Town Refuses to Ask Citizens If Library Porn Should Be Filtered Out - Please Help Us!

Plan2Succeed.org ^ | 22 Dec 2003 | Plan2Succeed.org

[plan2succeed.org]

Town Refuses to Ask Citizens If Library Porn Should Be Filtered Out; Plan2Succeed.org Seeking Pro Bono Counsel.

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Something is wrong when a small group of people called a Library Board of Trustees determines that a public library must continue to allow access to pornography despite admittedly being outside the library's mission, the Township Committee claims it is powerless to stop the Board, and the citizens have no say.

[milan]

Wow, I find myself on the other side now. Ashcroft is a prude if he thinks that "art" that has been in that building for over 50 years is offensive.

[ought-six]

Sorry, but I'm against censorship. I can't stand rap "music," but I don't want to see it banned, because once you start banning that, some extremist will want to ban Country, and Rock, and Gospel, etc. The surest way to get rid of something that is offensive is not to buy it or support it in the first place. Rap is around because people are buying it, and that is the only reason. Take the profit out of the equation, and you're left with zero.

[VRWC_minion]

I don't find it offensive but I do think its distracting as a background for making public statements. In addition, there are some cultures that hate us right now that do find the showing of the naked female body as an abomination.

Transmitting the images of a naked statute to the entire world that has folks who will use that image to pursuade others to take up arms against us isn't the brightest thing we could do right now.

[VRWC_minion]

You say your against censorship. Does this mean that you would put a TV set in a childs room turned to a porn station ? Because if you turn it off, your practicing censorship.

[Theodore R.]

Isn't another of the problems one of the uninformed "people" choosing their library board members? People just vote for "familiar names" and never learn about the library philosophies of such candidates. Or county commissions name library board members from approved lists, all of whom adhere to the liberal view of libraries. Therefore, outraged citizens cannot understand "what happened." They just go on with an occasional complaint and vote for the "familiar names" on the ballot.

[Always Right]

Wow, I find myself on the other side now. Ashcroft is a prude if he thinks that "art" that has been in that building for over 50 years is offensive.

He may be a bit of a 'prude', but that is his choice at what he considers appropriate for his place of work. I really don't see the point of having a statue of a naked lady in a government building unless it is an art museum. It is not the appropriate location for it, reguardless of how long it has been there.

[GladesGuru]

Dear Always Right,

I fear that here you may have belied your tag line in one sense at least. The problem seems to be a community desire to not have childrenlooking at porn on library computers.

Alas, reduced to its core principles, this is unfortuntely primarily a parent/child issue. If the lil' monsters want to access porn, they will. Count on it. The real situation is that parents have not properly educated their children about such things, about the proper relationship between male and female, and why porn isn't a good thing.

Merely banning it makes it that much more desirable. Deficient parenting can not be compensated for by any known mechanism. That is why those desiring to replace the Republic with some version of socialism deliberately trashed the family.

The unavoidable task is the reimposition of the traditional social contract wherein each American was responsible for his or her own behavior according to the social contract as defined in the Constitution and the state in which the individual citizen lives.

This would mean that some areas, like the Big Sh*tty (AKA New York City) might well allow anything to be accessed via library internet and some smaller cities in the South might not. But the key is local. In this case, the reliance on central decision making by a DC office is most questionable.

Complex issue, but even though I don't like the DC office of the library union (so to speak) being used as 'an authority' over the locals, still I am more afraid of allowing the parents to avoid the responsibility of parenting by dropping the responsibility for their lil darlins porn watching on the shoulders of the librarians.

At most, the librarians should notify the parents if Junior or Jane is watching such materials. Leave the responsibility for parental decision making to the parents!

Repeat: Leave parenting to the parents.

[Always Right]

Sorry, but I'm against censorship. I can't stand rap "music," but I don't want to see it banned

There is a huge difference between banning something and not allowing children to have free and easy access to it. I really don't understand why people fail to see this. There hasn't been one post about banning pornography, but that seems to be the essense of the arguement against filtering is.

[Always Right]

You seem to be implying that I have advocated a federal law or something. No, I just want local parents and citizens to take control of what goes into the libraries they have paid for with their tax dollars. This has been taken over by the ALA, and is not what most parents/taxpayers want. Find me a city where most of the people want children to be able to freely access porn on library computers. If there is one, let the kids freely access porn there. There isn't one, but this is what most libraries do against the wishes of the public. I just want the people to take back the control of their libraries which they rightfully should have.

[GirlShortstop]

The Wichita Public Library has applied for nearly $60,000 in federal funding for fiscal 2003

Makes me wonder how many "problems" would be resolved by citizens *if* the Federal gubermint's tentacles were to be severed thus allowing the money otherwise sucked down into DC for disbursement would remain in place to be used as the citizens of that area see fit.

"The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them."  Einstein

[Amelia]

Actually, if you really understand what is going on with this post it is about local control.

I agree with your post #7:

Does the city/county have any authority over the library? How is the library board of directors chosen? You will have a better chance going after politicians than you will library board. So hit the politicians who have control over library funding and/or staffing.

I've also said that my experience with one popular brand of filtering software shows that it's not a perfect solution. It doesn't filter out everything objectionable, and it does block nice conservative sites such as FR.

When I was a child, and when my children were younger, there were "child" and "adult" library cards. Children weren't allowed to check out the same types of books as adults were.

In the long run, however, the public library is not a babysitting service. Parents shouldn't be leaving children there unattended. If you're worried about your kids accessing porn at the public library, don't let them go there without you, and keep an eye on them while they are there.

[Amelia]

That can't happen when most localities have taken fed money via the Universal Telephone Service Fee through the FCC. It's the old "strings attached" routine.

Yeah, we've been bought off.

[Always Right]

I've also said that my experience with one popular brand of filtering software shows that it's not a perfect solution. It doesn't filter out everything objectionable, and it does block nice conservative sites such as FR.

You really get what you pay for. The cheap software just looks for key words, and if they are found block the site. There are many alternative solutions that offer better results.

When I was a child, and when my children were younger, there were "child" and "adult" library cards. Children weren't allowed to check out the same types of books as adults were.

Which is exactly what is being advocated here. Different levels of access for different people. Shoot, even kids can get complete access if their parents OK it.

In the long run, however, the public library is not a babysitting service. Parents shouldn't be leaving children there unattended. If you're worried about your kids accessing porn at the public library, don't let them go there without you, and keep an eye on them while they are there.

Agreed, but public libraries funded by the parents should take some simple precautions to help. I have yet to see a propelling arguement why kids should be freely allowed to view porn in libraries. There isn't one. It should be reasonable to assume a public library is a safe place for kids. But most aren't.

[Bluntpoint]

My kids have been forever scarred after logging on to the Sesame Street Thanksgiving site!

[Amelia]

You really get what you pay for. The cheap software just looks for key words, and if they are found block the site. There are many alternative solutions that offer better results.

I'd suspect that most school districts and public libraries will end up with "the cheap stuff".

Agreed, but public libraries funded by the parents should take some simple precautions to help.

There's your key: "funded by the parents". If the parents are unhappy with the way the library is being run, they should deny funding until it's brought in line.

I have yet to see a propelling arguement why kids should be freely allowed to view porn in libraries. There isn't one.

I don't know that I've yet seen a compelling argument that kids are being "freely allowed to view porn in libraries". Have you? Do you know, or know of, children who go to the library to view porn?

I'll add that, even though I have software on my computer to ensure the kids only view "kid safe" sites, I don't leave my teenagers unattended on the internet for long periods of time, and I check the history periodically after they've been on the computer.

It should be reasonable to assume a public library is a safe place for kids. But most aren't.

I'm familiar with the public libraries in 7 counties in 3 states. All of them seem to be safe places for children - however, I wouldn't leave my small children unattended in any of them -- or any other public place, for that matter.

It's called "parenting".

[Amelia]

Wow, that's a BIG BIRD! ;-)

[milan]

Well that is not Ashcroft's building. It is ours.

[milan]

Also, the name of that statue is "The Spirit of Justice" and it belongs right where it is. Isn't it ironic that he would cover the "Spirit of Justice"? I would be more concerned with the ramifications of what he did moreso that the fact that it shows a breast.

[milan]

I don't find it offensive but I do think its distracting as a background for making public statements.

I see your point, so maybe it should be moved to elsewhere in the building, but it should by no means be removed or censored.