2nd ID Seeks to Curb Lap Dancing at Clubs

Stars and Stripes Pacific Edition ^ | 01/26/04 | Seth Robson

[Modernman]

CAMP RED CLOUD, South Korea - The 2nd Infantry Division wants lap dancing banned in Area I nightclubs frequented by U.S. soldiers, according to documents to be presented this week to the Korean Special Tourist Association and local mayors.

Club owners and mayors will have 30 days to respond to a proposed association and 2nd ID Good Commerce Practices Guide, which sets out standards expected of clubs near U.S. bases in Area I.

Last year lap dancing was explicitly authorized in an attachment to the 2nd ID's 2002-2003 policy. The proposed guide states: "Though lap dancing is authorized under 2nd Infantry Division policy, it has not been defined. For the purposes of good order and discipline, lap dancing will be defined here," and the definition integrated into conduct standards.

The proposed guide defines lap dancing as an activity that occurs "when a club dancer is approached by or offers to dance for a soldier … typically of the opposite sex. This interaction between dancer and soldier is typically done at very close quarters."

The guide then imposes such strict rules for the practice that it effectively bans it, stating, "This type of behavior does not honor either individual involved. Since soldiers are soldiers 24/7, they are not at liberty to lower their professional bearing after hours."

It suggests lap dancing be treated as "client-focused exotic dancing" and that club owners "prohibit any physical contact between dancers and customers" and "ban the practice of customers placing money/bills in dancers' garments: g-strings, bras, garters or other apparel." The guide also would "require that private dances in remote areas of the club be directly visible" to military police inspecting a club.

The man who wrote the guide, 2nd ID assistant chief of staff Lt. Col. Chris Bailey, said he researched lap dancing laws in the United States and Britain before preparing the policy.

"We are following trends in the U.S.," Bailey said. "Lap dancing has taken on a new level of interest in the American media. It is outlawed in Los Angeles and Las Vegas."

He said lap dancing is associated with other undesirable activity such as human trafficking, which the proposed guide also includes measures to prevent. The 2nd ID also has imposed other rules and procedures in recent years after media reports that suggested the military was doing too little to prevent human trafficking in South Korea.

The new policy also states that clubs for South Korean augmentees to the U.S. military should "not tolerate prostitution or human trafficking."

Sgt. 1st Class Stuart Greer, of the 2nd ID's Headquarters and Headquarters Company, told soldiers gathered at Camp Red Cloud for New Horizon Day earlier this month that hundreds of thousands of women are human trafficking victims each year.

The crime often involves women duped into moving to a foreign country, then forced to become sex workers there. Greer said he learned about human trafficking after meeting his Philippine wife when she was working in a South Korean nightclub.

"When I was dating my wife, I found out her sister in Bahrain hadn't been paid in 10 months. She was working 16 hours a day, six days a week. Through many e-mails and telephone calls we took this guy to court and he had to pay her and return her to the Philippines," he said.

Southeast Asia is a major source of human trafficking, as is the former Soviet Union, Greer said.

"In 2002, news organizations connected trafficking with the military in South Korea," he said. They suggested that U.S. military "courtesy patrols" were guarding establishments that engaged in human trafficking and condoned prostitution. Indicators of trafficking include money exchanged between soldiers and club employees for unexplained reasons or employees that cannot leave clubs and have no access to their passports, he said.

Greer said he is certain prostitution still happens at some clubs in Area I.

"My wife came here as a dancer. She went to dance school. The club owner said, 'You can dance and make $500 a month or you can sit with the customers and if they buy you a drink you will make more.' But I have heard of other people in clubs that actually engage in prostitution.

"In the club she sat next to me and talked," he said. "The other clubs, they do lap dances."

The Good Commerce Practices Guide will be presented at a Jan. 30 dinner to be attended by Brig. Gen. John Shortal, 2nd ID assistant division commander for support, officials said.

[Cogadh na Sith]

The worst time to be in the Armed Forces. We were a bunch of HS drop outs. Many were there because prosecutors gave them a choice between that and jail. But we did miraculous things with the tools we had

That is absolutely true. I don't know how you guys did it. I went in in '86 and saw some of the 'good ol days'. Clinton was awful. We were well trained and motivated, but the Wesley Clark-type leadership just sucked. We did miserable things with the tools we had--witness 911.

I honestly have a hard time being proud of my service. I left in '95 pretty much disgusted.

I can't believe I ended up enlisting in the guard. It was kind of cool that my reenlistment happens to fall on 9/11, tho.

[I got the rope]

Look 162 and no pics for you...jeesh. LOL.

[Old Sarge]

I'm amazed - to say nothing of mortified...

[Freedom4US]

Probably a mis-communication. Korea had a curfew during Gulf War I for example, and they were also "locked" in place - no PCS in or out - but was still a whole lot better than living in the sandbox, and I'm pretty sure they were able to imbibe off duty.

As far as Germany, units that are slated to deploy probably have some alcohol restrictions just prior, but a blanket ban on alcohol across the board, in Germany, home of very fine beer and excellent wine? I gotta be skeptical.

[quietolong]

Way back in 75. For of us went and joined the Navy. In our junior year of HS. on delayed entry. and a year later one other of our classmates joined. And one of the “ smart kids” Going into the nukes as a O.
Coming in 76 It was more of a “war” time Navy. Vietnam was still somewhat winding down. Knowing and doing your job well got you ahead.
But could slowly see the change over to a peace time Navy. How well you could crease your uniform and brown nose got you ahead. And a lot more BS.
In 2001 we had our 25th HS reunion. I had not seen these guys since 76
One got out after 4 years. The nuke guy out after his min. term ( 8 years ?)
I did 10 ( coming very close to do the 20+ decision.) Every one else did 20-23 years. with one going thought the E ranks and becoming a Zero!
All made the decision to get out because they could no longer stand Billareys PC bs Military.

And now no beer, No steaming off.... Black “ French hats” BS... bullet shortages....
Since the 80s upper leadership has been declining. taking a nose dive in the 90s.

[Feckless]

The "Deuce"! 332d before it became B Co. Maj Faust marched us 10 miles out (to an undisclosed location) for the changeover ceremony just to keep the Bde/Bn REMF dweebs from coming. I worked for Chief Hanger in the Motor Hole, wife had just re-classed from welder to cook (same job if you ask me, still burning $hit up).

[Feckless]

You gotta get of that white rum, it'll rust yo' pipes, Mon. Get you some good Jamacian stuff. Meyers is the stuff if you can't get to the island for some homegrown. If you do you can forget about passing a p-test though.

[mywholebodyisaweapon]

Maybe he needs a lap dance.

[mywholebodyisaweapon]

You know the Greeks are very loyal. They never leave their friends behind.

[expatguy]

I say if you are old enough to die for your country then you are old enough to have a soju and a lap dance.

Or if you were like me and at Clark then make that a Red Horse and a screw.

[af_vet_1981]

I say if you are old enough to die for your country then you are old enough to have a soju and a lap dance. Or if you were like me and at Clark then make that a Red Horse and a screw.

Why should Americans be different from any other heathen culture ? Is it simply a restoration of the Roman Empire ?

[btcusn]

Since soldiers are soldiers 24/7, they are not at liberty to lower their professional bearing after hours.


Someone needs to slap some sense into this fool!!
remember, I&I is the light at the end of the tunnel.
Jack

[btcusn]

Way back in 75. For of us went and joined the Navy. In our junior year of HS. on delayed entry. and a year later one other of our classmates joined. And one of the “ smart kids” Going into the nukes as a O.
Coming in 76 It was more of a “war” time Navy. Vietnam was still somewhat winding down. Knowing and doing your job well got you ahead.
But could slowly see the change over to a peace time Navy. How well you could crease your uniform and brown nose got you ahead. And a lot more BS.
In 2001 we had our 25th HS reunion. I had not seen these guys since 76
One got out after 4 years. The nuke guy out after his min. term ( 8 years ?)
I did 10 ( coming very close to do the 20+ decision.) Every one else did 20-23 years. with one going thought the E ranks and becoming a Zero!
All made the decision to get out because they could no longer stand Billareys PC bs Military.

And now no beer, No steaming off.... Black “ French hats” BS... bullet shortages....
Since the 80s upper leadership has been declining. taking a nose dive in the 90s.

I served at the same time, 75-95 retired as BTC and yes it got worse every year in the 80's. Clinton was the last straw.
Jack

[quietolong]

Man... Must have had some brain cells die off. Can’t remember what BTC stands for?

[btcusn]

Man... Must have had some brain cells die off. Can’t remember what BTC stands for?
Happens to the best of us.
Boiler Tech Chief
Now Big Time Civillian
Jack

[quietolong]

Aggggr Thanks! You know what they say...Go with your first instinct. That’s what I thought.
Being a AO ( Aviation Ordinance ) We did not have any aircraft powered by Boilers;)

[btcusn]

Being a AO ( Aviation Ordinance ) We did not have any aircraft powered by Boilers;)
Maybe not, but your transportation and cats were, at least on the Midway they were.
My dad was a AO during the Korean war, stationed at Willow Grove, Pa.

[quietolong]

No. I was in P-3s my whole time. Close as I got to a Carrier was flying over the Midway at Subic when landing Cubie Point And stopping by to see if a friend from A school was onboard.
Still somewhat of a small world My Dad was a Radio operator on the FDR during Korea.