GOP Infighting Fills Our Enemies with Joy ((The Stupid Party getting even stupider)

The Times-Picayune [New Orleans] ^ | February 12, 2004 | James Lileks [Newhouse News Service]

[quidnunc]

Let's just be blunt: The North Koreans would love to see John Kerry win the election. The mullahs of Iran would love it. The Syrian Baathists would sigh with relief. Every enemy of America would take great satisfaction if the electorate rejects the Bush doctrine and scuttles back to hide under the U.N. Security Council's table. It's a hard question, but the right one: Which candidate does our enemy want to lose? George W. Bush.

And some conservatives will be happy to help, it seems.

Woe and gloom have befallen some on the right. Bush has failed to act according to The Reagan Ideal.

The actual Reagan may have issued an amnesty for illegals, but the Ideal Reagan would have done no such thing. So unless Bush packs freight cars full of gardeners and dishwashers and dumps them off at the Mexican border, some voters will just sit this one out.

The Ideal Reagan would have eliminated the National Endowment for the Arts; the actual Reagan proposed a $1 million increase in his final budget. But Bush increased NEA funding. So angry conservatives might just sit this one out.

And if a Democrat takes office, and the Michael Moores and Rob Reiners and Martin Sheens crowd the airwaves on Nov. 3 to shout their howls of vindication? If the inevitable renaissance of Iraq happens on Kerry's watch, and the economy truly picks up steam in the first few years before the business cycle and Kerry's tax hikes kick in? If emboldened Islamist terrorists smell blood and strike again? Fine. Maybe the next Republican president will do everything they want.

-snip-

[TomasUSMC]

And by taking a course of action that puts Bush in the White House we will convince the Republicans to change course?

More likely, we will merely convince the Republicans that we are sheeple and the Republicans will see NO reason to stick their necks out for US.

[onyx]

Ignoring the fact more than 1/5 people here are so disgusted with bush they plan on voting for someone else....

You-HOO, anybody home?

As Howlin has already pointed out, FR is home to more right-wing zealots than the general population. But, surely you knew that, didn't you?

[reformedliberal]

No, you specifically did not mention Reagan, but he not only is often invoked, he is the only conservative to gain the WH in my adult life.

As my screen name indicates, I was on the Left. I was an organizer of food co-ops in the 60s. I believed in bootstrap capitalism and still do. I am intimately aware of the agenda of the Left & I was effectively purged because self-reliance and independance is not the Leftist goal. What W and the present Republicans are doing is NOT implementing the Democratic Left's agenda at all. They are co-opting it. Each of the programs takes the core issue of the Left and subtly aims it towards privatization or, in the case of the NEA, puts retraints on the funding to get away from the culture-killing stuff. The NCLB is an accountability act and it demands performance/results in exchange for funding. Why does the Left scream so loudly if the agenda is theirs? It is not theirs and they know it and they are fighting for their lives. Who knows? At some point, the Left may demand that the Federal Government gets out of education and the Left may champion vouchers and charters for the reason that they do not want governmental control. Voila: no DOE.

The Republican Party will not go whole hog into the Leftist agenda because that is not what they want. They do not want socialism and a divided society and devalued culture and devalued education. No sane person does, including sane, moderate Democrats. Instead of trolling for Democratic votes, IMO, the Republican Party is slowly getting Americans used to being moderate to liberal Republicans. Eventually, the agenda can be further to the right than that, but they have to begin somewhere. They have to take what they find, what we have been left with after 70 years of change agents, and change it again. There is no way they could get away with just killing NEA or DOE, for example. Too many sacred cows, too many paychecks are involved. But they can move it away from social engineering of the Leftist sort and towards the social engineering of the center right sort.

You are not going to get hard right conservatism out of the Republican Party UNTIL the Left is so marginalized that there is no longer as large a constituency for it as there is now. It is conservative incrementalism. The Dems know this. The electorate is mostly oblivious and they make do w/what they have. One of the best things about Reagan was that while it was a counter-revolution, most people did so well that they loved it & didn't even know they had been co-opted. This drove the Left absolutely nuts and this is why the Bush administration drives them up a wall. Reagan allowed the Bush wins. Bush I was too much the old school patrician gentleman and he was rolled by the Dems (and that is why I voted for Perot and voting for Perot is why I will fight to keep Bush voters from going 3rd Party). The Dems knew they could not only roll Bush I, they could roll the conservatives, as well. Twofers. And it gave us Clinton.


Bush II, if he gets a 2nd term, will allow another Republican to get elected. This will ensure a lock on the Congress. Slowly, via tax cuts and spending cuts, there will be less government bureaucracy. Which will save more money. As more people become owners and investors, they all have a stake in less taxes, less spending. There are already fewer constituents for pork and hand outs, if you go by the outcry against the budget. This has already happened;the Dems are left w/the unions, such as they are and the hard core welfare class. So it is no wonder they work to degrade the culture and education so they will have more constituents for government control via handouts & more libertinism.

I doubt I'll see a hard right administration in my life time...I am 61. But my son, who is 39, may well see it. And actually, if the incrementalism works, no one will notice and it will be considered centrist, not far right. Then, the power will be divided betwen centrist and conservatives and the conservatives wil have more fertile ground for their ideas.

My contention is that you and those of your philosophical persuasion have already gotten 60% at the very least. IMO, I think you are missing the forest for the trees. I think it is unrealistic in the extreme (pardon the pun) to expect a complete roll back of 70 years of socialism in 3 years, especially w/a war and the entire world working for the Left.

Each day 1000 FDR Democrats die. Each day more children who are rebelling against the public school and public culture inculcations reach voting age & identify as Republicans. Each day that more people have more chance of ownership and control of their lives and the chance to acculmulate assets is a day closer to a USA that is full of self-reliant folks w/the self interest to understand small government.

I think our day is coming. I know the Left is counting on impatient and demanding conservatives to divide Bush's constituency so they can elevate what is left of their constituency to regain power.

Now, I absolutely have to go check out this Kerry bimbo eruption, so I will be off this thread. But I am sure we will have this conversation elsewhere.

[N3WBI3]

And the general population is home to far more democrats than FR, whats your point. If bush does not own the Right he is in real trouble, people here seem to forget he lost the popular vote and snuck by in FLA to win. I voted for him for the same reason I voted for Dole because 'he is better than a democrat' after the amnesty, oh Im sorry Legal status to law breakers bush put up Im done.

I live in a swing state MN which is trending R lately but is a toss up. I will go and vote for my Republican Housemember, and State officials, but not for Bush. My wife feels the same way as do more than 20% of free republic members.

When a Republican cant get more than 90% on FR and you know the left is not going to vote for him (not even the center left) that leaves him in real trouble. Bush has a few months to win me back we will see how it goes..

[Amelia]

Gore should give this speech at the convention. Why not? Why not stand up and give vent to all the poisons hatching in the muck? Why not tell America that Bush lied about everything, that he took the country to war for reasons he knew would be discredited, just so Halliburton could make another buck or two? It's what they seem to believe, after all. The delusions of their fringe have become articles of faith for the mainstream. Bush was AWOL! Bush knew! Bush lied! Bush never flosses! Skull and Bones! Plastic turkey!

At least we'll have a clear choice in November. Bush is serious about the war. The Democrats are serious about the war against Bush.

Some conservatives are on the Democrats' side in the war against Bush.

[KantianBurke]

Either post evidence to prove that assertion or shut up. Ironic that those who criticise Bush for acting like a liberal are themselves accused of being a liberal.

[CA Conservative]

It's better than claiming to fight a war on terrorism, while allowing the terrorist to waltz across the boarder all day.

And which of the possible Democrat candidates would do better? Last I heard, Kerry wants to grant unconditional amnesty and immediate citizenship.

I am not a big fan of the way immigration is being handled, but if you decide to vote against Bush on that one issue, you are voting for a worse policy that he has proposed - and for more liberal justices on SCOTUS, more aborted babies, Kyoto, UN domination over our foreign policy... all of the things the Dems want to impose on our country. Just keep the big picture in mind.

[Swanks]

Once again, and every four years at election time: Don't you stupid conservatives know your place on the Plantation? Yours is not to lead; yours is to vote RINO every four years, and we'll drive things from there.

This piece is the same old "F-U-D" (fear uncertaintly and doubt of the Rat Party in power) Party line dredged up to keep the slaves on the plantation. Ain't gonna work this time though.

[Swanks]

Bush is never going to make you happy.....so get behind him and support him and quit whining

Thats the trouble with so many like you on FR. Support and shut up; the only option. How about we 'get behind more complaining and quit supporting' him as an option?

There's a concept thats foregn to your myopic thinking.

[CA Conservative]

Now that "we have no where to go" they are less inclined to "lean to the right".

It's not so much that conservatives have no where else to go - it is because the Republican Party doesn't feel like it can depend on social conservatives. Millions sat out the 2000 election or voted Buchanan, causing a potential Constitutional crisis. With every decision they don't like, the "true conservatives" threaten to bolt to a third-party. The term "fair-weather friend" comes to mind. So Rove and company may be thinking that they are better off appealing to the center rather than the right wing.

If you are tempted to allow Bush to lose just to show the Republican Party they need conservatives, let me give you a bit of a warning - if Bush loses because of the conservatives bolting or staying home, it will be a generation or more before a conservative candidate is nominated again. The party will go further left to find a reliable base, rather than back to the right, and conservatives will be back in the wilderness, like in the 60's and 70's.

[arasina]

MAGNIFICENT post, Howlin! Obviously written from the fire in the belly! An inspirational "keeper" post!

[arasina]

Those who care about America's future don't dismiss the significant accomplishments of this President as if they were well within reach of just any man and then claim to be betrayed beyond reason.

Well said, Dolphy!

[TomasUSMC]

President Bush gives us the costly prescription drug benefit, the two thirds increase in education spending, the refusal to enforce our borders, the giving Illegals social security benefits, the extension on the assault weapons ban, The Pro Outsourcing stance, money for the NEA, the Pro Nafta job sucking stance, the pro H1b stance and the spending (which exceeded anything Clinton ever asked for)?

If President Bush doesn't stop this, HE, will lose and HE will ensure:

- more liberal justices on SCOTUS, more aborted babies, Kyoto, UN domination over our foreign policy... all of the things the Dems want to impose on our country. Just keep the big picture in mind.

It is not the people who are to represent the will of the President,
It is the President who is to represent the will of the People.

The GOP has till the convention to turn the ship to the Right or:

No Borders - No Votes

[Mudboy Slim]

"Look, whether you like it or not, Bush is Bush; your whining is not going to change."

Not necessarily true, my FRiend...after hearing the unrest of fiscal conservatives after the SOTU address, Dubyuh switched his proposed growth in discretionary domestic spending from 4% to 1% annually and has proposed cuts in--or elimination of--some 128 federal programs. IMHO, this is good for the Country, the GOP, and fer Dubyuh. Thanks be to the so-called "whiners."

"The Republican Party has ONE CANDIDATE this year, the year of our Lord, 2004. We ARE going to elect him to the White House. If you choose not to help, fine. But, for the love of God, STOP FIGHTING US."

FWIW, I do not believe I--and other constructive criticizers--am fighting you and the BushOrBusters. We are simply fighting against the un-conservative domestic policy proposals that are floated by the Bush Administration. I've been working some 20+ years to get a GOP POTUS paired with a GOP Congress and it's simply not acceptable to finally accomplish said goal only to see us enact the DemonRAT's Agenda on far too many issues.

"He IS the candidate, period. And if you don't want to vote for him, fine; go find yourselves another candidate and vote for him. BUT GET OUT OF THE WAY -- we are NOT going to sit here and let you people hand this country back over to the Democrats so they can destroy our security."

For me personally, it would be a travesty to allow a DemonRAT become Commander-in-Chief when we are smack dab in the middle of a very important War on Terrorism. That said, I believe it is equally important to assist in providing pressure from the Right to counteract the Milquetoast Moderates within the Bush Administration who are far too willing to compromise away conservative principles in a desperate effort to attract votes from folks who simply don't like Dubyuh and probably never will.

FReegards...MUD

[onyx]

Good. Thanks for your honesty. You are not voting for Bush, (at this point in time) so you're not much different from a ticket-splitting democrat.

[hchutch]

Agreed. In a sense, it may already be happening to an extent.

[Consort]

How about we 'get behind more complaining and quit supporting' him as an option?

Been there, done that fatigue. The first criticism is a complaint; all repetitions are whines.

[onyx]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1069214/posts?page=712

Any person claiming to be conservative who is not motivated to keep the Democrats out of power after knowing EXACTLY what they will do with it if given the opportunity, has a real problem with reality. They're either political martyrs, have not been paying attention to what the Democrat candidates have been promising they will do if elected, or are ignoring (or are totally or willfully ignorant of) the history of the last seventy years, or are incredibly dense or insane, or have a morbid desire to toil their lives away in the misery of a Liberal Hell! Any person who would support a third party candidate who has absolutely zero chance of winning even one state or even a single electoral vote is so politically naive and devoid of the brainpower that The Creator so graciously endowed upon them, that it's not even worth wasting pixels on.

And I can tell you, that I probably won't be wasting very many more pixels on people who are coming to FR to trash and bash our candidates and or to trash and bash and drive away the very posters I'm trying to attract. If the intent of third party supporters is to cause as much hell and discontent on our forum and to inflict as much damage to FR as they possibly can, well, I can assure you we will have many fewer third party posters left on FR very soon. The LePur colony can have them. Thank you very much.

It might be different if there was a primary involved. These kind of battles need to take place as part of the process of selecting the best person to run. In this case, there will be no primary. God willing and barring any major disasters, George W. Bush will be the candidate. So it will either be Bush or one of the Democrats that gets elected. No one else stands a snowball's chance in hell. And I've given every person on this web site plenty of advance notice (I've been saying it for the last three years) that FR will NOT be used to help replace Bush with a Democrat. Period. End of story.

Again, if that is your intent, leave now or get yourself banned later. Excessive and repetitive attacks on our candidates or our posters will not be tolerated. Try your luck at DUh or LibertyPost. In presidential politics, they are interchangeable.


712 posted on 02/01/2004 3:55:33 PM PST by Jim Robinson (I don't belong to no organized political party. I'm a Republycan.)
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[CA Conservative]

You want solutions? I'll give your solutions: Close down the border and deport illegals who aren't working.

Well, how about some realistic solutions, not a wish list. Although what you suggest might be nice, it wouldnot have enough popular support to actually be implemented.

Stop making every child born of illegals an American citizen.

This requires an act of Congress. I seriously doubt that Bush would veto such a bill if it got to his desk, but he cannot impose it by exectuive order. So your complaint here is with Congress, not Bush.

Stop the insane spending spree in Washington.

Everyone blames Bush, but all spending bills originate in the House, and the President cannot spend one dime that Congress does not authorize. So while Bush is a part of the problem, the real problem is Congress. The spending spree started long before Bush arrived, and will continue after he leaves, no matter who is President.

Fight for conservative judges and kick Orin Hatch's arse back to Utah.

Bush has picked great judges, and has stood by them all of the way. It is up to the Senate to confirm them, and while Hatch is part of the problem, it is not up to Bush to send him back to Utah - that is up to the citizens of that state.

Fine companies who are outsourcing American jobs,

Bush does not have the ability to do that, because it is not against any law (nor should it be). This is something I would expect from either a Democrat or a Patsy (Buchanan supporter).

[KentTrappedInLiberalSeattle]

I doubt I'll see a hard right administration in my life time...I am 61. But my son, who is 39, may well see it. And actually, if the incrementalism works, no one will notice and it will be considered centrist, not far right. Then, the power will be divided betwen centrist and conservatives and the conservatives wil have more fertile ground for their ideas.

My contention is that you and those of your philosophical persuasion have already gotten 60% at the very least. IMO, I think you are missing the forest for the trees. I think it is unrealistic in the extreme (pardon the pun) to expect a complete roll back of 70 years of socialism in 3 years, especially w/a war and the entire world working for the Left.

My G-D, but I wish I had written that.

My hat, sir. :)