Immigrant Realities

WSJ ^ | January 9, 2004

[FredTownWard]

Friday, January 9, 2004 12:01 a.m.

The debate over President Bush's new immigration reform has so far been mainly about election-year politics. But what we believe most commends it is that it recognizes the world as it exists.

Like it or not, the U.S. is part of an integrating regional and world economy in which the movement of people across borders is inevitable. Despite nearly 20 years of efforts to "crack down on the borders," the immigrants keep coming--an estimated eight million without legal U.S. documents today. As long as the per capita income differential between the U.S. (nearly $32,000) and Mexico ($3,679) continues to be so wide, we can't stop immigrants short of means that will violate our traditions, our conscience, and our national interest.

[azhenfud]

The current immigration law doesn't work partly because the penalties for hiring Illegaliens is far too low and taxpayer funded services are handed out to them by the dozen.

If employers and Illegaliens risked confiscation of assets and penalties nearing the point of bankrupting them, their attention spans would definitely increase in regards to obeying the law. Confinement of Illegaliens without bail until deportation is also a necessary step in increasing respect for the law.

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[alloysteel]

The policy was not directed at the Latino voters in the US. It was offered as a means of providing a form of foreign aid to Mexico, primarily, and to a lesser degree, other countries that slip large numbers of undocumented workers into the US.

What happens to many of those that now come in, is that they are beholden to the "coyotes", the leaders of the convoys of illegal entrants, who charge exorbitant fees (a couple thousand per transient) to lead them across the border, and for a while, very little of their earnings get back to their families in Mexico. Surely they get only marginally better living conditions than they may have enjoyed in their home countries.

The real beneficiaries, and the driving force behind this declaration of a legalization of the status of these otherwise undocumented laborers, are the legions of small-capital employers that depend on the cheap labor this underground economy provides. There are laws against what they are doing, but nobody is serious about enforcing them. The cost of enforcement is not, at this time, cost-effective. Rather like enforcing the laws against, say, prostitution. The situation is tolerated, because the overall benefits, marginal as they may be, exceed the cost of full and diligent prosecution.

[FredTownWard]

If all we do is make it impossible for businesses that currently depend on employing illegals to continue to do so, they will be forced to (a) go out of business (b) move overseas or (c) if it is the kind of business that cannot be replaced by overseas competitors (restaurants), raise their prices enormously and thus shrink their business. As for rounding up and holding 8,000,000+ illegals, we lack the manpower and the prison space. Restoring the military draft so we can build prison camps all across the Southwest in order to protect ourselves from gardeners, maids, and other low wage workers strikes me as a poor use of scarce resources during wartime.

[gubamyster]

ping

[ckilmer]

we can't stop immigrants short of means that will violate our traditions, our conscience, and our national interest.
///////////////////
the question is whether we stop the illegals now when there is some chance that we can return to "normalcy" or later when there is no chance for a return to normalcy.

[Zack Nguyen]

If we wanted to stop illegal immigration, we could. It is the will that doesn't exist, not the means.

[ravingnutter]

After listening to all the rhetoric on this, I can't believe so many people have forgotten a basic fact that I learned in elementary school...the President does not make law, Congress does! Bush's plan will be in the cross-cut shredder the minute it hits Congress. There are currently two bills being considered, one in the Senate and one in the House:

House Version Sponsored by Tom Tancredo of CO

Senate Version Sponsored by John Cornyn of TX

We need to forget about Bush's plan and get on the Tancredo bandwagon by writing our Congress-critters!

[Joe Hadenuf]

Like it or not, the U.S. is part of an integrating regional and world economy in which the movement of people across borders is inevitable.

Like it or not, we are a nation of laws where criminals are not rewarded.

[varon]

Do we really want to deputize all of American business to report and arrest illegals?

Why not?

[ZULU]

The Wall Street Journal is generally a conservative publication and generally correct on most issues.

They are wrong here - DEAD wrong.

The Journal is representing those interests in the U.S. here who are pushing this amnesty the most - the corporate interests. They WANT a cheap source of labor. They WANT people they can exploit for peonage wages. Illegal aliens provide this, and they want to able to freely recruit and hire more of them.

Bush's proposals are inimical to the best interests of the American Public and are so very evil, that I, an individual who long supported the man, am considering not voting for him in the next election should these be approved by Congress.

They are unfair and unpopular with Native-born Americans because they will contribute to the further erosion of the life style of average Americans, and will increase the trend toward de-Anglicization of America (and I mean Anglo in the very BROADEST cultural sense of that term, not in an ethnic connotation. Many Polish Americans, Germans Americans, etc. and even Hispanic Americans are, in effect, Anglos. They speak English as a sole or primary language, they have accepted and adopted Anglo-American cultural and social practises, and most importantly, they consider themselves and their children "American"). Floods of illegal aliens - and we are talking primarily South and Central Americans and Meixcans here - will radically alter that balance in such a way that our country would not even be recognized in a few generations as America.

These proposals are unfair to the masses of LEGAL resident aliens and workers who waited in line, paid their fees, filed the forms, and submitted to the requisite checks. They are unfair to aleins from countries other than Hispanic ones who would like to come here.

They are unfair to America considering the fact that the greatest beneficiary is the corrupt, ineffecient government of Senior Vicente Fox. Due to its incompetence and mismanagement, Mexican society continually generates an army of poor, destitute people who have no place in their society and for whom Mexico is unable or unwilling to support. Fox's solution is to make HIS problem OUR problem.

Finally, they are unfair to American society as a whole, as they provide an incentive for yet more illegals to come here, burden our social support networks, and also permit potential terrorists to establish residences here ar more easily.

If there REALLY is a NEED for more labor in America, then change the quotas and allow more legal aliens in, DON'T REWARD THOSE WHO BREAK OUR LAWS BY ALLOWING THEM TO SETTLE HERE.

When Bush says that he is proposing a program which allows aliens in in the event there is a job for which no Americans are available, he is being naive or disingenuous.
Those employers who are pushing this are pushing it precisely because they want to AVOID hiring Americans for wage reasons, or because they want to import friends or relatives or friends from their home country. And once here, even temporarily, these people need only conceive and deliver one child here and they and that child will remain here forever.

Bush's motive in this are SO transparent I am embarrassed and ashamed. He is pandering to one ethnic group - the Hispanics, in hopes that this will generate more Republican voters and to curry favor and financial support from business interets. He is NOT serving the American public or America's best interests.

In the ongoing war against trerrorism, border security is one of our most pressing issues and on this he and his administration have not only failed, they are actively seeking to undermine it further.

Unless Bush changes his position on this issue, he does not deserve a second term. Write in Tancredi or Alan Keyes in November of 2004.

[Spiff]

If all we do is make it impossible for businesses that currently depend on employing illegals to continue to do so, they will be forced to (a) go out of business (b) move overseas or (c) if it is the kind of business that cannot be replaced by overseas competitors (restaurants), raise their prices enormously and thus shrink their business. As for rounding up and holding 8,000,000+ illegals, we lack the manpower and the prison space. Restoring the military draft so we can build prison camps all across the Southwest in order to protect ourselves from gardeners, maids, and other low wage workers strikes me as a poor use of scarce resources during wartime.

Hey, what other laws should we just give up on because enforcement is too nasty or politically uncomfortable? Let's legalize drugs, prostitution, etc. We should not look for tax evaders or cheaters because we don't have the resources to investigate the millions of cheaters or to enforce the law against those we catch. We should eliminate all other laws against unfair business practices while we're at it.

The rest of your post is crap (well all of it, actually). We would not need a draft, prison camps, etc. to enforce the current immigration laws.

[VU4G10]

 

The Wall Street Journal

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[DumpsterDiver]

Like it or not, we are a nation of laws where criminals are not rewarded.

Do you see that happening in practice when it comes to illegals? I haven't see it here in L.A. in quite some time.

(I'll limit my comments to the above lest I offend anyone's delicate sensibilties.)

Joe, pass me a beer, would'cha?

[ZULU]

If we grant amnesty to 8 million illegals, 16 million will follow. If we grant it to 16 million, 32 million will come after them.

Being born in the world doesn't give someone the right to become an American.

WE shouldn't be picking up the burden in OUR country for the failures of OTHER governments to address their pressing social issues.

[jnarcus]

You are so correct. Where does the WSJ get off claiming 20 years of trying to enforce illegal immigration laws? If anything a blind eye has been turned to allow anyone across. In fact during the Clinto years it was encouraged. I am so sick of the elites hiding behind their gated community mentality and avoiding what happens when there are illegals anging out on the corneres actively trying to get people ti "hire them" Outside of the simple crack down on WalMart cleaners WHERE has there been a concerted effort to have businesses truly enforce the immigration laws? NOWHERE

[pogo101]

How about a tax on wire transfers to Mexico? $5 per wire plus 1% of the amount. No, make it 3%.

[Joe Hadenuf]

Maybe your right. Perhaps I should have typed, "We were a nation of laws".

Oh, and it's too early for beer. But feel free.

[azhenfud]

"If all we do is make it impossible for businesses that currently depend on employing illegals to continue to do so, they will be forced to (a) go out of business"

If they are willing to continue illegal activity, we'd be much the better if they did go out of business.

"(b) move overseas"

They are just short of doing that anyway. If they could, they'd jump the border faster than an Illegalien on a moonless night because there is no incentive from the FedGov for them to stay, no penalties when they do, and Illegaliens are part of the problem. Simply put, if laborers are paid more, they'll be abled to pay more.

"or (c) if it is the kind of business that cannot be replaced by overseas competitors (restaurants), raise their prices enormously and thus shrink their business."

Illegaliens and those that hire them contribute to a false standard of living by keeping wages and prices of goods and services artificially low. Many of them and others affected by their impact on the economy have to resort to some taxpayer funded support program at some point because their low wages prevent them from acquiring those goods and services on their own. The net effect is lower paid laborers pay less in taxes which increase the tax burden on the middle class and businesses. That in turn, causes many more into assistance programs, further increasing "entitlement" spending when there's no room in Governments' budgets to do so.

In short, there is nothing but economic disaster by having low-wage, underpaid labor illegally within our borders.