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2nd ID Seeks to Curb Lap Dancing at Clubs
Stars and Stripes Pacific Edition ^ | 01/26/04 | Seth Robson

Posted on 01/29/2004 7:20:48 AM PST by Modernman

CAMP RED CLOUD, South Korea - The 2nd Infantry Division wants lap dancing banned in Area I nightclubs frequented by U.S. soldiers, according to documents to be presented this week to the Korean Special Tourist Association and local mayors.

Club owners and mayors will have 30 days to respond to a proposed association and 2nd ID Good Commerce Practices Guide, which sets out standards expected of clubs near U.S. bases in Area I.

Last year lap dancing was explicitly authorized in an attachment to the 2nd ID's 2002-2003 policy. The proposed guide states: "Though lap dancing is authorized under 2nd Infantry Division policy, it has not been defined. For the purposes of good order and discipline, lap dancing will be defined here," and the definition integrated into conduct standards.

The proposed guide defines lap dancing as an activity that occurs "when a club dancer is approached by or offers to dance for a soldier … typically of the opposite sex. This interaction between dancer and soldier is typically done at very close quarters."

The guide then imposes such strict rules for the practice that it effectively bans it, stating, "This type of behavior does not honor either individual involved. Since soldiers are soldiers 24/7, they are not at liberty to lower their professional bearing after hours."

It suggests lap dancing be treated as "client-focused exotic dancing" and that club owners "prohibit any physical contact between dancers and customers" and "ban the practice of customers placing money/bills in dancers' garments: g-strings, bras, garters or other apparel." The guide also would "require that private dances in remote areas of the club be directly visible" to military police inspecting a club.

The man who wrote the guide, 2nd ID assistant chief of staff Lt. Col. Chris Bailey, said he researched lap dancing laws in the United States and Britain before preparing the policy.

"We are following trends in the U.S.," Bailey said. "Lap dancing has taken on a new level of interest in the American media. It is outlawed in Los Angeles and Las Vegas."

He said lap dancing is associated with other undesirable activity such as human trafficking, which the proposed guide also includes measures to prevent. The 2nd ID also has imposed other rules and procedures in recent years after media reports that suggested the military was doing too little to prevent human trafficking in South Korea.

The new policy also states that clubs for South Korean augmentees to the U.S. military should "not tolerate prostitution or human trafficking."

Sgt. 1st Class Stuart Greer, of the 2nd ID's Headquarters and Headquarters Company, told soldiers gathered at Camp Red Cloud for New Horizon Day earlier this month that hundreds of thousands of women are human trafficking victims each year.

The crime often involves women duped into moving to a foreign country, then forced to become sex workers there. Greer said he learned about human trafficking after meeting his Philippine wife when she was working in a South Korean nightclub.

"When I was dating my wife, I found out her sister in Bahrain hadn't been paid in 10 months. She was working 16 hours a day, six days a week. Through many e-mails and telephone calls we took this guy to court and he had to pay her and return her to the Philippines," he said.

Southeast Asia is a major source of human trafficking, as is the former Soviet Union, Greer said.

"In 2002, news organizations connected trafficking with the military in South Korea," he said. They suggested that U.S. military "courtesy patrols" were guarding establishments that engaged in human trafficking and condoned prostitution. Indicators of trafficking include money exchanged between soldiers and club employees for unexplained reasons or employees that cannot leave clubs and have no access to their passports, he said.

Greer said he is certain prostitution still happens at some clubs in Area I.

"My wife came here as a dancer. She went to dance school. The club owner said, 'You can dance and make $500 a month or you can sit with the customers and if they buy you a drink you will make more.' But I have heard of other people in clubs that actually engage in prostitution.

"In the club she sat next to me and talked," he said. "The other clubs, they do lap dances."

The Good Commerce Practices Guide will be presented at a Jan. 30 dinner to be attended by Brig. Gen. John Shortal, 2nd ID assistant division commander for support, officials said.


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs
KEYWORDS: 2ndid; korea; lapdancing; military; militarybases; prostitution; southkorea; strip
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To: jpl
But I think it's a bit of a stretch to equate a lap dance with rape.

Are you comfortable with the women in your family providing these services to foreign troops ?

Why should they not be able to rape them when they feel entitled. Aren't they as good as the NBA ?

81 posted on 01/29/2004 11:40:23 AM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: cyborg
I hope we learn from things like Shan-gri-La RR bases and Vietnam entertainment clubs.

Apparently we have if the largest growth industry for American women is porn related ...

82 posted on 01/29/2004 11:43:01 AM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: ladtx
How things have changed. I can remember going to the O club for lunch in the early 70's for the great roast beef sandwiches and, oh yeah maybe a glimpse of the topless waitresses.

Yep. In the late '80s they were still doing lunch time "Fashion Shows" at the Miramar Chief’s Club.

83 posted on 01/29/2004 11:43:23 AM PST by TankerKC (My life is a Country Song.)
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To: af_vet_1981
Oh no no... I don't think this is the attitude of today's military and certainly don't think it's all FR. I definately think the military is more refined and polished than the military of yesteryear. I'm not saying guys shouldn't have their fun either. BUT if I was a military wife at home struggling on BAQ pay or whatever they call it, I wouldn't be happy about this.
84 posted on 01/29/2004 11:44:18 AM PST by cyborg
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To: af_vet_1981
Are you comfortable with the women in your family providing these services to foreign troops?

I have a younger sister that I love dearly, and I certainly wouldn't want her being a stripper or anything like that. On the other hand, I don't grill her about the intimate details of her sex life, because it would make me uncomfortable, and besides it's not any of my business.

I think your last comment is a little ridiculous, and I'm not really sure why you're electing to make this personal.

85 posted on 01/29/2004 11:44:52 AM PST by jpl
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To: af_vet_1981
Don't think for an instant that it represents the mainstream of the military

The fact that strip clubs and brothels are always prevalent around military bases would seem to suggest that this IS pretty mainstream within our armed forces.

86 posted on 01/29/2004 11:45:07 AM PST by Modernman ("The details of my life are quite inconsequential...." - Dr. Evil)
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To: af_vet_1981
Apparently we have if the largest growth industry for American women is porn related

Nursing?

87 posted on 01/29/2004 11:46:21 AM PST by Modernman ("The details of my life are quite inconsequential...." - Dr. Evil)
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To: jpl
No I'm not equating lap dancing with rape. However, combine alcohol with pent up sexual arousal and a permissive sexual atmosphere, and that's asking for trouble. BTW, I don't think this happens THAT often either otherwise we'd definately hear about it. I'm just concerned about the military encouraging vulgarity, esp. since a lot of these men are MARRIED.
88 posted on 01/29/2004 11:47:51 AM PST by cyborg
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To: Modernman
That is an interesting euphemism for a show called Larry Flynt, MD.
89 posted on 01/29/2004 11:47:58 AM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: chookter
I'm curious exactly when they decided to start enforcing this idiotic decision. My son left Germany in the summer of 2002 and has never heard of this rule
90 posted on 01/29/2004 11:48:49 AM PST by boxerblues (If you can read this.. Thank a Teacher..If you can read this in English ..Thank a US Soldier)
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To: af_vet_1981
Lighten up Francis...sheeesh..
91 posted on 01/29/2004 11:48:57 AM PST by dakine
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To: Blzbba
I think I would be more concerned of my boys didnt want to see naked women :)
92 posted on 01/29/2004 11:50:09 AM PST by boxerblues (If you can read this.. Thank a Teacher..If you can read this in English ..Thank a US Soldier)
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To: Modernman
I can see Uday or Qusay Hussein frequenting such establishments but I don't think I'd see George W. Bush or John Ashcroft there.

Do you approve of that service industry for the women in your extended family ?

93 posted on 01/29/2004 11:50:35 AM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: af_vet_1981
Yes you are right about the growth of the porn industry but most of it is in movies/internet since brick-mortar places are going out of style. There will always be people who will use porn to satisfy various 'needs' BUT I don't think vulgarity should be the order of the day.
94 posted on 01/29/2004 11:51:40 AM PST by cyborg
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To: af_vet_1981
According to the department of labor, the two biggest growth areas for jobs in the US in the next decade are computer services and medical services.
95 posted on 01/29/2004 11:51:56 AM PST by Modernman ("The details of my life are quite inconsequential...." - Dr. Evil)
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To: dakine
Lighten up Francis...sheeesh..

Do you approve of the women in your extended family providing these services to foreign troops ?

96 posted on 01/29/2004 11:52:29 AM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: Askel5
"So long as the cyber children are "faked" who are used to elicit real ejaculations from the more criminal of the voyeurs who fund our gabillion dollar sex industry"

I love it when you talk dirty.

97 posted on 01/29/2004 11:53:14 AM PST by truthandjustice1
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To: boxerblues
I found this out from a fellow who returned in July-August 2003. He said it was relatively new.
98 posted on 01/29/2004 11:54:58 AM PST by Cogadh na Sith (The Guns of Brixton)
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To: af_vet_1981
I can see Uday or Qusay Hussein frequenting such establishments but I don't think I'd see George W. Bush or John Ashcroft there.

I'm sure W. got a lap dance or two back when he was younger. He did party quite a bit back in the day.

Do you approve of that service industry for the women in your extended family ?

I already told you I don't. What's your point?

99 posted on 01/29/2004 11:55:10 AM PST by Modernman ("The details of my life are quite inconsequential...." - Dr. Evil)
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To: Modernman
Well we know Neal Bush sure did. According to papers, he left a child back in Thailand or where it was he was carousing.
100 posted on 01/29/2004 11:57:05 AM PST by cyborg
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