Posted on 12/25/2003 10:19:48 AM PST by 4.1O dana super trac pak
Edited on 04/29/2004 2:03:37 AM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]
Would you support a temporary work visa for illegal aliens?
(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.com ...
Our forebears were hard working, frugal, American patriots who put God, country and family first, that's how.
A good deal of the reason is because a significant portion of the American workforce is locked out of many of the jobs that illegals fill because of government regulations and liability insurance exclusions on underage workers. Specifically, those under 18. For instance, when I was in high school, one of my classmates worked a full-time shift drilling oilwells. Absolutely not an option for a 17 year old today. A case in point--My neighbors own an art gallery & needed someone to run a weed-eater & hedgetrimmers around the landscaping at the gallery. They talked to us about hiring our 16 YO son but later discovered they could not legally hire anyone under 18 to do that type of work. Many of what were traditionally teenage type jobs, like mowing lawns, are now off-limits to those workers. Illegal workers fill the void.
Just two days ago, I noticed a jobs posting on the door at my local grocery. Needed are workers in several departments w/ the addendum that those over 18 YOA are especially encouraged to apply. For sure, I would imagine that the store wants more mature workers for lots of good reasons, but other reasons are because of state laws that strictly & rather severely limit the number of hours underage workers can be on the job and the additional & burdensome amount of paperwork the employer has to complete documenting that underage workers are not working past the legal limits of hours on the job. The end result is that even for jobs that under 18 workers could legally perform, they don't get the job because the employer just doesn't want to have to piss around w/ all the extra paper & regulations involved in hiring them.
Up until the beginning of the illegal worker invasion, most of the seasonal agricultural work was done by young men ages 15 - 18 during summer break.
(In fact, that is why we have a summer break to begin with, so that children could stay at home and help bring in the crop harvest.)
Now, the only thing we are harvesting in this country (besides the lettuce, corn, chicken, peanuts, etc.) during the summer is gang murder and millions upon millions of illegal workers.
Speaking of the legality of not hiring a native American youth under 18 ~versus~ hiring an illegal immigrant - really makes one wonder who is BULLCHITTING who is this country!
There were lots of illegal Mexican workers here before the '90's. I lived in NW Oklahoma for a lot of years. A friend of the family had a job driving the bus(in the 60's) that returned illegals back to Mexico. He'd often tell stories of the recently deported worker beating the bus back to this side of the Rio Grande. In the early '70's, my uncle-in-law lived in one of those gated golf-course country club communities--upper middle class--outside Fort Worth. Nearly every member of the community employed a part-time illegal as well as the did the CC. Illegal Mexican workers have long been a significantly sized workforce in the US.
To start with, the United States is an immigrant nation. Immigrants have built virtually everything post-contact. At the heart of every expansion you will find waves of immigration. Without immigrant labor, we would not have become ''the greatest industrial nation on earth''. The Chinese & Irish built the railroads, the Germans & Poles were at the heart of the beer, construction, packing, agriculture, machine & foundry industries in the upper middle west. Germans were also a significant presence in agriculture & ranching in Texas. During the potato famine (1845), approx. 2 million Irish came to the US & formed a huge pool of unskilled labor & filled many menial labor jobs across a multitude of industries--railroads & garment industry, notably. Scandinavians settled in the upper Mid-west and expanded the agriculture & fishing industries. Italians were a major force in fruit, wine & contruction. And each group in their turn was met w/ the same sort of derision that is currently being heaped upon Hispanics. But the simple & undeniable fact is that this nation would not be the force it is today w/o the tremendous fuel of expansion that the immigrant has provided.
And in 5 years all US citizens in those states bordering those should move until eventually (sooner than later) the Mexican flag will be raised on the capital steps. Sorry, but this is one Texan who's staying put and fighting for my homestead and state.
I am sure that you have read of the burden that these people put on our society, not to mention the fact that they are forcing us to change our societal ways. I say there is a limit and we have surpassed it. It is time to take back control of our society or we will be overun like a wounded animal in the forest that is consumed by the forest's scavengers.
To recap, your question was: How did we become the greatest industrial nation on earth before all those wonderful illegals came here?
Considering that the United States Bureau of Immigration wasn't created until the early 1890's & working under the assumption that anyone who wants to argue about immigration should be aware of that fact, that for all practical purposes the United States had open borders (at a federal level) prior to that time, the understanding should have been that all immigration up until that time was just plain immigration from a federal standpoint. However, you cannot say that all immigration up until that time was legal immigration because, in fact, many states had state immigration laws & those laws were often violated. For instance, during the period 1830-1850 many of the former colonial states enacted laws baring the entry of Irish, Catholics & German settlers.
Insofar as your remark, Thanks for spouting the liberal line to me, my experience is that when someone begins to hurl invective, it's a clear indication that they are bereft of a rational & educated rebutal. To put that into terms you can understand, that means: Elli-2, raybbr-zip.
What kind of business are you in?
Well said.
BUMP
I am sure that you have read of the burden that these people put on our society, not to mention the fact that they are forcing us to change our societal ways. I say there is a limit and we have surpassed it. It is time to take back control of our society or we will be overun like a wounded animal in the forest that is consumed by the forest's scavengers.
You fail to respond to the facts presented time and again that illegal immigrants are a drain on our society. They cannot, due to lack of education or the fact that most of them are unskilled labor, raise the level of our society. It is impossible. Please don't give me the gardener/pool cleaner arguement. I don't own a pool and I do my own gardening.
I work with illegals because my company will only hire people that are willing to work for next to nothing. Their standard of living is increased ten fold working for just above minimum wage. While an America, who follows the laws of our country, could not make it at the same wage. Hence, they would experience a drop in their standard of living.
People like you tend to ignore the dilution of our society by the incursion of these criminals. Why?
When can we as a country, exercise our right to say that people cannot come here unabated?
How can you support criminal behavior as you do? You post many arguements justifying illegal behavior. When do we as a country get to say "enough"?
As for the arguement that we are a nation of immigrants - while that may be true do we not then have the right to say - now- it is time to stop it? If not, then, why not?
I don't understand how you can justify criminality. We need to expunge these criminals now.
There really is no arguing with folks who refuse to see the vital role the Mexican laborer plays in our present economy. I think they walk around with blinders on. Maybe all the cubicle-bound can pretend that they don't depend on south of the border labor but anyone who works with their hand knows they are everywhere.
Are you only for illegal Mexicans or do Poles, Asians, Russians, Indians, Ethiopians count also? Part of this issue is the fact that we are only going to give all of these special rights to illegal Hispanics from mostly Mexico. Why the hypocrisy?
I do not depend on illegal labor. It is forced upon me by the lax enforcement of our laws. If I could I would go into a restaurant and ask if they have illegals there. If they said yes then I would walk out. Can you imagine the repercussions?
The part of the equation you conveniently leave out is the effect this is having on our society. I do not want to speak spanish. At all. Ever. Hispanics add nothing to my life per se. Yet, at every turn I am forced to accomodate hispanic languages, traditions and norms. Why? Why can't we ask them to assimilate into American society the way that has been done by millions of legal immigrants before?
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.