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If ya gottem, you can still smoke 'em! Pierce county, WA. State smoking ban update...
Seattle Times | 1/23/04 | Kyung M. Song

Posted on 01/23/2004 3:46:14 PM PST by JDoutrider

Judge snuffs out ban on smoking; Pierce County board will appeal

By Kyung M. Song Seattle Times staff reporter

A Pierce County Superior Court judge yesterday overturned the county health board's blanket ban on smoking in public places, ruling that the ban illegally co-opts state law that specifically exempts bars, restaurants, taverns and bowling alleys from having to be smoke-free.

Judge Ronald Culpepper issued an injunction against the smoking ban, prompting the Tacoma/Pierce County Board of Health to immediately suspend enforcing its 3-week-old landmark resolution. The health board said it will appeal Culpepper's ruling.

Linda Matson, executive director of the Entertainment Industry Coalition, a business group that had sought the injunction, said Culpepper's ruling reinforced her group's argument that Pierce County's ban conflicts with a 1985 Washington law.

"No matter how you split it, the state law specifically allows these places that are privately owned to have designated smoking areas," Matson said. "Now the ball's in the Legislature's court."

Paul Lawrence, the attorney who represents the Tacoma/Pierce County Board of Health, said he disagreed with Culpepper's decision.

"His legal reasoning was erroneous," Lawrence said. "We are confident that the court of appeals will overturn it."

And in the Legislature, all signs point to no for a bill to ban smoking in all public, indoor places — including restaurants, bars, nightclubs and casinos.

Alex Deccio, R-Yakima, the chairman of the Senate Health Committee, says it won't survive the session. House and Senate leaders indicate the prospects are dim. And even the usually optimistic sponsor, Republican Sen. Bob Oke of Port Orchard, said he doesn't think the ban will happen this year.

Joby Winans, a spokeswoman for the health board, said staff members will begin notifying business owners that their establishments no longer need to be smoke-free. Smoking is still prohibited in other types of public places, including retail stores, buses, museums, schools, theaters and government buildings.

"However, we are strongly urging all facilities to continue with the smoking ban as a good public-health policy which will save lives and protect the health of both customers and employees," Winans said.

Out of the 3,000 restaurants, bars, casinos and cafes affected by Pierce County's ban, about 50 businesses were refusing to enforce the ban. The health board had been poised to start issuing fines instead of warnings in the event that Culpepper ruled in its favor.

From the start, the Tacoma/Pierce County health board's unanimous vote last month for the smoking ban relied on testing the legal boundary between when local laws may pre-empt state laws. Doubts about the legality of local bans had led Puyallup and King County — twice — to scrap their own proposals.

In 1998, Jeffrey Even, an assistant Washington attorney general, advised a legislator that Washington's Clean Indoor Air Act was explicit in forbidding local governments from enacting smoking bans that went beyond the state law.

But when Pierce County inquired about the state law late last year, Attorney General Christine Gregoire replied that Even's 1998 opinion was informal and nonbinding. Gregoire also wrote that she supported giving local governments the right to ban smoking and that her office would not oppose the health board if its actions led to a court fight — as expected.

Matson, of the entertainment coalition, said Federico Cruz-Uribe, the head of the Pierce County health board, should not spend any more taxpayer money pursuing a case that lacks legal merit.

"Dr. Cruz has the right and apparently unlimited resources to file an appeal," Matson said. "At some point, do we have a government of law or of men?"

Matson said Washington's Clean Air act has withstood nearly two decades of review. She argued that the public already is well protected in restaurants, the vast majority of which either don't allow smoking or set aside nonsmoking areas.

"Nonsmokers have a choice," she said. "They can go to a nonsmoking place, and there are lots and lots of them."


TOPICS: Front Page News; News/Current Events; US: Washington
KEYWORDS: banthis; breathtaking; kooljudge; pufflist; smokin; smokingbans
"Nonsmokers have a choice," she said. "They can go to a nonsmoking place, and there are lots and lots of them."

Finally some sanity rears it's head!

They can have my camels when they take them from my cold, dead, nicotined stained hands!

MOLON LABE!

1 posted on 01/23/2004 3:46:15 PM PST by JDoutrider
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To: SheLion
ping
2 posted on 01/23/2004 4:00:10 PM PST by Libertarianize the GOP (Ideas have consequences)
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To: JDoutrider; SheLion
There's a battle brewing over this. 1986 Clean air act of Washington exempted bars, restaurants, bowling alleys, etc. from the no public smoking rule. A piss ant, so called Republican health department director, (who just dropped out of the race for governor yesterday), enacted this rule in defiance of state law.

Another BAD Republican who gets reelected because he was once conservative, is writing a bill in the legislature today to close this loophole. He'll be probably successful.
3 posted on 01/23/2004 5:43:23 PM PST by bigfootbob
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To: Gabz
ping
4 posted on 01/23/2004 9:58:48 PM PST by Eala (Sacrificing tagline fame for... TRAD ANGLICAN RESOURCE PAGE: http://eala.freeservers.com/anglican)
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To: JDoutrider
How to have fun with the Anti-Smoking Groupies...Ask them what the Radon Gas levels are, in the Group's offices, in the member's home, etc....They won't have clue!

Yet Radon is the #2 cause...etc.

Hint: Radon is released from deep underground. It rises and disipates, unless trapped or slowed by a structure.

I live in a High Radon area, my house is old and drafty {low Radon levels above the basement, lowest on the 2nd floor where my computer is & where the bedrooms are}. I work {mostly} outdoors {low Radon }.

The "Smoking Areas", in local restaurants are fed outside air and scrubbed air {low radon}, the non-smoking areas are fed warmed or chilled "building and basement" air. Which should have the lower Radon Levels?
5 posted on 01/24/2004 12:30:18 AM PST by PizzaDriver (an heinleinian/libertarian)
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To: Libertarianize the GOP; bigfootbob; *puff_list; Just another Joe; Great Dane; Max McGarrity; ...
Thanks for the ping!!!

It never ceases to amaze me........waitstaff know when they go for a job in a bar that there will be smoking. If it bothers them, find a restaurant or a non-smoking bar to work at.

And if people are that "sensitive" to cigarette smoke, they do NOT have to go into an establishment to be around it. There are plenty of places for the "sensitive non-smoker" to go and spend recreational dollars. They don't need the whole world!


6 posted on 01/24/2004 6:56:15 AM PST by SheLion (Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
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To: JDoutrider; SheLion
And even the usually optimistic sponsor, Republican Sen. Bob Oke of Port Orchard, said he doesn't think the ban will happen this year.

It's always good to see a Republican sponsoring the restriction of property rights, ain't it? (/sarcasm)

7 posted on 01/24/2004 7:04:07 AM PST by metesky ("Brethren, leave us go amongst them." Rev. Capt. Samuel Johnston Clayton - Ward Bond- The Searchers)
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To: metesky
It's always good to see a Republican sponsoring the restriction of property rights, ain't it? (/sarcasm)

Yes, for sure. Damn RINO'S! I guess someone didn't grease his palm good enough this year!

8 posted on 01/24/2004 7:05:41 AM PST by SheLion (Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
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To: SheLion
This cr!p is getting momemntum here. Most of the whiners come down to the fact that their clothes "stink" on rheir infrequent visits to bars. Also, some clown was whining that his 5 year old has asthma. Solution - dont bring your kid to a bar.

What the problem is, is that the idiots have no idea what a tavern is as opposed to a restaurant.

How are you Mainers dealing with this nonsense? Dirigio!
9 posted on 01/24/2004 7:28:26 AM PST by Seajay (Ordem e Progresso)
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To: Seajay
How are you Mainers dealing with this nonsense? Dirigio!

Maine is only 24 days into the ban. I am still sitting quietly by, waiting for the fall-out to start.

It's bitterly cold here now. I sure can't see people who smoke going outside to have a cigarette when they go to a bar. I would rather stay home and cook and/or drink, where I am warm and comfortable.

How am I coping? I stay home and save my money instead of going out to eat. Pity. I am missing out on my recreation and this town is missing out on my money. A no-win situation.


10 posted on 01/24/2004 7:54:43 AM PST by SheLion (Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
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To: SheLion
Yeah ... bummer!

My cousin lives in one of the outer boroughs (Queens) of NYC. He says that as soon as the cold weather set in, there has been open defiance. Folks will sit in the pool table room, use empty beer cans for ashes, and smoke away.

The staff grouses and bitches, but a few nicely placed tips shut them up.
11 posted on 01/24/2004 8:19:02 AM PST by Seajay (Ordem e Progresso)
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To: JDoutrider
WOW, a judge who actually looks at the legalities, I am impressed.
12 posted on 01/24/2004 9:03:46 AM PST by Great Dane (You can smoke just about everywhere in Denmark.)
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To: PizzaDriver
Hint: Radon is released from deep underground. It rises and disipates, unless trapped or slowed by a structure.

You are right, and since houses are now so well sealed for energy efficiency, the Radon is a lot more concentrated ....... funny how the anti's never mention that.

13 posted on 01/24/2004 9:08:09 AM PST by Great Dane (You can smoke just about everywhere in Denmark.)
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To: Seajay
He says that as soon as the cold weather set in, there has been open defiance. Folks will sit in the pool table room, use empty beer cans for ashes, and smoke away.

I have NO idea how the professional "anti's" are going to enforce this law.

Are they going to hire "smoke police?" I read an article about how the bars in California after they were forced to go smoke free, developed ways of sneaking around.

The bars set up phone tree lines, and when the "smoke police" were on the prowl, they would call each other to warn everyone.

They used cans for ashtrays, and were easily thrown away if and should the "smoke police" would come in.

There were several other ways, too, but I can't remember them all.

14 posted on 01/24/2004 9:56:50 AM PST by SheLion (Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
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To: SheLion
BTTT for the weekend warriors...
15 posted on 01/24/2004 1:02:38 PM PST by JDoutrider
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