WE'RE UNDER ATTACK!: New Gay Theology Challenges Traditional Views of Scripture and Intimacy

washingtonpost.com ^ | August 9, 2003 | Bill Broadway

[DrainBamage]

Robert Goss sits on the radical edge of homosexual theology, calling for churches to abandon centuries-old concepts of "normativity" and accept gay men and lesbians for what he says they are: people made in the image of God whose sexuality is a divine blessing.

Goss believes such a change is inevitable, that a diverse and increasingly vocal movement called "queer theology" will create an impact on Christianity matching that of the 16th-century Protestant Reformation.

[Wallace T.]

Both (Protestants and apostates) rely on the same foundational principle.

The conservative Protestant, or evangelical, churches hold to sola Scriptura, which is to say that tbe Bible, which is the inerrant and infallible Word of God, is the only authority over matters of faith. The apostate churches reject the divine inspiration and authority of Scripture. At most, it is an fallible source of human wisdom to them. Sola Scriptura is the antithesis of "No Scripture."

Two different and mutually exclusive principles (the bases for the 16th Century Protestant-Catholic split and the 20th Century split between liberals and evangelical Protestants).

The basis for the 16th Century Protestant-Catholic split was the primacy of the Magisterium vs. that of Scripture alone. The 20th Century liberal apostate/evangelical Protestant split was predicated on the issue of humanism and rationalism vs. Scripture alone. The principles are different for the Catholics and the liberals, but the same for both the Reformers and their evangelical heirs: sola Scriptura. The purpose for this analogy was to show the fallacy of some Catholics in blaming the Reformation for secular humanism, inasmuch as some Eastern Orthodox blame Catholics for the rise of secular humanism by deviating from their twin pillars of Scripture and tradition by exalting the Papal role in matters of faith and morals.

"The spirit of lawlessness came in with the Reformation, and Liberalism is its offspring."

Cardinal Newman is incorrect in this instance. Were the Reformation the cause of lawlessness, why did the most horrifying expressions of anticlerical and Marxist tyranny and persecution of Christians occur in nations unaffected by or purged of Protestant influences: France, Spain, Mexico, Russia? By and large, the lands that were dominated by Protestantism developed into nations with representative governments, a high degree of individual freedom, and free market economies: the United States, Britain, Canada, Australia, the Netherlands, and the Scandinavian countries. Only in the last century, with the rise of secular humanism and the abandonment of orthodox Christianity in the mainline Protestant churches, did these nations slide into statism.

Why did you bring them (revival of old Catholic vs. Protestant divisions) up?

Traditionalist Catholics and conservative Protestants (evangelicals) should not be making accusations of each other's faith, especially when the accusations are untrue. All orthodox Christians and others of good will should keep their eye on the prize: the defeat of secular humanism in its several manifestations. Divide and conquer or unite and rule.

[Sweet Hour of Prayer]

"Indeed. I just wish all the Protestants who still celebrate the "heroism" of folks like Luther, Calvin and Zwingli would realize that "Bishop" Robinson and the Goodridge decision are the logical culmination of what those guys set in motion, and we haven't seen the end yet."

Don't buy into the trap the author has laid to divide true Christians. Please note that the author of this article is a Jesuit priest. The Catholic church has serious problems with homosexuality within the Priesthood.

[TheSpottedOwl]

Oh yuck. I clicked the link. Their honeymoon was just so special ;-/~~

[polemikos]

The Catholic church has serious problems with homosexuality within the Priesthood.

The Catholic problem occurred because the local bishops thought they knew better than Rome. Once the rock is lifted and the light is shone, they scatter, leave, die off, and/or are booted out.

You'll never see "queer theology" promoted as official Catholic doctrine. It won't be long before there are "queer" Protestant churches. The difference is huge.

[polemikos]

The apostate churches reject the divine inspiration and authority of Scripture.

Odd. I thought all Protestant denominations, including the apostate ones, claim they believe in the authority of Scripture. It's everybody else's denomination that doesn't understand Scripture, right?

The basis for the 16th Century Protestant-Catholic split was the primacy of the Magisterium vs. that of Scripture alone.

I think you have that backwards. Primacy of Scripture was put forward as an alternate to the Magesterium to justify the split. It was not the basis, but the rationale.

the fallacy of some Catholics in blaming the Reformation for secular humanism

The Rationalist school of thought was in opposition to the Church. To that extent, they found common cause with the Protestants. Protestants supported Rationalists because they stood against the Church. It's no accident that Protestant fundamentals have served the Rationalists, and by extension liberal notions of the collective, well.

unite and rule

Agreed. Come on in! The water's just fine. ;-)

[ninenot]

The first quote in the Postie article is from one of YOUR locals--a homo from Webster College. Thought you'd be really pleased...

[DrainBamage]

Hey guys, why are you arguing over who started the fire while the house is burning? Isn't it time to think about putting the fire out?!?!

[Desdemona]

Actually, it's now Webster University. It's now a raging liberal campus. Once upon a time, it was a conservative all women Catholic college.

Any such quotes don't surprise me in the slightest.

[Wallace T.]

The apostate churches are no more Protestant than the Polish National Catholic Church, the Liberal Catholic Church, or the Celtic Catholic Church are Catholic. For instance, the Auburn Affirmation of 1924, which was a statement of the liberal wing of the Northern Presbyterian Church, the signers denied the truth of Holy Scripture, the factuality of the Virgin Birth of Christ, His miracles, His sacrifice on Calvary to satisfy divine justice and reconcile us to Christ, and His resurrection as essential doctrines of the Christian faith. All of these doctrines are Biblical and are affirmed in the early church creeds and in the confessions and statements of faith of the Reformation era. By holding to these positions, liberal theology ceases being either Protestant or Christian. Liberal theology is simply another religion, dressed up in the backward collars and Murphy robes of the old Protestant denominations. Shelby Spong is no more an heir to Luther and Calvin than Sinead O'Connor, an ordained priestess in something called the Celtic Catholic Church, is an heir to Aquinas, the Council of Trent, or Cardinal Newman.

The Reformers were clear in their assertion that reliance on Scripture only was their reason for departing from Rome. The argument that Luther made before Charles V at the Diet of Worms when the emperor asked him how he could go against 15 centuries of Church teaching regarding sola fide was that the teaching of the church was contradictory but that of the Bible was fixed. Calvin stated in Chapter 7 of The Institutes of the Christian Religion that "the Scriptures are the only records in which God has been pleased to consign his truth to perpetual remembrance." While the Anglican Church was initially established for political purposes and was schismatic and not heretical (from a Catholic standpoint) at its beginning, the influence of Archbishop Cranmer and others moved the church in a Protestant direction during the reigns of Edward VI and Elizabeth I. The paramount importance of the Magisterium vs. Sola Scriptura moved the Council of Trent to anthematize those who held to the latter doctrine. The Reformers' assertion of the Bible only as the source of faith and doctrine was the springboard for their split.

[.45MAN]

well that's what you get for being nosey..

[Wallace T.]

You are correct in your statement that Protestants have aligned with rationalists, or more particularly, secular humanists. Universal state-run education (where the secular humanists suckered Protestants into believing that public schools would be entirely under local control) and the statism of the Progressive Era (income taxes, direct election of Senators, the Federal Reserve, Federal regulation of commerce were not opposed by conservative Protestants in exchange for Progessive support of Prohibition) were direct results of this unfortunate collusion.

However, the results of political activism by Catholics in the same time period was also deplorable. The big city political machines, such as those run by the Pendergasts in Kansas City, Curley in Boston, and Tammany Hall in New York, were riddled with corruption. These big city Democratic political machines, which were mostly run by Irish Catholics, essentially created mini-welfare states. They were a model that Franklin Roosevelt used for his New Deal programs.

Neither Protestants nor Catholics were friends of limited government or individual liberty, by and large, from the late 19th Century forward. However, it appears evangelical Protestants have come to their senses more quickly. We need only to contrast the predominantly Protestant South and its more conservative politics with that of the Northeast, which is simultaneously both the most liberal and the most Catholic region of the nation.

[kittymyrib]

One need only look at the abortion-loving Democrat politicians to see that Catholics do not listen to the Pope and their church. They allow people like Kennedy, Pelosi, Daschle, et all to claim they are Catholics and millions of Catholics disobey their church's doctrine by re-electing them year after year.

[ninenot]

I deliberately referred to it as Webster College, and perhaps should have referred to it as Webster Grade School.

Grade schools have playgrounds--which is where this ex-Jeb should be dribbling his regurgitations, rather than emitting his spurts of whole upchuck in classrooms and newspapers.

[Wallace T.]

I will criticize the Catholic Church for failing to discipline pro-abortion politicians and being dilatory with regard to punishing and expelling pedophile and homosexual priests and the bishops responsible for the cover-ups only when the evangelical churches clean their own houses. For example, the Southern Baptists, clearly an evangelical denomination, are congregational in polity. Nevertheless, the Southern Baptist Convention and the state Baptist associations can expel member churches that failed to censure pro-abortion Southern Baptist politicians like Bill Clinton and Dick Gephardt. To my knoweldge, none have done so.

Church discipline is almost nonexistent among orthodox Christian churches.

[RansomOttawa]

Protestantism's ultimate lack of authority, with every man his own pope, turns Sacred Scripture into a "living document" and reduces the faith to "mere Christianity".

If Scripture is a "living document," it is the theological left that has so characterized it, not evangelical Protestantism based on the theology of Luther or Calvin.

And notwithstanding your attempt to caricature it as a Protestant problem, the Romanists are not immune from factions of liberalism. Clean your own house first, since you imply the Roman church has the authority to do so. Then come worry about ours.