(Smoking) Ban puts bars in the red

The Greeley Tribune (Greeley, Colorado) ^ | 1/12/04 | Phillip Yates

[NorCoGOP]

Mary Whitman's bar and restaurant may not be able to afford the new smoking ban.

One month after the ordinance passed, Whitman, the manager of Roasty's Steakhouse, 920 8th Ave, said the restaurant's bar revenues have dropped 60 percent. One week after the ban went into effect, the bar made only $100 one day.

"All the time I have been here, we have never done that," said Whitman, who has worked at Roasty's for 10 years. "We have terminated one of our bartenders because of it."

Other Greeley bar owners and managers paint a bleak economic picture as well, with many saying they've suffered a significant decline in business since the smoking ordinance went into effect Dec. 4.

If someone lights up inside a Greeley bar, he or she faces up to $300 in penalties and a mandatory court appearance. Both the smoker and the establishment can be ticketed.

Vicki Tobel, owner of the Red Garter Lounge, 3621 10th St, said she has a loyal day crowd, but her business has still dropped 15 percent since the ordinance passed. What worries her most is the lounge's night crowd, where business has dropped 45 percent.

"Our night is just killing us," Tobel said.

She, like many other bar owners and managers, are unsure about the future.

"I don't know if I'll have to cut employees," Tobel said. "I don't know what my next step is."

Neither does Keith Johnson, owner of Cables End Italian Grille, 3780 10th St.

He hopes he doesn't have to let any employees go but said there has been a substantial drop in the restaurant's bar. Johnson said the bar did $10,000 less when he compared his November December sales.

Although some Greeley bars and restaurants might see red, others are staying in the black. Brenda Lucio, owner and manager of Coyote's Southwestern Grill, 5250 9th St. Drive, said business is good since the ordinance passed because the restaurant doesn't depend on liquor sales.

"I would be scared if I had a bar business," Lucio said.

Several Greeley bar owners said that there is an exodus of bar patrons to Garden City, Evans and other surrounding cities so they can smoke. But Alan Dean, owner of Bear's Sports Saloon, 2519 8th Ave., which is in unincorporated Weld County, says the increase in business has been small.

"Business seems to be improving week by week," he said.

The dreary effect of the smoking ban for some Greeley bar owners and managers is in sharp contrast with a survey conducted by the Group to Alleviate Smoking Pollution (GASP) of Colorado that was published in the Jan. 4 edition of the Tribune.

GASP is a Boulder-based anti-smoking organization that works to educate the public against the dangers of second-hand smoke and to promote smoke-free environments. The survey quoted bar owners, managers and employees at the Paragon Family Restaurant and Cable's End Italian Grille as saying that the ordinance was "going well" or "doing OK" at their respective restaurants. Both owners disputed the quotations.

GASP president Pete Bialick said the survey was informal and not official.

Bialick said GASP conducts the survey in communities where smoking ordinances pass to update the organization's list of all the smoke-free restaurants and bars in Colorado towns. Despite some bar owners' claims the ordinance is pushing revenue down, Bialick disagrees.

"These ordinances don't affect the bottom line," he said, saying that studies based on sales taxes in more than 100 communities show smoking ordinances don't diminish bar and restaurant owners' bottom lines. He disputed the fact that bar owners say revenues are going down since Greeley passed the smoking ban.

"They are using it as a scapegoat," Bialick said. "The tobacco industry is behind this. They are probably getting paid to say that."

[Gabz]

"Rights come from God- not human beings" Alan Keyes 1996

And in this case human beings have taken away the God given rights of a private business owner to determine how he will conduct his business.

[Looking for Diogenes]

This is terrible! People are smoking less - now they're drinking less too! Next we'll be hearing reports that brothels and casinoes are losing money. This country's going to hell.

Or maybe it's the other direction....

[Protagoras]

Are you proposing to criminalize smoking, drinking and gambling on the federal level?

[ItsOurTimeNow]

I hope you don't breathe the air in or around any populated city, or ever get stuck in traffic behind a diesel truck.

There are more carcinogens in the very air that you breathe than in a cigarette.

[Looking for Diogenes]

No. Where'd you get that from?

[Protagoras]

No. Where'd you get that from?

The answer is no, so it's irrelevant why I asked the question.

[Protagoras]

No. Where'd you get that from?

The answer is no, so it's irrelevant why I asked the question.

[Looking for Diogenes]

My turn. Would you be happier if the revenue of bars, casinoes, brothels, and cigarette companies was increasing instead of decreasing?

[RandallFlagg]

I've had it with these losers. I've just had it.

I'm just going to have to research even harder on who gets my votes. Think up some trick questions to ask the candidates when I call them (And I call every one of the local and state folks who run).

GASP is dangerous. I wonder if we could dig up some dirt on these nosy bums. Anyone who excels in business destruction reeks too much of socialism to be concerned about "Health of the public."

Any ideas, my fellow Colorado FReepers?

[douglas1]

GOD sees people like you, and he knows the wrath you would bestow on others, YOU SHOULD REALLY GO TO CHURCH AND REPENT.

[Chewbacca]

If you can't smoke indoors, then some enterprising business person should create the open air bar.

All sides of the bar are open to the elements so all the smoke laden and gas fumes from cars can waft over the customers. That way the smoking customers can consume their alcoholic beverage out on the street in the open air like in Europe for all to see.

[Protagoras]

Would you be happier if the revenue of bars, casinoes, brothels, and cigarette companies was increasing instead of decreasing?

My happiness is not dependent on the non rights violating behaviors of others.

[Looking for Diogenes]

My happiness is not dependent on the non rights violating behaviors of others.

Wow, that's a complicated sentence. So it sounds like you believe the government should stay out of all moral or health issues.

In the old days conservatives used to think that public drunkeness, prostitution, gambling and smoking were vices. Not anymore apparently. Party on!

[Protagoras]

So it sounds like you believe the government should stay out of all moral or health issues.

Nice try.

I believe that the government's only legitimate function in a free society is to defend the rights of it's citizens.

In the old days conservatives used to think that public drunkeness, prostitution, gambling and smoking were vices.

No one has suggested that these things are not vices, except your inane insinuation that I have. Further, I have not claimed to be a conservative at any time. If you can define it for me, which no one around here has been able to agree on thus far, I'll let you know if I am one.

Not anymore apparently. Party on!

In the mean time, this personal attack has ended this conversation. You may take the your last cheap shot now.

[Ditter]

There ARE scores & scores of nonsmokers out there who have NEVER gone to bars because of the smoke. Over the years they have formed habits of drinking in non smoking restaurants or at home or friends houses. Habits are hard to break, even the habit of NOT going someplace. Habits don't change over night, maybe the habit of NOT going to bars is just too hard to break.

[bc2]

Upstate New York *PING*

[ItsOurTimeNow]

I'm sure there are.

However, I was referring to the Anti-Smoking Nazi's who wrote all the Op/Ed pieces, called all radio talk shows, populated all the message boards on how disgusting it was, and how happy they'd be once they could dine smoke free.

Well, they got their wish...now where are they?

They did a great job "talking the talk", but aren't "walking the walk".

[Ditter]

Dining? I thought we were talking about drinking? Bars closing up is the subject here.

[Great Dane]

Bad for business, I am not surprised, we have had a smoking ban for 2 1/2 years, business has never bounced back, we are waiting for a province wide ban, breweries has already warned the government of a fight in court, should the province proceed.

[Great Dane]

#14... Lots of things destroy's gods temple........ where would you like to start.