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Thousands of Pilots Won't Fly Armed, Blame TSA
CNSNews.com ^ | January 15, 2004 | Jeff Johnson

Posted on 01/15/2004 7:29:05 AM PST by 69ConvertibleFirebird

(CNSNews.com) - The federal agency charged with providing security for U.S. airlines, and the airlines themselves are intentionally sabotaging the congressionally-mandated program to train and certify pilots who volunteer to carry guns in the cockpit, according to supporters of the program who claim tens of thousands of pilots have opted out s a result.

Pilots with knowledge of the Federal Flight Deck Officer (FFDO), or "armed pilots" program tell CNSNews.com that the manner in which the Transportation Security Administration (TSA) requires FFDOs to carry their weapons not only discourages participation, but also renders them defenseless against potential terrorist attacks when they are most vulnerable. The pilots also complain that TSA has issued a "thinly veiled threat" to disclose personal information discovered during background investigations and subjective results of psychological evaluations in an attempt to further discourage pilots from volunteering for the program.

The U.S. House passed the Arming Pilots Against Terrorism Act by a vote of 310 to 113 in July of 2002. The proposal became law Nov. 22, 2002, as part of the Homeland Security Act of 2002

An FFDO, who spoke on condition of anonymity, told CNSNews.com in an exclusive interview that the TSA is "not pursuing [the armed pilots program] with any sense of urgency."

"The TSA has designed the program to deter participation and they're being successful," the FFDO said. "The program should be a large program so that it can be an effective deterrent and, because it is not as large as it should be, it is not the deterrent that it should be."

Capt. Dave Mackett, a commercial airline pilot and vice president of the Airline Pilots Security Alliance (APSA), said actual enrollment in the program speaks volumes about TSA's performance, or lack thereof. He said nearly 40,000 certified pilots initially signed up with his organization, indicating their interest in serving as Federal Flight Deck Officers. But now, Mackett says, there are "only a few thousand volunteers" registered with TSA.

"As a result of the program's attributes -- the way the TSA designed the program -- roughly 88 to 90 percent of the original pilots who expressed an interest changed their minds," Mackett explained.

Chris Rhatigan, a spokeswoman for TSA, initially offered to comment on the allegations reported in the CNSNews.com investigation of the FFDO program, with some restrictions.

"I'm not going to respond to those types of statements," Rhatigan said when asked about specific allegations that are reported in the article. "I can respond to your specific questions about the program, how it's operated, what it's doing. But, as far as going back and forth like that, I'm not going to be able to participate"

Rhatigan was asked how many of the 40,000 pilots, who had originally registered with APSA, had formally volunteered for the FFDO program, but declined to answer.

Method of carrying weapon blamed for most pilots' decision to withdraw

One FFDO, who agreed to comment on the "carry protocol" for armed pilots' handguns only if CNSNews.com did not disclose the person's identity, said the regulation is "designed to deter participation."

"A lot of my coworkers have watched what I go through and they say, 'You know what? I'm not signing up,'" the FFDO explained.

The FFDO also believes such comments are the result TSA desires. "I've had so many pilots tell me, 'I'm not signing up for this. I'm not putting myself through this kind of agony to go through what you go through.'

"That is the thing that's really deterring participation," the FFDO added.

As CNSNews.com previously reported, the TSA requires FFDOs to be essentially disarmed anytime they are outside the cockpit of their aircraft.

"The jurisdiction of use of the weapon is in the cockpit and the cockpit only. They are called 'Federal Flight Deck Officers,'" explained Heather Rosenker, a spokeswoman for TSA in a February 2003 interview. "If somebody tries to intervene [sic] into the cockpit of that aircraft, [FFDOs] have the right to use their weapon."

Asked if there were no other circumstances under which a pilot would be justified in using the weapon, Rosenker replied, "That's correct."

Unless the pilot is behind the locked cockpit door, TSA requires that the weapon be holstered, locked inside a hard-sided gun case and stored inside "a bag that is non-descript."

The policy leaves pilots defenseless during the time when law enforcement and security experts agree that the cockpit is most vulnerable.

"The weapon needs to be re-secured in the locked box if the cockpit door is open," Rosenker explained, acknowledging that the regulation would include times during flights when one of the pilots leaves the cockpit to use the restroom or get food.

Dean Roberts, a former federal law enforcement officer and pilot, now flies for a commercial passenger airline. He told CNSNews.com that even some pilots with federal law enforcement experience would not apply for the FFDO program because of the lock box requirement.

"I know of, there are five in my crew base alone that are all graduates of FLETC (the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center) or graduates of the FBI Academy who have no intention of putting in paperwork to go to this," Roberts said.

"When I carried a gun as a federal law enforcement officer on an airplane, it was a hassle carrying a gun [on board]," Roberts explained. "The FFDO program has got about 20 more unnecessary steps in the process that make it more hassle than it is worth."

TSA's policy allegedly causing guns to be lost, could facilitate robberies

One pilot, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said the risk of a handgun carried inside a lock box, inside another piece of luggage, being stolen from an FFDO or taken by force should be obvious.

"Criminals know that [some] pilots carry guns in lock boxes and those guns are not available to the pilots," said the aviator who also has a background in federal law enforcement. "TSA has set up every FFDO to be the victim of an armed robbery to get their gun."

Commercial airline captains and first officers, the pilot noted, are required to travel between terminals and distant employee parking lots at all hours of the day and night, often with little or no security. Because an FFDO's handgun is sealed inside the lock box, which is carried inside another piece of luggage, the CNSNews.com source said it would be impossible for the "armed" pilot to use it to defend against one or more attackers.

The FFDO policies and procedures also forbid pilots from carrying their lock boxes inside the passenger compartment of a plane unless they are the assigned captain or first officer for that particular flight. As a result, pilots who are "deadheading," or flying as passengers to or from an assignment, must place their firearm lock boxes into the cargo hold of the aircraft.

Roberts, who previously worked as a special agent and pilot for both the U.S. Customs Service and the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA), is a graduate of both the FBI Academy and FLETC. He said that while baggage handlers are not supposed to touch the lock boxes belonging to deadheading FFDOs, the lock boxes frequently get mixed with the luggage of other passengers.

"[FFDOs] go down to pick up the gun from a trip and it's already whisked off to baggage claim," Roberts explained. "It happens several times a day, more than once.

"Pilots go down to get the gun and the baggage handlers have already been in the belly [and] unloaded it and the gun is on its way to baggage claim," Roberts elaborated. "The FFDOs then have to get back up into the airplane, go down out of the terminal, down to baggage claim and hopefully find their gun on the carousel."

TSA's Rhatigan was asked how many times deadheading FFDOs had reported such incidents to TSA.

"I don't have access to that information to share with you at this time and I'm going to conclude this interview," Rhatigan responded. "I'm going to refer this up to Mark Hatfield the director of communications here and see if he has somebody he'd like to have you talk to."

Despite having refused such an offer during the initial interview, Rhatigan later called back to request that CNSNews.com submit a list of questions for TSA to consider. That list was submitted Tuesday evening. Wednesday morning, TSA was reminded of and acknowledged the reporter's Wednesday afternoon deadline. More than 24-hours after initially being contacted, however, TSA had provided no further response.

An FFDO who agreed to talk to CNSNews.com confirmed Roberts' claim on background but did not wish to be quoted on the issue, fearing reprisals for violating TSA's prohibition on FFDOs disclosing any flaws with the program to anyone other than TSA management.

Despite Roberts' extensive firearms training background and federal law enforcement experience, he was expelled from FFDO training on the last day of classes. He believes challenging the lock box and other TSA policies that are contrary to standard law enforcement procedures led to his dismissal.

"If you got pushy and demanded some answers and called them on their double-speak," Roberts speculated, "[TSA managers] said, 'Well, you've got to go. You're a troublemaker.'"

TSA accused of discouraging participation before program's official launch

APSA says TSA tried to discourage pilots from volunteering for the FFDO program even before the program officially began ... Read Part Two


E-mail a news tip to Jeff Johnson.

Send a Letter to the Editor about this article.



TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Government; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: airlines; airlinesecurity; armedpilots; bang; banglist; dhs; ffdo; gun; guncontrol; guns; pilot; sabotage; tsa
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To: freeeee
CRE p[ost 21: Your are clearly correct.
81 posted on 01/16/2004 7:09:29 PM PST by southland
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To: Mulder
How uneducated of us to expect politicians to follow the Constitution they took an oath to!

How stupid of us to actually expect that they keep their word.

I couldn't agree more! It is idiotic for someone to "expect" politicians to do so!!!

82 posted on 01/19/2004 11:19:02 AM PST by 69ConvertibleFirebird (Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience.)
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To: robowombat
The thrust of the parts that dealt with actual conrontation with terrorists including kidnappers was 'do nothing' you are not a officially trained 'law enforcement' person (by TSA definition) and don't have sense enogh to do anything useful. Allow yourself to be kidnapped or held hostage because the 'certified terror fighters' will come and rescue you.

Not surprizing; that is the prevailing statist mindset. At best, it has rendered government irrelevant in matters pertaining to the safety of citizens. In worse cases, the statist mindset has caused government to become the actual source of danger to citizens.

83 posted on 01/19/2004 11:31:57 AM PST by meadsjn
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To: 69ConvertibleFirebird
Even a snake has sense enough not to bite its own tail. Not so with the federal government.
84 posted on 02/01/2004 10:31:38 PM PST by dr_who_2
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To: Joe Brower
Joe, I was on a radio show in Tuscon today with the author of this story. He had the first 15 minutes, then I had the next 45. It was on KJLL 1330 in Tucson, the Charles Heller show called "America Armed and Free." This is the station in Tucson that carries Imus, O'reilly and Leikus, fairly big time. Heller does a 2nd amd oriented show for 2 hours every Sunday. Anyway, there I was on the air, right after this guy.
85 posted on 02/01/2004 10:39:00 PM PST by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: Hunble
Have you ever watch that video of a Boeing 707 doing a roll?

It is amazing how much a pilot can do in a deadly situation, if he is willing to take responsibility for his actions.

Click here for an interesting story about what a pilot actually did in such a situation. Of course, he only had Scotland Yard to deal with, not the TSA or the American Trial Lawyers.

86 posted on 02/01/2004 11:07:59 PM PST by cynwoody
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To: Travis McGee
Hey, Trav, don't leave us hanging like that -- where's the link for the streaming audio?? I wanna hear it! $;-)

Click the Gadsden flag for pro-gun resources!

87 posted on 02/02/2004 5:18:27 AM PST by Joe Brower ("Powers once assumed are never relinquished, just as bureaucracies, once created, never die.")
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To: Joe Brower
Here it is, but I don't know if it's been put up in the archives yet. It wasn't up right after the show.

http://www.tucsonsjolt.com/audio/index.html

88 posted on 02/02/2004 7:34:25 AM PST by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: Joe Brower
Here it is, but I don't know if it's been put up in the archives yet. It wasn't up right after the show.

http://www.tucsonsjolt.com/audio/index.html

89 posted on 02/02/2004 7:34:27 AM PST by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: Joe Brower
PS, I posted a thread on THR, and at least one High Roader heard it! Too bad it's not a national show, it's two hours of guns and freedom, even the ads and PSAs!
90 posted on 02/02/2004 7:36:51 AM PST by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: Travis McGee
Uh-oh. Better check the disconnector on your keyboard, Trav -- you're doubling! $;-)
91 posted on 02/02/2004 8:10:11 AM PST by Joe Brower ("Powers once assumed are never relinquished, just as bureaucracies, once created, never die.")
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To: Freeper john; Travis McGee
That's easy! The second pilot will fly the airplane.

In most commercial passenger aircraft [other than rotary wing] the Captain/ pilot in charge sits in the portside front seat, in the same position as the driver in most US automobiles. This means that if he has to turn to face an intruder entering the cabin from behind him, it will be his right hand that will be closest to the aisle, offering an easier target for a potential attacker coming in from behind.

My preference would be to let him do what he does best, and designate the co-pilot/First Officer as the cockpit resource better suited for repelling boarders, though still under the command and authority of his captain. This also offers him the advantage of having his left arm in a position for defence against edged or impact weapons, while the right can better control a handgun or other weapon with no more difficulty than a simple turn in his seat to face the centre aisle. Aircraft with a flight engineer, now fairly uncommon, a navigator, jumpseating additional crew or other cockpit resources can establish more extensive procedures as the Captain directs. But the simple basics of two aircrew up front in the cabin are probably better handled with the First Officer as the designated hitter.

Every pilot knows that redundancy is desirable however. They both need the ability and mindset to deal with any such problem that develops.

-archy-/-

92 posted on 02/02/2004 10:00:52 PM PST by archy (Angiloj! Mia kusenveturilo estas plena da angiloj!)
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