[PhiKapMom]

Please read this article by Linda Chavez with an open mind as she makes some very good points.

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[PhiKapMom]

This article by Linda Chavez is very good. Encourage everyone to make their comments in a manner that lends to discourse from a variety of views but leaves out the animosity that is appearing on some threads. It is much easier to read and comprehend a position someone is advocating when that animosity is removed.

Thanks in advance!

PKM

[KantianBurke]

But why would we want American workers, who we've spent trillions of dollars educating for 13 or 14 years, on average, to perform jobs that require only the most minimal skills?

Its not a question of wanting such a job. If more and more white collar jobs are sent abroad or HB1'ed to death, then those who have families to support will take almost any job to make ends meet as well as to pay those staggering taxes the illegals have been and will continue to use. The problem though is that since there will be a flood of low skilled immigrants coming in, wages will drop like a stone and job opportunities will be scarce.

[SolutionsOnly]

The government is contiuing to abdicate it's primary responsibility to secure the borders. Bush's proposal does nothing to address the problem.

The plan in unacceptable. A redux of Reagan's 1986 amnesty (which turned out to be a great big lie). We were promised that problem was supposed to be fixed then, remember?

[junta]

What, that our supposed high tech miracle economy depends on the smoke and mirrors of an endless supply of stoop labor? That Chavez can get a gardner on the cheap while our taxes go up, the deficits spiral out of control to pay for her luxury? What a scam privatized profits, socialized costs and we are supposed to believe this is conservative?

[SolutionsOnly]

Lou Dobbs emphatically made a very good point last night:

"we are not a market.
we are not an economy.
We are a NATION!"

[HarleyD]

The flip side of this argument is how much money does it cost to the economy in terms of health care, education and social services, etc. to care for illegals? We might find that money saved from these areas would more than offset paying people a decent wage.

[kevao]

But why would we want American workers, who we've spent trillions of dollars educating for 13 or 14 years, on average, to perform jobs that require only the most minimal skills?

Yeah, better they be on unemployment insurance and welfare.

[deport]

Jobs is the key to making this entire process work. Most of the the illegals are here for jobs. Control the employment process and a lot of the illegal problem disappears. No jobs no reason for the vast majority to be here..... How this will be done is the catch.

We haven't seen the legislation proposals much less the regulation details.... However the government is going to have to build a huge data bank with easy access for the employer to be able to determine if the applicant has comported with the registration process. Then the employer must be held accountable with stiff penalities if necessary in order to enforce the 'hire only registered' applicants....

doable..... maybe

[Texas Federalist]

Her thoughtful points are related to the guest worker program, which isn't the most objectionable piece of this proposal. The other is amnesty for illegals already here. The only case she makes is that we can't deport 10 million illegals, might as well make them legal. This is lunacy. If the illegals know that the U.S. grants amnesty every few years, there is an incentive to break our immigration laws and come to the U.S. illegally, and wait for a liberal president to make them legal.

[kellynla]

The San Diego Union Tribune:

Illegal immigrants cost the taxpayers $20 billion every year.

34 percent of legal Mexican immigrants are on welfare right now.

25 percent of illegals are as well.

This number will rise with the amnesty.

Most illegals are willing to work hard, but as the numbers prove, millions are not.

[Kevin Curry]

If [we] could wave a magic wand and make [them] disappear overnight, the rest of us would suffer by having to pay more for everything from the food we put on the table to the houses in which we live. Our office buildings wouldn't get cleaned, our crops wouldn't get picked, our meat wouldn't get processed, nor our tables cleaned when we go out to eat.

And that is why, Mr. Lincoln, the south simply cannot tolerate--nor can this nation tolerate--the elimination of slavery at this point in time.

[Brian Allen]

<< There is no way that the United States can find and deport 8-12 million illegal aliens in this country, and even if we could, we would do more harm than good. >>

What absolute BS. Chavez had better sit this one out.

We can and must enforce our nation's laws and we can and must round up these felons and their spawn and we can and must deport them all.

Better that we accept and absorb the consequences of righting this awful criminal-alien invasion now, than cause our children and our grandchildren to have been denied our nation's Rule of Law -- and with it the civilization we have long vanguarded and must forever guard.

[harpo11]

At one time in America's proud history a President spoke to Americans telling us that the government is "for the people, of the people and by the people." And, we stood firm in that powerful covenant.

Today we have a President who tells Americans the government is "for the illegal aliens, of the illegal aliens and by the illegal aliens." And, he wants us to stand firm in this new covenant.

I won't.

Well, President Bush, go kiss up to Vicente Fox all you want. You ain't goin' ta get my vote. You've done real bad and gone too far by rewarding outlaws and your rich campaign donors looking for cheap labor and servants, serfs and slaves and kickin' your loyal law-abiding hard working conservative base, your rock solid citizens in the arse too many times.

I'm breakin' my chains and leavin' the republican plantation.

I don't know if you ever had to go to your local hospital emergency room lately, probably not since you are protected from such regular everyday low class nuisances, but go in one if you can and see the plight, the suffering, the long lines and hopeless looks on the faces of citizens and illegals as they search for medical relief.

We can't even afford to take care of our own citizens let alone those who break the law and enter our country illegally. But we have been, and although you say it makes lettuce cheaper, we are making it up in welfare, social services and education costs several times over the cost of that cheap head of lettuce.

I guess Hillary Clinton and her fellow donkeys are braying up a screeching storm of hope and delight in seeing how you just broke the sacred covenant with your base.

[Diva Betsy Ross]

Whenever I see Linda I have to remind myself that she is a Republican. she calls herself a Conservative, however, she has demonstrated that she is no Conservative.

The issue , as I see it is that most people who call themselves Republicans ,will not have a problem with President's platform.

It is the Conservatives who do have a problem with this performance, I doubt you will find anything written by any Republican, anywhere, that is going to force this issue to be whitewashed with President Bush's Conservative base. It is just not going to happen.

This was one blow too many, and Karl Rove and company did not estimate how mad we already were to start.

[healey22]

Linda Chavez? Isn't this the women who had an illegal alien scrubbing her toilets (also not paying ss taxes on this slave labor) and was unable to accept a position in the Bush administration? If so, she has no credibility on this issue.

[KC_Conspirator]

PKM, I will say it again TAKE ME OFF THIS PING LIST!

[independentmind]

I like Chavez and think she is correct about Bush's proposal.

[citizen]

This Chavez OpEd is pretty much the WH spin to try to sugar coat the issue.

Make no mistake, this is amnesty for those already here and an open door for more to come in from any country. They are supposed to be here for 3 or 6 years, then be banished back to their country of origin. That's the spin.

Nope, folks, that ain't how it will go. It's not just the worker that will be allowed to come here (or stay here if they are already here), it's the worker's family also. During those 3 to 6 years babies get born, anchor babies they are called, then they never have to leave. They get full social services, the whole 9 yards.

I will not vote for Bush.

[Eighth Square]

The long term effects of this proposal will create a permanent under-class, similar to Mexico's. PC is preventing us from identifying an important fact - Mexico, potentially one the wealthiest countries in the southern hemisphere, is a basket case of corruption - the filthy rich and the incredibly poor. Along with the decent folk entering our country we have inherited hordes of the worst kind who just cannot believe the naivete of the American people and their government. They will play upon this naivete and manipulate the system at the expense of the rest of us. Since most don't speak english to any degree they will congregate in ever expanding enclaves where they will be influenced by their peers and guided in ways as to how to work the system.

With our adoption of the small family, through birth control and abortion, they will outpopulate us. As the rest of the nation's workforce moves on into a high tech environment such as our inevitable journey to the stars, most of them will be left behind, many with nothing to do. What happens then? As we advance through the century, technology will eliminate many of the jobs they are currently engaged in. What happens to them? might be fifty million of them by then.

Our experts have looked to the future and determined that we simply do not have have the population to continue growing and expanding our economy - this is there temporary solution. There has to be a better way.