Plot

NewsMax.com ^ | March 20, 2004 | Carl Limbacher

[Carl/NewsMax]

Legendary former New York City homicide detective Beau Dietl said Saturday that he was "shocked" by reports that Sen. John Kerry participated in a 1971 Kansas City meeting of the Vietnam Veterans Against the War where a plot to assassinate seven U.S. Senators was considered.

"I was shocked listening to the story," Dietl told WABC Radio's Monica Crowley, who had just broadcast an update by the reporter who broke the news last week, The New York Sun's Thomas Lipscomb.

"I like John very, very much as a person," said Dietl, who's a personal friend of the Massachusetts Democrat. "But if this has any validity to it, it could be earth shattering."

Dietl said Kerry may have committed a crime if he took part in any discussions about the assassination plot.

"When you talk about killing somebody that's conspiracy to commit murder," he told Crowley. "At the point you talk about it you're guilty of a crime."

Dietl said it made no difference whether or not the plot was carried out, telling Crowley, "By just talking about it, it's the crime of conspiracy."

The former lawman, who now operates his own security firm "Beau Dietl & Associates," urged his old friend to come clean about the 1971 episode, warning, "Once they start to cover things up, that's when the crimes are going to start to begin again."

Dietl went out of his way to assure Crowley that, despite his comments, he has a warm relationship with the likely Democratic nominee, explaining, "John Kerry is a friend of mine. He was at my birthday party. I was at Mara Lago with him last year and he's a good person."

[doug9732]

Any lawyers here? What is the statute of limitations on an atempted-murder conspiracy? Is it really a crime if no one who talked takes any further act to carry it out? I had thought that at least one overt act was needed.
Is someone who refuses to take part in the conspiracy but knows about it leaglly culpable? If so under what statute? My guess is Kerry's liability here is entirely political.

[Sabertooth]

Wait, I'm wrong, Stennis was a Democrat.

[Hon]

Yes, I remember Stennis being mentioned elsewhere as well.

As for Nunn, I can't remember where I read that--it might have just been speculation here even. But according to his bio he became a Senator in 1972, so he would have been elected by the middle of Novemember 1971--so it is conceivable he was on the list.

It's a good question about Jackson. The characterization is that they were Senators who had voted to continue funding.

And, as you know, it even the term "Senators" might not be accurate. Camil back then and subsequently tended to talk about Congressional leaders. So it might not have been limited to just Senators.

One of the ironies in all of this is that the Senators Kerry appeared before back in April 1971 were all very fawning, and several of them talked about how they fully expected Kerry to be a Senator as well someday.

[doug9732]

"Wait, I'm wrong, Stennis was a Democrat"

I thought Stennis was an aircraft carrier ( joke ).

[Hon]

"Although, on it's face, this whole thing seems that it might have political legs, but in my State, it takes a bit more for one to satisfy the Criminal Conspiracy Statute. Two or more people need to communicate (plan) about the commission of a crime and then one or more needs to take a "substantial step" toward the commission of the conspired crime."

From what I have read I think you are generally right. I was pretty surprised to see the claims made in the article at the top of the thread.

I've asked around to try to get some legal guidance, but no joy.

[Texasforever]

It would be a federal crime so I would suggest Federal statutes.

[danamco]

"Remember Ma Clinton and the FBI files??????????"


It doesn't help the broom rider as long as Peter Paul and Aaron Tonken are alive!!!

[Hon]

Would it be a federal crime? The plan was to murder them during the Christmas recess when they would have presumeably been out of DC?

[capitan_refugio]

I wonder if there is a statute of limitation when it comes to conspiring to plan a murder of a Federal official?

[Texasforever]

Sure these are United States Senators. The Feds would never let states have jurisdiction.

[Hon]

This might apply

US CODE COLLECTION

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 7 > Sec. 115.	Prev | Next
Sec. 115. - Influencing, impeding, or retaliating against a Federal official by threatening or injuring a family member (a) (1) Whoever - (A) assaults, kidnaps, or murders, or attempts or conspires to kidnap or murder, or threatens to assault, kidnap or murder a member of the immediate family of a United States official, a United States judge, a Federal law enforcement officer, or an official whose killing would be a crime under section 1114 of this title; or (B) threatens to assault, kidnap, or murder, a United States official, a United States judge, a Federal law enforcement officer, or an official whose killing would be a crime under such section, with intent to impede, intimidate, or interfere with such official, judge, or law enforcement officer while engaged in the performance of official duties, or with intent to retaliate against such official, judge, or law enforcement officer on account of the performance of official duties, shall be punished as provided in subsection (b). (2) Whoever assaults, kidnaps, or murders, or attempts or conspires to kidnap or murder, or threatens to assault, kidnap, or murder, any person who formerly served as a person designated in paragraph (1), or a member of the immediate family of any person who formerly served as a person designated in paragraph (1), with intent to retaliate against such person on account of the performance of official duties during the term of service of such person, shall be punished as provided in subsection (b). (b) (1) An assault in violation of this section shall be punished as provided in section 111 of this title. (2) A kidnapping, attempted kidnapping, or conspiracy to kidnap in violation of this section shall be punished as provided in section 1201 of this title for the kidnapping, attempted kidnapping, or conspiracy to kidnap of a person described in section 1201(a)(5) of this title. (3) A murder, attempted murder, or conspiracy to murder in violation of this section shall be punished as provided in sections 1111, 1113, and 1117 of this title. (4) A threat made in violation of this section shall be punished by a fine under this title or imprisonment for a term of not more than five years, or both, except that imprisonment for a threatened assault shall not exceed three years. (c) As used in this section, the term - (1) ''Federal law enforcement officer'' means any officer, agent, or employee of the United States authorized by law or by a Government agency to engage in or supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or prosecution of any violation of Federal criminal law; (2) ''immediate family member'' of an individual means - (A) his spouse, parent, brother or sister, child or person to whom he stands in loco parentis; or (B) any other person living in his household and related to him by blood or marriage; (3) ''United States judge'' means any judicial officer of the United States, and includes a justice of the Supreme Court and a United States magistrate judge; and (4) ''United States official'' means the President, President-elect, Vice President, Vice President-elect, a Member of Congress, a member-elect of Congress, a member of the executive branch who is the head of a department listed in 5 U.S.C. 101, or the Director of the Central Intelligence Agency. (d) This section shall not interfere with the investigative authority of the United States Secret Service, as provided under sections 3056, 871, and 879 of this title	Search this title: Notes Updates Parallel authorities (CFR) Topical references
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[Rocky]

"It doesn't help the broom rider as long as Peter Paul and Aaron Tonken are alive!!!"

If we learned anything at all from the Clinton years, it is that those who reveal ugly things about the Clintons either change their story or else they often die mysterious deaths. Let's see if these guys are still singing the same song, or even inhaling, when Hillary's candidacy is announced.

[Hon]

Yeah, if they had pulled it off, it looks like this would have kicked in:

18 USC Sec. 351
01/26/98

TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 18 - CONGRESSIONAL, CABINET, AND SUPREME COURT ASSASSINATION, KIDNAPPING, AND ASSAULT

HEADING

Sec. 351. Congressional, Cabinet, and Supreme Court assassination, kidnapping, and assault; penalties

STATUTE

(a) Whoever kills any individual who is a Member of Congress or a Member-of-Congress-elect, a member of the executive branch of the Government who is the head, or a person nominated to be head during the pendency of such nomination, of a department listed in section 101 of title 5 or the second ranking official in such department, the Director (or a person nominated to be Director during the pendency of such nomination) or Deputy Director of Central Intelligence, a major Presidential or Vice Presidential candidate (as defined in section 3056 of this title), or a Justice of the United States, as defined in section 451 of title 28, or a person nominated to be a Justice of the United States, during the pendency of such nomination, shall be punished as provided by sections 1111 and 1112 of this title.

(b) Whoever kidnaps any individual designated in subsection (a) of this section shall be punished (1) by imprisonment for any term of years or for life, or (2) by death or imprisonment for any term of years or for life, if death results to such individual.

(c) Whoever attempts to kill or kidnap any individual designated in subsection (a) of this section shall be punished by imprisonment for any term of years or for life.

(d) If two or more persons conspire to kill or kidnap any individual designated in subsection (a) of this section and one or more of such persons do any act to effect the object of the conspiracy, each shall be punished (1) by imprisonment for any term of years or for life, or (2) by death or imprisonment for any term of years or for life, if death results to such individual.

(e) Whoever assaults any person designated in subsection (a) of this section shall be fined under this title, or imprisoned not more than one year, or both; and if the assault involved the use of a dangerous weapon, or personal injury results, shall be fined under this title, or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both.

(f) If Federal investigative or prosecutive jurisdiction is asserted for a violation of this section, such assertion shall suspend the exercise of jurisdiction by a State or local authority, under any applicable State or local law, until Federal action is terminated.

(g) Violations of this section shall be investigated by the Federal Bureau of Investigation. Assistance may be requested from any Federal, State, or local agency, including the Army, Navy, and Air Force, any statute, rule, or regulation to the contrary notwithstanding.

(h) In a prosecution for an offense under this section the Government need not prove that the defendant knew that the victim of the offense was an individual protected by this section.

(i) There is extraterritorial jurisdiction over the conduct prohibited by this section.

[capitan_refugio]

Is Part (d) going to get Kerry a reservation at the Graybar Hotel?

[Hon]

"d) If two or more persons conspire to kill or kidnap any individual designated in subsection (a) of this section and one or more of such persons do any act to effect the object of the conspiracy, each shall be punished (1) by imprisonment for any term of years or for life, or (2) by death or imprisonment for any term of years or for life, if death results to such individual."

This seems like the most relevant passage. And, mentioned by some earlier, since presumeably nobody acted upon this conspiracy, there will probably not be any prosecution.

[Sabertooth]

As for Nunn, I can't remember where I read that--it might have just been speculation here even. But according to his bio he became a Senator in 1972, so he would have been elected by the middle of Novemember 1971--so it is conceivable he was on the list.

No, elected in '72, sworn in in January of '73. A lot of the bios say he served from '72 to '97, but they're incorrect. We elect Senators in even years and they take office in odd years. Nunn was a Georgia Congressman from '69 to '73.

What do we know about the Stennis shooters in January of '73? The official story is that it was a mugging in his front yard.

Who mugs and shoots Senators at their homes?

Wonder if the shooters were vets?

[Yaelle]

To me, if he VOTED -- even though he voted no -- the fact that he sat there, listened, contemplated, and made a choice is about the end of him.

That is really the point. Sitting in on, participating in, legitimizing a decision on whether or not to go on a mass killing spree is certainly a crime and would today possibly be considered terrorism.

Doing the above and not reporting it, and further still associating with the group for years if not decades, is not going to withstand scrutiny by anyone with a small amount of morality. He has eliminated himself from nomination.

[Hon]

"Is Part (d) going to get Kerry a reservation at the Graybar Hotel?"

I guess it could come down to what "do any act" means. It could mean even approached DuBose to hit Towers. I don't know. (Probably it would take more than that, I suspect.)

But there might have been further acts that we don't know about as yet. It certainly should warrant investigation.

[DeFault User]

Helms is/was an unlikely target as he was elected to the Senate in 1972 and took his seat in January 1973.

[Hon]

"What do we know about the Stennis shooters in January of '73? The official story is that it was a mugging in his front yard."

That's an excellent point, and Stennis is somebody who had been in my mind since I read about that near-fatal shooting.

It's hard to find any info about it. You're the first person I've seen call it a mugging--or even say where it took place. It's generally just mentioned very vaguely.

He would have been one of the prime targets, if you ask me. He was an UR-hawk.