IBM to Export Highly Paid Jobs to India, China

Yahoo News ^ | Dec 15, 2003 | William M. Bulkeley and Peter Fritsch

[neverdem]

Mon Dec 15,12:14 AM ET

In one of the largest moves to "offshore" highly paid U.S. software jobs, International Business Machines Corp. (NYSE:IBM - News) has told its managers to plan on moving the work of as many as 4,730 programmers to India, China and elsewhere, Monday's Wall Street Journal reported.

delayed 20 mins - disclaimer Quote Data provided by Reuters

The unannounced plan, outlined in company documents viewed by The Wall Street Journal, would replace thousands of workers at IBM facilities in Southbury, Conn., Poughkeepsie, N.Y., Raleigh, N.C., Dallas, Boulder, Colo., and elsewhere in the U.S.Already, the managers have been told, IBM has hired 500 engineers in India to take on some of the work that will be moved.

IBM calls its plan, first presented internally to some midlevel managers in October, "Global Sourcing." It involves people in its Application Management Services group, a part of IBM's giant global-services operations, which comprise more than half IBM's 315,000 employees.

IBM's plan, still under development, will take place over a number of months in stages. About 947 people are scheduled to be notified during the first half of the coming year that their work will be handled overseas in the future. It isn't yet clear how many of the other 3,700 jobs identified as "potential to move offshore" in the IBM documents will move next year or some time later.

However, the fate of some of the targeted jobs isn't certain: IBM managers still haven't figured out whether all of the work the jobs represent can be performed just as well abroad. The jobs involve updating and improving software for IBM's own business operations.

Some workers are scheduled to be informed of the plan for their jobs by the end of January. After that they will be expected to train an overseas replacement worker in the U.S. for several weeks. The IBM workers marked for replacement have 60 days to find another job inside the company, likely to be a difficult task at a time when IBM is holding down hiring.

IBM declined to comment on what it called "internal presentations."

Wall Street Journal Staff Reporters William M. Bulkeley and Peter Fritsch contributed to this article.

[neverdem]

FWIW

[RiflemanSharpe]

With all the good paying jobs going overseas how do they expect us to buy what they sell?

[Bikers4Bush]

Well at least we won't have to go through the bothersome chore of giving any programming technology and secrets to China anymore. They'll be free to just take them.

[canis major]

Time to start boycotting IBM too.

[StolarStorm]

"Some workers are scheduled to be informed of the plan for their jobs by the end of January. After that they will be expected to train an overseas replacement worker in the U.S. for several weeks. The IBM workers marked for replacement have 60 days to find another job inside the company, likely to be a difficult task at a time when IBM is holding down hiring. "

Anyone who trains their replacement is a traitor to themselves and their country.

[neverdem]

Maybe a boycott of IBM is appropriate.

[Mo1]

Hmmmm .. Moving to India, an area that is a hot bed for terrorists and then there is the fact that India and Pakistan keep threatening to nuke each other

Something tells me that IBM will regret this move

[cpst12]

This is a net positive for economy...it will free up those 5000 programmers for other opportunities...the lines are always too long at Walmart, I bet some ex-programmers wouldn't need too much training to be able to handle the registers, right?

[Hat-Trick]

They didn't pay attention to what Michael Dell did when he moved his tech-support for the business side of Dell back "on-shore".

[TaxRelief]

Ahem. Did Willie Green give you permission to post this story?

[snippy_about_it]

You are correct. I've been saying for sometime now if they keep exporting American jobs and bringing in H1b visa workers to take American jobs then how can we afford to buy their products while we are unemployed or underemployed. They should be cognizant of the fact that this also means with lower wages or no wages we will be paying less taxes to support the politicians who support this loss of our jobs.

[joesnuffy]

IBM calls its plan, first presented internally to some midlevel managers in October, "Global Sourcing." It involves people in its Application
Management Services group, a part of IBM's giant global-services operations, which comprise more than half IBM's 315,000 employees.

Slave labor is a wonderfull thing...especially in countries that have well educated slaves

[Norse]

Well, what exactly do you want? If IBM does not take advantage of this, other international companies WILL, and I promise you that they WILL put OUR companies out of business, leaving us completely dead in the water. The correct thing is not to call our businesses traitors for simply wanting to SURVIVE, but to enact reforms here at home that make it more advantageous to do business in the U.S. than in other foreign nations.

[Golden Eagle]

Here's another article about this I attempted to post under Keyword IBM: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=562&ncid=738&e=10&u=/ap/20031215/ap_on_hi_te/ibm_offshoring

IBM to Move Software Jobs to India, China

ARMONK, N.Y. - IBM Corp. plans to move up to several thousand skilled software jobs from the United States to India, China and other countries, which could amount to one of the biggest such actions yet in the technology industry.

IBM documents obtained by The Wall Street Journal said about 4,700 programming jobs could be shifted overseas to save costs, a growing high-tech industry trend known as "offshoring."

More than 900 people are already scheduled to be told of the move in the first half of 2004, while another 3,700 jobs have been identified as having the "potential to move offshore," the Journal said. IBM already has hired 500 engineers in India to take on some of the work that will be moved, the Journal reported.

The division affected is IBM's Application Management Services group, part of Big Blue's huge technology services division. The IBM facilities where workers could be replaced include offices in Dallas, Southbury, Conn., Poughkeepsie, N.Y., Raleigh, N.C., and Boulder, Colo.

IBM spokesman James Sciales said he would not comment on "internal presentations" but noted that most of IBM's work force, which now totals 315,000, has been overseas for years. Sciales also released a statement saying IBM expects hiring in the United States next year will match or exceed 2003 levels.

While companies long ago began moving manufacturing jobs and other blue-collar work to Asia, big business is now increasingly shifting skilled work there as well. According to International Data Corp., foreign workers performed about 5 percent of information technology services for American companies this year, but by 2007, that share will grow to 23 percent.

Often, the American workers being replaced are called upon to train their overseas replacements. The same will be expected of IBM employees whose jobs are being transferred, according to the Journal.

IBM shares were up 76 cents at $93.47 in morning trading on the New York Stock Exchange (news - web sites).

[The Electrician]

With all the good paying jobs going overseas how do they expect us to buy what they sell?

Isn't that a bit of overblown hyperbole? IBM has well over 100,000 high-paying jobs in the US, and they are adding more.

Others on this thread are suggesting boycotting IBM - wouldn't that be a foolish and shortsighted thing to do?

[adam_az]

However, the fate of some of the targeted jobs isn't certain: IBM managers still haven't figured out whether all of the work the jobs represent can be performed just as well abroad. The jobs involve updating and improving software for IBM's own business operations.

Some workers are scheduled to be informed of the plan for their jobs by the end of January. After that they will be expected to train an overseas replacement worker in the U.S. for several weeks. The IBM workers marked for replacement have 60 days to find another job inside the company, likely to be a difficult task at a time when IBM is holding down hiring.

I'm an ex-IBMer, I might be able to clarify what's going. It's maintenance programmers of IBM's internal systems, which are pretty bad as a general rule. The guys who get stuck on internal projects are usually there because they aren't good enough to do work for customers. I can tell you that based on first hand knowlege.

IBM is holding down hiring of NEW employees, but there is a separate internal job board for hiring WITHIN the company. You can bet that many of the better programmers will move around inside the company. Virtually everyone at IBM who has been in the company for a while has moved around quite a bit. It's inevitable.

If you don't find a job internallty in 60 days, you get the "voluntary separation" package, which I was able to get when I quit, because of departmental changes. It's very generous. I found another job (which I don't have to do any travel for!), and used my separation pay and unused vacation hours for a sizable downpayment on a house.

[swarthyguy]

Actually, it's more Pakistan is a worldwide fulcrum of terror.

To clarify things for you, it is the Indians who've been the victims of the waves of jihad for decades.

Nice of you to give the Pakistanis a pass, engage in the FR version of moral equivalence and generally engage in thinking reminiscent of the "cycle of violence" crap put out by the Lefties and the Frence in relation to the MidEast.

[RiflemanSharpe]

With all the good paying jobs going overseas how do they expect us to buy what they sell?
Isn't that a bit of overblown hyperbole? IBM has well over 100,000 high-paying jobs in the US, and they are adding more.

Others on this thread are suggesting boycotting IBM - wouldn't that be a foolish and shortsighted thing to do?


I already do boycott them.

[cpst12]

>>Others on this thread are suggesting boycotting IBM - wouldn't that be a foolish and shortsighted thing to do?


On the contrary, it would be an excellent thing to do. What better way to force companies to behave the way you want them to do?

Waiting for politicians to do anything about it, isn't going to happen. The race to the bottom isn't a race you want to win.

People that care about this issue need to pick a few companies to make an example of, and organize a huge well planned boycott of the offending companies. When they loose 10-15-25% of their business for offshoring, suddenly it won't look so profitable to be offshore.

Not sure if IBM is the right one to boycott, because I don't know how many mainframe purchases are done here on FR...

[RockyMtnMan]

You make the assumption they (foreign competitors) have the talent and innovative drive to beat us in these markets. They will only have the know-how if we move the jobs overseas and train their third-world arses.

These moves are short-sighted and will create a whole new classes of competitors in the future. I predict these same companies will go whining to the fed about IPR and copyright infringements in the near future. We'll here them say "something must be done, we can't compete with them". Right now it's the techies who are suffering, later it will be the short-sight corporations facing their new low-overhead competitors.