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The Pope's Thumbs Up for Gibson's 'Passion' (Liberal Jewish writer accuses Mel of using the Pope)
NY Times ^ | January 18, 2004 | FRANK RICH

Posted on 01/20/2004 8:36:11 AM PST by presidio9

Pope John Paul II, frail with Parkinson's at age 83, is rarely able to celebrate mass. In recent weeks, such annual holiday ceremonies as the ordination of bishops and the baptism of children in the Sistine Chapel were dropped from his schedule. But why should his suffering deter a Hollywood producer from roping him into a publicity campaign to sell a movie? In what is surely the most bizarre commercial endorsement since Eleanor Roosevelt did an ad for Good Luck Margarine in 1959, the ailing pontiff has been recruited, however unwittingly, to help hawk "The Passion of the Christ," as Mel Gibson's film about Jesus's final 12 hours is now titled. While Eleanor Roosevelt endorsed a margarine for charity, John Paul's free plug is being exploited by the Gibson camp to aid the movie star's effort to recoup the $25 million he personally sank into a biblical drama filmed in those crowd-pleasing tongues of Latin and Aramaic.

"Mel Gibson's `The Passion' gets a thumbs-up from the Pope," was the incongruously jolly image conjured up by a headline over Peggy Noonan's column for the Wall Street Journal Web site as she relayed the "happy news this Christmas season" on Dec. 17. Daily Variety, a day earlier, described John Paul as "a playwright and movie buff," lest anyone doubt that his credentials in movie reviewing were on a par with Roger Ebert's. Mr. Gibson's longtime producer, Steve McEveety, told Ms. Noonan that "The Passion" had been screened "at the pope's pad," after which John Paul declared of its account of the crucifixion, "It is as it was." That verdict was soon repeated by virtually every news outlet in the world, including The New York Times. In Ms. Noonan's view, the pope's blessing was likely to settle the controversy over a movie that Jewish and Christian critics alike have faulted for its potential to reignite the charge of deicide against the Jews. It was also perfectly timed to boost the bookings of a movie scheduled to open nationally on Feb. 25, Ash Wednesday.

Since I am one of the many curious Jews who have not been invited to press screenings of "The Passion," I have no first-hand way of knowing whether the film is benign or toxic and so instead must rely on eyewitnesses. In November, The New York Post got hold of a copy and screened it to five denominationally diverse New Yorkers, including its film critic. The Post is hardly hostile to Mr. Gibson; it is owned by Rupert Murdoch, whose Fox film studio has a long-standing deal with the star. Nonetheless, only one member of its chosen audience, a Baptist "Post reader," had kind words for "The Passion." Mark Hallinan, a priest at St. Ignatius Loyola Catholic Church, found the movie's portrayal of Jews "very bad," adding, "I don't think the intent was anti-Semitic, but Jews are unfairly portrayed." Robert Levine, the senior rabbi at Congregation Rodeph Sholom in Manhattan, called the film "appalling" and its portrayal of Jews "painful." On Christmas Day, Richard N. Ostling, the religion writer of The Associated Press, also analyzed "The Passion," writing that "while the script doesn't imply collective guilt for Jews as a people, there are villainous details that go beyond the Bible."

And so, John Paul's plug notwithstanding, the jury remains out on "The Passion." What can be said without qualification is that the marketing of this film remains a masterpiece of ugliness typical of our cultural moment, when hucksters wield holier-than-thou piety as a club for their own profit. For months now, Mr. Gibson and his supporters have tried to slur the religiosity of anyone who might dissent from his rollout of "The Passion." (And have succeeded, if my mail is any indication.) In The New Yorker last fall, the star labeled both The New York Times and The Los Angeles Times "anti-Christian" newspapers for running articles questioning his film and, in this vein, accused "modern secular Judaism" of wanting "to blame the Holocaust on the Catholic Church," a non sequitur of unambiguous malice.

This game of hard-knuckle religious politics is all too recognizable in our new millennium, when there are products to be sold and votes to be won by pandering to church-going Americans. At its most noxious, this was the game played by Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson on Sept. 13, 2001, when they went on TV to pin the terrorist attacks of two days earlier on God's wrath, which Mr. Falwell took it upon himself to say was aimed at all of those "who have tried to secularize America" by "throwing God out of the public square." The two men later apologized, but this didn't stop Mr. Robertson from declaring this month that he was hearing "from the Lord" that President Bush is going to win this year's election in a blowout. "It doesn't make any difference what he does, good or bad," Mr. Robertson said. "God picks him up because he's a man of prayer and God's blessing him."

Such us-vs.-them religious oneupmanship is more about political partisanship than liturgical debate. Its adherents practice what can only be called spiritual McCarthyism, a witch hunt in which "secularists" are targeted as if they were subversives and those who ostentatiously wrap themselves in God are patriots. Mr. Gibson has from the start plugged his movie into this political scheme; his first pre-emptive attack on the movie's critics (there weren't any yet) took place on "The O'Reilly Factor" a year ago. Not for nothing did he stack last July's initial screening of "The Passion" in Washington with conservative pundits like Ms. Noonan, Linda Chavez and Kate O'Beirne who are more known for their ideology than for their expertise in the history of the passion play's lethal fallout on Jews. (Should anyone not get the linkage of conspicuous sectarian piety with patriotism, Ms. Noonan produced a book titled "A Heart, a Cross, and a Flag: America Today" last summer.)

A more recent private screening of "The Passion" was attended by another conservative ideologue, the columnist Robert Novak, who was born to Jewish parents and converted to Catholicism. The movie, he wrote in November, is "free of the anti-Semitism that its detractors claim." Since then, he has joined other journalists in applying spiritual McCarthyism to the presidential race, noting darkly that reporters who followed Howard Dean on the campaign trail "recently observed that they never had seen so secular a presidential candidate, one who has never mentioned God and certainly not Christ." It's a measure of how fierce the demagoguery over religion has become that Dr. Dean now tries to fend off such attacks by suddenly (and unconvincingly) talking of how he prays every day, just as the president purports to do.

That a movie star would fan these culture wars for dollars is perhaps no surprise, but it demeans the pope to be drafted into that scheme. It also seems preposterous — so much so that I wondered whether the reports of the gravely ill John Paul's thumbs up for "The Passion" were true. A week after the stories first appeared, the highly respected Catholic News Service also raised that question, quoting "a senior Vatican official close to the pope" as saying that after seeing the movie, the pope "made no comment. The Holy Father does not comment, does not give judgments on art."

I sought clarification from the Vatican spokesman, Joaquin Navarro-Valls. His secretary, Rosangela Mancusi, responded by e-mail that "this office does not usually comment on the private activities of the Holy Father" and would neither confirm nor deny the pope's feelings about "The Passion." But she suggested that I contact "the two persons who brought the film to the Holy Father and gathered his comments" — Steve McEveety, Mr. Gibson's producer, and Jan Michelini, the movie's assistant director.

Mr. McEveety declined to speak with me from Hollywood, but last week I tracked down Mr. Michelini, an Italian who lives in Rome, by phone in Bombay, where he is working on another film. As he tells it, Mr. McEveety visited Rome in early December, eager "to show the movie to the pope." Mr. Michelini, it turned out, had an in with the Vatican. "Everyone thinks it's a complex story, the pope, the Vatican and all," Mr. Michelini says. "It's a very easy story. I called the pope's secretary. He said he had read about the movie, read about the controversy. He said, `I'm curious, and I'm sure the pope is curious too.' "

A video of "The Passion" was handed over to that secretary — Archbishop Stanislaw Dziwisz, whom Vatican watchers now describe as second in power only to the pope — on Friday, Dec. 5. "McEveety calls me like crazy, 20 times that weekend, saying, `I want to know what the pope thinks,' " Mr. Michelini continues. On Monday, the archbishop convened a meeting with Mr. McEveety and Mr. Michelini in the pope's apartment. There, Mr. Michelini says, the archbishop quoted the pope not only as saying "it is as it was" but also as calling the movie "incredibile." Mr. Michelini was repeating the archbishop's Italian and said that "incredibile" translates as "amazing," though Cassell's dictionary defines the word as "incredible, inconceivable, unbelievable." But why quarrel over semantics? Followed by an exclamation point, it will look fabulous in an ad, perhaps next to a quote from Michael Medved, the conservative pundit and film critic who has been vying with Ms. Noonan to be the movie's No. 1 publicist.

"Are you Catholic?" Mr. Michelini asked me as we concluded our conversation. No, I said. "Maybe you'll become one," he said, laughing. "Many, many Jewish people like this movie."

We shall see. In the meantime, you've got to give Mel Gibson's minions credit for getting the pope, or at least the aide who these days most frequently speaks in his name, to endorse their film in the weeks before it opens in 2,000-plus theaters. In keeping with every other p.r. strategy for "The Passion" — Mr. Gibson has said he felt that the Holy Ghost was the movie's actual director — Mr. Michelini says that the successful campaign for the Vatican thumbs up is an example of divine providence. Jews in show business might have another word for it — chutzpah.


TOPICS: TV/Movies
KEYWORDS: catholiclist
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To: Matthew Paul
Do you think you could provide us with another Jan Sobieski?

We REALLY need one.
81 posted on 01/21/2004 12:07:10 AM PST by dsc
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To: malakhi
I suspect if someone were to write an article saying that the Talmud was a "crude forgery" that had been edited to foster hostility to Christianity, he would be accused of anti-Semitism. That is, essentially, what those attempting to censor Gibson's movie are saying about the Gospels, except they're saying those forgeries are anti-Semitic.
82 posted on 01/21/2004 5:08:22 AM PST by Thorin
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To: weegee
The movie does not need "endorsement" from the Pope to make money. Approval from the Pope does serve to hold religious scholars/critics at bay who might argue with the accuracy of the presentation. The Pope is not the final authority on all things Christian (at least for protestants) but he has devoted his life to religious teachings.

Good, because the film is specifically a Catholic's account of the Passion (and therefore a Christian one). In all matters Catholic, the Pope is the final authority. This may make you uncomfortable, but it's a fact.

83 posted on 01/21/2004 6:30:13 AM PST by presidio9 (Islam is as Islam does)
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To: malakhi
So you're fine with Jews, as long as they keep their mouths shut? That's good to know...

When it comes to any religion, I am fine with its members as long as they adhere to the cultural understanding that they don't presume to intruct me how to practice mine, and I won't tell them how to practice theirs.

Well, most religions. I can think of one notable exception, but the Jews are not too fond of that particular religion either.

84 posted on 01/21/2004 6:35:11 AM PST by presidio9 (Islam is as Islam does)
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To: ladyjane; SJackson
No shame on the writer of the article?

If memory serves only a few days ago Vatican sources confirmed that the Pope had NOT said about this film what Gibson and his people claim. On that point, Frank Rich has been vindicated.

85 posted on 01/21/2004 9:50:40 AM PST by veronica ("America will never seek a permission slip to defend the security of our people." GW Bush 1-20-04)
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To: veronica
Heck, Frank Rich should be ashamed of his criticism of the film without seeing it. Of course shame was being discussed in the context of other posters now deceased statements (which I excerpted earlier) such as

Why do Jews try to kill the Truth? What do they want to gain?

I've rather sympathized with Jews so far. This time my viewpoints have changed completely. I am a Christian and I'm not going to sit and watch Christ being savaged by the group of hateful Jews.

Jews! Leave Christ and Christians alone!!!

You know, those nasty Jews always persecuting Christians, that conclusion flowing from this article. There's plenty of shame to go around.

86 posted on 01/21/2004 11:28:00 AM PST by SJackson
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To: Thorin
Well, there's lots of hate to go around. For example the hate expressed by a rabbi writing in the Jerusalem Post saying the passages in Gopsel of Matthew where the crowd accepts respsonsibility for Jesus' death were "crude forgeries" and saying that the New Testament had been edited to make it hostile to Jews. Or Abe Foxman of the ADL telling all who would listen that the Gospels were anti-Semitic. Or the entire ADL effort (assisted by some self-hating Christian theologians) to censor Gibson's film precisely because it is faithful to the Gospels' depiction of the Passion. When people outside my faith presume to tell me what I may believe, or claim that the Gospels are "anti-Semitic," that's offensive.

No question about it. Of course, unlike other posters, you seem to be able to tell the difference between individual Jews and Christians (your description, self hating) and Jews and Christians.

87 posted on 01/21/2004 11:31:22 AM PST by SJackson
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To: presidio9
Would Catholics have avoided the film if the Pope had offered no public statement?
88 posted on 01/21/2004 2:27:07 PM PST by weegee
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To: weegee
Nope, but historically the Pope's opinion on religious-themed works of art has always mattered to Catholics. Catholics did avoid seeing The Last Temptation of Christ because he told them not to.
89 posted on 01/21/2004 2:29:57 PM PST by presidio9 (HAIL ANTS!)
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To: SJackson
Of course shame was being discussed in the context of other posters now deceased statements (which I excerpted earlier) such as

And now you are doning the same thing to amplify your enviornment of persecution. The quotes you provided all came from the same person.

90 posted on 01/21/2004 2:32:06 PM PST by presidio9 (HAIL ANTS!)
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To: presidio9
A lot of protestants also boycotted that film.
91 posted on 01/21/2004 3:12:58 PM PST by weegee
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To: presidio9
"In all matters Catholic, the Pope is the final authority."

Well, no, actually: the Bible is the final authority for Catholics, being as how it's the Word of God and all. The Pope has no authority to contradict scripture.
92 posted on 01/21/2004 5:22:59 PM PST by dsc
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To: veronica
"If memory serves only a few days ago Vatican sources confirmed that the Pope had NOT said about this film what Gibson and his people claim."

I think we need to parse the Vatican's statement using the Clinton algorithm.

The version I read said that the Holy Father had made no such "declaration."

If one makes a distinction between a Papal declaration and a spontaneous and informal private remark, as I suspect (with about 90% confidence) that they are doing, then they haven't said that "He didn't say it," they've only said that he made no such "declaration."

I think he said it, and that the Vatican is using this deceptive and hair-splitting syntax to *appear to deny* without actually lying, because they don't want to be placed in the position of touting a movie.

I think they're afraid of commercials with a picture of the Holy Father lifting the chalice and a caption, "The Pope says, 'Mel Gibson's new film? I'll drink to that.' "

Of course, Mr. Gibson would never allow such a thing, but I get the impression that most of the people at the Vatican are 99% bureaucrat and at best 1% priest, and you know what bureaucrats are like.

Which brings me to my final point: you wrote, "...Gibson and his people claim."

I've seen people who don't work for him writing about it, but nothing from him or his people. Have you?
93 posted on 01/21/2004 5:33:36 PM PST by dsc
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To: dsc
I've seen people who don't work for him writing about it, but nothing from him or his people. Have you?
The sole source for the claim that the Pope commented positively on the movie is the movie's producer and assistant director. Certainly they would be considered Gibson's "people."
94 posted on 01/21/2004 6:38:53 PM PST by drjimmy
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To: presidio9
Email from friends who went to a screening---

Hey friends and family, Last night I attended a private screening of Mel Gibson's movie...12/8/2003, at Ricky Skaggs' church in Hendersonville. There were about 200 people in attendance.

Well,....let me just say that I am speechless, moved beyond words and sobered by what I saw last night. I'm sure many of you will be receiving emails from some of your friends who were there as well...and you'll probably be bombarded with their own personal stories.

The movie was in a rough cut version... but still I thought a very finished state,...special effects had not been added yet, nor was the music complete....still it brought uncontrollable weeping from everyone. I couldn't stop crying through the whole movie. And when the movie was over, there was complete silence in the church. I wanted the story to go on and on...for another two hours.... I think the movie was about 2 hours long. It got started late, like around 7:30, and the next time I looked at my watch it was 10:30... so I actually don't even remember. There was a question and answer time with Mel Gibson himself, so who cared what time it was.

Every moment of the movie was captivating,..breathtaking....still, there are no words. The beating and suffering of Christ was almost unbearable to watch. The scenes with flashbacks of Jesus when he was a little boy and a scene of his mother running to comfort him and then cradling him in her arms after he had fallen down about the age of 4 or 5.....was interlaced with scenes of him falling to the ground carrying his own cross, so bloody and unrecognizable...and then her holding him in her arms after he had been taken down from the cross. Her face then stared into the camera while she was holding him...and you could just imagine the things she was thinking. Every parent who was seated near me ... fell apart.

The nails being hammered into his hands was the most real thing I had ever seen. One scene of Jesus and the interaction with his mother...just reminded me of every 20-year old man/child and mom relationship. Where she's trying to get him to come to eat...and has to remind him to wash his hands before eating...she brings water to wash his hands..and after washing, he gently splashes water on his mother..but then wraps his arms around her and kisses her on the cheek....and takes off running to the food.. I don't know..it just reminded me of something my 15 year old would do to me..... And the thought of one of my boys going through that, just made me want to die inside...

There was a question and answer period last night with Mel himself. We had heard rumors that he's been showing up to these screenings. I got brave enough to put my hand up and ask a question about the miracles that we had heard about, on the set. And he began to talk about so many I couldn't really keep track. I remember hearing about one of the actors being hit by lightning twice yet walking away from it..with only smoking fingertips, healings , conversions on the set,..but I especially remember him talking about a Two-year old child's, hearing and sight being restored...and he said..."you know you can't fake that when you're two. So we know it was real."

He was asked about Spiritual warfare on the set...and he just laughingly said..."Oh yeah..just being in Italy alone was enough warfare,..but he said it was intense.

He said that the bad press surrounding the movie..is just a few small pressure groups that are causing all the noise. But seem to have the loudest mouths. And that became the reason for having these small private screenings..is to get the word out and to start a grass roots campaign into a swell. WOW....that sounds familiar. We all get the chance to be Christ's disciples all over again, in a fresh new way...

Ricky Skaggs asked the final question of the night to Mel.....about how we can pray for him, help him, spread the word etc. He said that "prayer was the most powerful thing. And not to pray for all our enemies to have warts grow on their faces, (laughter), but to pray for our warring angels to fight against satan's angels, because the people don't know any better, they are clueless...and they are just being used by satan."

It was mentioned to everyone in the crowd who were artists, press folks, radio..and such..anyone who had a website...to get on a mailing list and sign up. That they would be sending links, so that everyone could put it on their websites,...there would be movie trailers that artists could take on tour with them, show at concerts....any type of promo material on product tables etc.

They passed out a poster flyer last night as we left...and the official website address is

http://www.thepassionofthechrist.com

This is the address they have on all promo materials for the movie.

It was a little easier to see the trailer on this site....as it was equipped for all computers video capabilities. You can go to this website and register to find out more info on how to help. This other site that is listed will just give you more info on press stuff and more press on the miracles that happened.

http://www.passion-movie.com (fan site)

The movie comes out February 25, 2004.. Ash Wednesday...in theaters nationwide. And the movie's official title is "The Passion of the Christ."

Mel said that he spent 35 million of his own money to make this movie.

Mel is a man of the word! He knows the Bible..and is a sold-out believer. He said that this movie has been his passion for the past 12 years....just 3 years ago did the Lord begin to give him landmark signs that now was the time to start filming the movie. He mentioned some of them...but one that stuck in my mind, was him saying that some random little old lady in France I think...came up to him and said something to him that nobody could've known, I don't know what she said to him..but he said the signs to get started on it, were unmistakable.

Ok....well...I know that I am changed...and I pray that what I saw will be etched on my brain forever...and Lord, help me to never forget the price you paid for us all. Whenever I begin to argue, or complain....shut my mouth Lord. And help us all to remember,...we are not home yet...that heaven awaits all of us who believe in Him....and that we all have a part to play, a heart to share, a burden to carry...and a story of love and hope to spread....

Thank you for the cross LORD! Make it a point to take your entire family to this movie!!!!

95 posted on 01/21/2004 7:35:20 PM PST by lonestar (Don't mess with Texas)
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To: drjimmy
I found a treasure trove of related articles here:

http://www.seethepassion.com/news.php?page=2

and refreshed my memory.

The sequence of events looks like this:

On December 18, Peggy Noonan reported, "Pope John Paul II saw the movie the weekend before last, in the Vatican, apparently in his private rooms, on a television, with a DVD, and accompanied by his closest friend, Msgr. Stanislaw Dziwisz. Afterwards and with an eloquent economy John Paul shared with Msgr. Dziwisz his verdict. Dziwisz, the following Monday, shared John Paul's five-word response with the co-producer of The Passion, Steve McEveety. This is what the pope said: "It is as it was."

Then, apparently on January 19, "...the Catholic News Service, an arm of the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops, reported that the pope "never" made such a statement. CNS quoted the pope's longtime personal secretary, Archbishop Stanislaw Dziwisz. The Holy Father told no one his opinion of this film," the archbishop told CNS. But Steve McEveety, the film's co-producer, and Jan Michelini, its assistant director, said they met Archbishop Dziwisz after the papal viewing. Dziwisz told them the pope simply commented, "It is as it was."

Looks to me like somebody's fibbing here.

Let me ask you this: would you make up something and attribute it to the Pope, knowing you could be given the lie so easily?

CNS and the USCCB are known prevaricators. That's the first place I'd focus in looking for the flaming underwear.

"The sole source for the claim that the Pope commented positively on the movie is the movie's producer and assistant director. Certainly they would be considered Gibson's "people."

I think that's rather arbitrary. It looks like it boils down to whether Msgr. Dziwisz told co-producer Steve McEveety that the Holy Father said, "It is as it was," or not, and, if so, whether the Msgr. was telling the truth.

Msgr. Dziwisz is our sole source for what the Holy Father said. McEveety wasn't there.

McEveety is our first source for what Msgr. Dziwisz said, and is contradicted only by the dishonest slime at CNS.

In the absence of indications that McEveety is either (a) mentally ill; or (b) stupid as a box of dirt, I find it difficult to assign a high probability to the proposition that he is the liar here.

You are partially correct in saying that McEveety is responsible for the reported remark becoming public, in that he told people about it.

Actually, I rather think I would too, under similar circumstances. I'd be deeply honored if such a thing were said about a project I'd worked on.

That said, I still dispute that either Mr. Gibson or his people have flacked that remark in inappropriate ways.
96 posted on 01/21/2004 7:59:32 PM PST by dsc
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To: dsc
Let me ask you this: would you make up something and attribute it to the Pope, knowing you could be given the lie so easily?
While you obviously hold no truck with the CNS or USCCB, consider applying your standard to their report. Their quote from the archbishop is much longer than five words, so they cannot be the ones who are fibbing or they would be easily be shown to be liars by the archbishop.

So we are left with either the archbishop being a liar--either then or now--or the film's producer and assistant director being a liar. Or the other possibility, which may be that there was a misunderstanding. Maybe the archbishop did say something to the film people that sounded to them like he was quoting the Pope as saying "It is as it was." Maybe it's the Pope's version of "Rosebud"! Since Gibson's spokesman says there is "correspondence" that supports his side's version, it would seem to behoove him to release the contents of that correspondence.
97 posted on 01/21/2004 9:07:05 PM PST by drjimmy
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To: drjimmy
"...consider applying your standard to their report. Their quote from the archbishop is much longer than five words, so they cannot be the ones who are fibbing or they would be easily be shown to be liars by the archbishop."

I don't see how the length of a statement is necessarily correlated with its veracity.

"So we are left with either the archbishop being a liar--either then or now--or the film's producer and assistant director being a liar. Or the other possibility, which may be that there was a misunderstanding."

And there is still another possibility. It could be that the Msgr. was doing what I earlier alleged--weasel wording with the term "declaration," actually saying that the Holy Father made no such official "declaration" without actually coming out and denying that he ever uttered the words, and the CNS people misrepresented it as an outright denial.

"Since Gibson's spokesman says there is "correspondence" that supports his side's version, it would seem to behoove him to release the contents of that correspondence."

Yes, I quite agree. Of course, I would then expect the CNS to call it a forgery.
98 posted on 01/21/2004 10:52:01 PM PST by dsc
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To: dsc
Which brings me to my final point: you wrote, "...Gibson and his people claim." I've seen people who don't work for him writing about it, but nothing from him or his people. Have you?

The supposed quote from the Pope appears at the movie's official website, in reviews, etc.

99 posted on 01/22/2004 6:05:09 AM PST by veronica ("America will never seek a permission slip to defend the security of our people." GW Bush 1-20-04)
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To: dsc
My point about the length of the statement was that it would be (in my opinion) more difficult to simply make up--and therefore easier to then refute--a lengthier quote from the archbishop than a shorter quote. The CNS quote, I thought, was a lot less ambiguous than "It is as it was." Perhaps I wasn't giving the Vatican enough credit(?) to come up with its own slant on Clinton's "It depends on what the meaning of "is" is, and the word "declaration" is part of the obfuscation. Even if that is the case, I think that CNS interpreted it in exactly the way the Vatican wanted the word to be interpreted.

Of course, I would then expect the CNS to call it a forgery.
As you can see from this thread, you aren't far off the mark. It isn't CNS that is calling some of the correspondence a forgery, however, it is the Pope's own official spokesman (at least according to Peggy Noonan, who seems to trust her source for this). They say that the Lord moves in mysterious ways, but this is getting ridiculous!
100 posted on 01/22/2004 7:04:04 AM PST by drjimmy
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