To: Burkeman1
.......only stopped by the French from taking all of Europe in 772! A small quibble, but important.
There was no France yet, in 772. There were only Gauls, Germans and the remnants of Rome in Western Europe at the time, not counting the islands and Scandanavia.
Martel led the resistance, and he was king of the Franks. The Franks were just another german tribe then.
7 posted on
02/14/2004 6:51:59 PM PST by
jimtorr
To: jimtorr
Yes- a technical point- the mondern French trace their royal lines from the Franks predominantly- who were a Germanic tribe. The Modern French are a blend of Celt and German tribes.
10 posted on
02/14/2004 6:55:02 PM PST by
Burkeman1
("If you see ten troubles comin down the road, nine will run into the ditch before they reach you")
To: jimtorr
Charles Martel was the king of the Alsace Franks which were a German tribe. His grandson, known to some as Charlemagne, was in actuality named Karl der Grosse (Karl the Great). His capital would reside in Achen, Germany, not France.
To: jimtorr
Charles Martel
Charles Martel (688?-741), Carolingian ruler of the Frankish kingdom of Austrasia (in present northeastern France and southwestern Germany). Charles, whose surname means the hammer, was the son of Pepin of Herstal and the grandfather of Charlemagne. Pepin was mayor of the palace under the last kings of the Merovingian dynasty. After Pepin died in 714, Charles, an illegitimate son, was imprisoned by his father's widow, but he escaped and was proclaimed mayor of the palace by the Austrasians. A war between Austrasia and the Frankish kingdom of Neustria (now part of France) followed, and at the end of it Charles became the undisputed ruler of all the Franks. Although he was engaged in wars against the Alamanni, Bavarians, and Saxons, his greatest achievements were against the Muslims from Spain, who invaded France in 732. Charles defeated them near Poitiers at the Battle of Tours in which the Muslim leader, Abd-ar-Rahman, the emir of Spain, was killed. The progress of Islam, which had filled all Christendom with alarm, was thus checked for a time. Charles drove the Muslims out of the Rhône valley in 739, when they had again advanced into France as far as Lyon, leaving them nothing of their possessions north of the Pyrenees beyond the Aude River. Charles died in Quierzy, on the Oise River, leaving the kingdom divided between his two sons, Carloman and Pepin the Short.
30 posted on
02/14/2004 7:38:18 PM PST by
Redcoat LI
("If you're going to shoot,shoot,don't talk" Tuco BenedictoPacifico Juan Maria Ramirez)
To: jimtorr
There was no France yet, in 772. There were only Gauls, Germans and the remnants of Rome in Western Europe at the time, not counting the islands and Scandanavia. Clearly, this was the "tadpole" era.
32 posted on
02/14/2004 7:43:01 PM PST by
freedumb2003
(Everyone is stupid! That is why they do all those stupid things! -- H. Simpson.)
To: jimtorr; Burkeman1
Martel led the resistance, and he was king of the Franks. The Franks were just another german tribe then.
Franks, Frankland, France. Same difference. The Modern French have lesser Gallic roots than you might think. Caesar practically committed genocide when he conquered Gaul, slughtering entire tribes and repopulating the land with Roman citizens and retired Armymen. The modern French has Gauls in Brittany (but they came from Britian when the Anglo Sazxons invaded there) but are mostly Roman-Germanic -- the Frnaks were the only German tribe that moved in -- there were also the goths, the Burgundians and finally the Nordic Norsemen or Normans.
55 posted on
02/16/2004 1:42:30 AM PST by
Cronos
(W2K4!)
To: jimtorr
Western Europe was a pestelential hellhole in Charles Martel's day. The Moslems had "converted" a number of folks in SW Gaul ~ and brought in settlers to repopulate this area (which had virtually no people due to the hazards of the early period of the Dark Ages).
Chuck, and others, attacked the Moslems and drove them out of Gaul into Spain.
Chuck returned to his 2 wives and lebenteenzillion concubines and lived a life of privilege and ease.
Today I just added to my own family "historical genealogy" by discovering the Earls of Orkney (who can be traced back through Donald the Bruce for any who care to do that). They go all the way back to the First Century in Finland.
Charles Martel's own genealogy was not as ancient as that. Relative newcomer by still extant Western European civilization out on the Isles.
69 posted on
11/27/2008 5:56:14 PM PST by
muawiyah
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