Egypt Airliner CRASHED in Egypt

KINGTV News-Seattle | 1/2/2004 | ME

[Gorons]

Local news just flashed that an Egypt Airliner has crashed in Egypt...

Reporting majority of ~135 passengers are French tourists....

[Central Scrutiniser]

The only thing coincidental is your faulty logic. You cobble together whatever you can to prove your conspiracy, rather than look at facts. Planes crash, charter airlines crash more frequently, charter planes in poor countries crash even more frequently. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

[Steve Eisenberg]

Entirely coincidentally. Right.

We'll never know for sure, because, unlike with EgyptAir 990 (full of generals, deliberately flown into the Atlantic per US investigators), the Egyptians will not again make the mistake of allowing an independent investigation.

This plane was maintained in Norway, so it can't be chalked up to being a third world airline.

[WhistlingPastTheGraveyard]

Your repeated assertion that any suspicion of terrorism (in a Islamist country, during a heightened worldwide alert, with air traffic being the primary focus) consititutes a "conspiracy theory" (what a tired, old phrase that is) is beyond laughable. From the tone and content of your posts, it appears that getting the truth about what really brought down this plane is secondary to proving how much smarter and more well-traveled you are than everybody else. Your sneering snobbery is every bit as inappropriate on this thread as the mocking of the crash's French victims.

But, this has been a recurring theme around here. Elitist pollyannas, jumping at the chance to scold the conspiracy crackpots for suspecting Islamist terrorism while the world is at war with Islamist terrorists. Yet somehow, those of us who hear "Egypt" "plane crash" and "dead Western tourists" during these times and think "Islamists" are the stupid ones.

Whatever, man...

[Central Scrutiniser]

Blither on....

Im not constituting a conspiracy theory, no, just pointing out that in the pure abscence of any facts about terrorism, we look at the facts we do know. Airplanes crash, Charter airplanes crash more often, charter airplanes in poor countries crash much more often. All your other attacks on me are just two bit ad homenim attempts to bolster your weak position.

But you really take the cake when you have to trot out the new hip word "elitist", for christ sakes man, think for yourself for once. I never discounted that it could be terrorism, but I highly doubt that it was, because, planes actually crash without terrorism, play the odds.

Now I have to get back to my Skull and Bones meeting, us internationalist Illuminati members are having a "mock the peons" party tonite, and I have to get my top hat blocked. (BTW, that was sarcasm, I hope you got it)

[eno_]

I listed five good reasons to suspect terrorism:

They crash with Tony Blair is in the 'hood.

They crash while there is a manhunt on for AQ operatives infiltrating flight crews.

They crash when they are full of French tourists and the Moslems are having a hissy - big demos - over the French bannig headscarves in schools.

They crash when numerous other flights have been cancelled due to security concerns.

They crash in places where gate and ramp security sucks.

Moreover, it has ALWAYS been SOP to deny successful terror/sabotage attacks. In WWII numerous sabotage/infiltration successes and attempts were kept secret in the U.S. and other countries. It would be more surprising to find openness and honesty. No "conspiracy," that's just how it is.

Now there is a sixth reason to suspect terrorism: It seems that the specific threat was explosives carried in a body cavity.

You might count this as number seven: The HSA considered going to a red terror alert in the past couple of days.

[eno_]

Oh, and one more to contraindicate bad maintenence: The charter service has their planes serviced by a contractor in Norway. If this plane was falling apart, you might not want to fly any other airline that uses the same shop.

[mercy]

Didn't 'wish' anything tommy. Don't get your panties in a wad.

[xrp]

Don't you know, everything short of the extinction of the dinosaur is a direct result of Bush's policy.

Actually, the extinction of the dinosaurs WAS Bush/Cheney's fault as they had contacts who steered that rough asteroid into the Yucatan area ~60 million years ago. Bush/Cheney needed to engineer the extinction of the dinosaurs into to force large amounts of biomass into the earth's crust to mix with dead/decaying plant matter so that oil would be formed and Halliburton could drill for it all!

[autoresponder]

please click frame for mood music

[Central Scrutiniser]

Which contractor in Norway, what was the level of the maintenance? Most likely they did C checks and D checks for the airline, that is pretty common for charters and small airlines to farm out that stuff, as you need a pretty extensive amount of capital (buildings, people, spares, etc) to do that maintenance. But, they also had to have their own maintenance staff for the day to day stuff to keep the planes in the air.

I still stand by the fact that their maintenance wasn't world class. When you have only 2 planes, the economics of scale work against you.

[Central Scrutiniser]

Little more info, the day before the crash, the plane was running nearly all day long without any overnight time, just the time between flights. It ran from Sharm to Turin, back to Sharm, then to Venice, to Cairo, and back to Sharm at 330 in the morning, with one hour turn around before its flight to Cairo then Paris DeGualle. Also read on an aviation board, but not confirmed yet, that Flash Air had been barred by Swiss officials from any operations in Switzerland, due to their poor safety record.

I'll do some more digging.

[WhistlingPastTheGraveyard]

Im not constituting a conspiracy theory, no, just pointing out that in the pure abscence of any facts about terrorism, we look at the facts we do know. Airplanes crash, Charter airplanes crash more often, charter airplanes in poor countries crash much more often. All your other attacks on me are just two bit ad homenim attempts to bolster your weak position.

My position is that you're pompous windbag who gets his rocks off trying to make people feel stupid for offering opinions. My words couldn't bolster that position any more than your own words already have.

[Central Scrutiniser]

I'm not trying to make people look stupid, you are doing a fine job of it on your own...

[bluefish]

You are right, it is way off topic and a dumb debate to have here. I never inteded for it to go this far and honestly don't even know where we are with respect to who intended what in the various replies. This happens when you start replying to "My Messages" as I have done and lose site of the original thread. Apologies to all and an extended hand of friendship to Tom.

[LikeLight]

More info from a poster on Airliners.net (unknown credibility):

According to the Al-Ahram,An Egyptian news paper, and from the ATC of Sharm AL shake, the aircraft was at 5500 Feet when all the sudden the radar showed that the aircraft started shifting hard to right and left and then dropped 200 feet then started descending to 4000 feet then disappeared. Another interesting thing is the The F/O of the previous flight from Italy to Sharm just before the accident indicated that the aircraft was perfectly fine and working fine with no problems at the long flight from Italy to sharm. The aircraft received a C/d check four month ago. And was leased from ILFC For five years. The victims Included 133 French tourist , one Moracan, one Japanese and 13 crew member in which 6 were on duty and the other 6 were not.,

The 6 off-duty Egyptian crew members scare me the most - it was an off-duty crewman who dove Egypt Air 990 into the sea . . .

[eno_]

The 6 off-duty Egyptian crew members scare me the most - it was an off-duty crewman who dove Egypt Air 990 into the sea . .

Well, hello. There was another post saying the airplane was in 6000 feet of water and the black box would be unrecoverable. How convenient. I wonder if that depth will be as reliable as the reports of "heavy fog."

[Central Scrutiniser]

Most likely the 6 off duty crew members were the prior crew (Captian and F/O, along with 4 flight attendandants) deadheading back to Cairo. Not too worried about that, if they wanted to hijack the plane it would have been a hell of a lot easier when they were working the flight, dont ya think?

[mjaneangels@aolcom]

"Her passenger fleet is composed of Boeing 737-3Q8's unless she has some 727's on lease."

I used to build 737s and I never heard of a 3Q8. That is not part of the model number. It must be some number that the owners use.

[mjaneangels@aolcom]

"Reading your post the vision off a train with people overloaded flashed in my head. Is 135 a big load for the type of aircraft... I wonder."

No, that is about average for 737.