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Sharon Vows Arab State if Attacks Stop (desperate measure or smart political move?)
Yahoo! News ^ | November 24, 2003 | STEVE WEIZMAN

Posted on 11/24/2003 10:29:48 AM PST by El Conservador

JERUSALEM - The Palestinians are assured of a state if they halt attacks on Israelis and dismantle armed groups, Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon (news - web sites) said Monday. But he also tried to ease fears among his right-wing backers that he will dismantle settlements as a concession to peace.

Sharon also told legislators from his right-wing Likud party Monday that he would not agree to preconditions to meet with Palestinian Prime Minister Ahmed Qureia, who wants guarantees a summit will yield results before agreeing to a date.

The lawmakers were concerned by Israeli media reports Sharon is considering taking unilateral steps toward the Palestinians if attempts to revive the stalled U.S.-backed "road map" peace plan fail. Those steps reportedly include drawing a border, dismantling settlements, releasing Palestinian prisoners and withdrawing from West Bank towns.

Sharon — a longtime champion of settlement expansion — confirmed Monday he was considering unilateral steps but avoided talk about dismantling settlements.

"The prime minister said that if he does decide on unilateral steps, he will bring them to the caucus for a vote before taking it to the Cabinet," Likud legislator Yehiel Hazan said.

A legislator present at the meeting quoted Sharon as saying, "If there is one Palestinian government after another, and I'm convinced there is no progress, we will take unilateral steps, not as concessions, but in our interest."

The peace plan envisions Palestinian statehood by 2005 as the centerpiece of a negotiated settlement. However, it remains stalled because both sides have not met even its most basic requirements — a settlement freeze and the removal of dozens of illegal West Bank outposts by Israel, and the dismantling of militant groups by the Palestinians.

Sharon said Monday that "if there is a cease-fire and the dismantling of the terrorist infrastructure, they (the Palestinians) will attain an independent state," the legislator said on condition of anonymity.

Sharon previously has said he considers Palestinian statehood inevitable, but he opposes an Israeli withdrawal from all the West Bank and Gaza.

During the closed-door meeting, hawkish Cabinet Minister Uzi Landau said Israel should dismantle the Palestinian Authority (news - web sites) because it was doing nothing to fight terror.

But Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz disagreed, and was quoted as saying that assuming "responsibility for three million Palestinians would be a grave mistake."

Israeli Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom also said Monday that Sharon and Qureia will meet next week, a claim denied by top Palestinian officials.

Qureia told the Dubai-based Al Arabiya satellite channel Monday he hopes reports of Sharon's willingness to dismantle settlements and ease Palestinian suffering were not "a propaganda stunt."

He said Sharon should take "serious steps" so talks between the two sides could resume. Israel must stop building a barrier separating it from the West Bank, halt settlement expansion, ease Palestinian suffering and lift the travel ban imposed on Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat (news - web sites), he said.

Sharon said Monday he is unwilling to accept preconditions for a summit.

"I won't make any binding commitments in order to meet Abu Ala (Qureia)," the legislator quoted Sharon as saying. "If he wants to meet, we'll meet. If he doesn't, we won't."

The leaks about Sharon's purported contingency plan were viewed as an attempt to deflect growing criticism he is not doing enough to end more than three years of fighting with the Palestinians.

Earlier this month, four former heads of the Shin Bet security service said Israel is headed toward disaster if it does not reach a deal with the Palestinians soon, and they accused Sharon of stalling to avoid concessions.

Palestinian critics and Israeli liberals were skeptical about talk of unilateral steps.

"We've heard many promises, but nothing has come of them," Israeli opposition leader Shimon Peres said, adding that even the removal of small settlements would break up Sharon's center-right coalition. "I don't think Sharon is in a hurry to take apart his government."

The Bush administration, which supported Sharon's harsh military measures against the Palestinians, has been increasingly critical of Israeli restrictions against the Palestinian population and the construction of a barrier in the West Bank.

Last week, Elliot Abrams, head of the Middle East desk at the National Security Council, met secretly with Sharon while the prime minister visited Italy, an Israeli official confirmed Monday on condition of anonymity.

Abrams told Sharon he must dismantle illegal settlement outposts in the West Bank and freeze settlement construction, Israeli media reported Monday.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Israel; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: arab; arabterrorism; arafat; humanbombs; humanshields; israel; palestine; peacenegotiation; sharon; wot
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Bold move...
1 posted on 11/24/2003 10:29:49 AM PST by El Conservador
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To: El Conservador
A second Arab state? One in the heart of Judea and Samaria?
Recipe for disaster. There will be an arab state and terrorism. Israel will try to root out the terrorists. Either the EU or Arab countries will intervene.
2 posted on 11/24/2003 11:04:14 AM PST by rmlew (Peaceniks and isolationists are objectively pro-Terrorist)
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To: 1bigdictator; 1st-P-In-The-Pod; 2sheep; a_witness; adam_az; af_vet_rr; agrace; ...
FRmail me to be added or removed from this pro-Israel ping list.


3 posted on 11/24/2003 11:05:42 AM PST by Alouette
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Comment #4 Removed by Moderator

To: rmlew
The state already exists. The PA is effectively a government. There is terrorism now. Unilateral separation -- or as Ehud Barak put it, "Us here, them there" -- is the only way to end the terrorism short of genocide. Leaving 3.5 million Arabs under Israeli authority is a great way to destroy Israel through a demographic timebomb.

The Prime Minister has this absolutely right. The terms, while painful to Israel, will insure our continued existence. The terms will be even more painful to the Palestinians.


I understand the religious and historical ties to all of Judea and Samaria. However, under Jewish law *any* Jewish law may be set aside to save lives. Separation is the most practical means of ending the constant attacks upon Israel and saving Jewish lives.
5 posted on 11/24/2003 11:10:45 AM PST by anotherview ("Ignorance is the choice not to know" -Klaus Schulze)
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To: Brookline
Why are so many Americans so pessimistic about Israel? Why are so many Israelis optimistic? Perhaps it's because we live with the realities of the situation on a daily basis.
6 posted on 11/24/2003 11:11:41 AM PST by anotherview ("Ignorance is the choice not to know" -Klaus Schulze)
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To: anotherview
No one is calling for Genocide.
Everyone agrees that someone must be ethnically cleansed from Judea and Samaria. I just want it to be the ARabs, not the Jews.
7 posted on 11/24/2003 11:12:28 AM PST by rmlew (Peaceniks and isolationists are objectively pro-Terrorist)
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To: anotherview
One more thing, I do not believe that a second Palestine will bring peace. Read my first comments. It is a recipe for another war.
8 posted on 11/24/2003 11:13:33 AM PST by rmlew (Peaceniks and isolationists are objectively pro-Terrorist)
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To: rmlew
How do you "ethnically cleanse" three and a half million Arabs from the territories short of genocide? This I want to hear. Oh, and how will the world respond/intervene? Make sure you include your contigencies for that when describing your plan.

Annexing most of the Jewish communities of Judea and Samaria and moving a few thousand Israelis from outlying, indefensible settlements seems far more likely to be practical to me.
9 posted on 11/24/2003 11:15:20 AM PST by anotherview ("Ignorance is the choice not to know" -Klaus Schulze)
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To: zx2dragon
Now look at what I've gotten myself into.
10 posted on 11/24/2003 11:16:34 AM PST by anotherview ("Ignorance is the choice not to know" -Klaus Schulze)
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Comment #11 Removed by Moderator

To: El Conservador
.....if Attacks Stop


12 posted on 11/24/2003 11:18:53 AM PST by ppaul
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To: Brookline
Lets get ahead of the curve here and think up new Arab names for Tel Aviv.

In the past, under Arab contril it was called desert.

The Founding Ceremony of Tel-Aviv, 1909


13 posted on 11/24/2003 11:26:05 AM PST by SJackson
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Yehuda; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; ...
If you'd like to be on or off this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.
14 posted on 11/24/2003 11:27:47 AM PST by SJackson
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To: El Conservador
Give up the settlements if Arabs give up the right of return. This has been the plan all along. It's called gradual reparations.
15 posted on 11/24/2003 11:28:15 AM PST by John Lenin
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Comment #16 Removed by Moderator

To: anotherview
Annexing most of the Jewish communities of Judea and Samaria and moving a few thousand Israelis from outlying, indefensible settlements seems far more likely to be practical to me.

Old idea, hasn't happened yet. Probably have to give up Gaza now. The opportunity to carve out a palestinian state from southern Gaza and part of the Sinai is gone as well.

Center for Security Policy

Thoughtful military experts have for many years recognized the risks for Israel should it no longer be able to control the territories it acquired in the course of the Six-Day War in June 1967. For example, shortly after the end of that conflict, the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff concluded that, "From a strictly military point of view, Israel would require the retention of some captured territory in order to provide militarily defensible borders."

The Chiefs made the following specific findings:

"The prominent high ground running north-south through the middle of West Jordan [Judea and Samaria] generally...would provide Israel with a militarily defensible border."

"The commanding territory east of the boundary of 4 June 1967 [the Golan Heights]...overlooks the Galilee area. To provide a defense in-depth, Israel would need a strip about 15 miles wide extending from the border of Lebanon to the border of Jordan."

"By occupying the Gaza Strip, Israel would trade approximately 45 miles of hostile border for eight. Configured as it [was prior to 1967], the strip serve[d] as a salient for introduction of Arab subversion and terrorism and its retention would be to Israel's military advantage."

"To defend the Jerusalem area would require that the boundary of Israel be positioned to the east of the city to provide for the organization of an adequate defensive position."

…………………………

These findings are as valid today as they were in 1967. In fact, they have been reaffirmed again and again by knowledgeable military professionals. For example, in October 1988, 100 senior U.S. generals and admirals issued a public call for Israel to "retain the Jordan River line as [her] eastern security border" noting that:

"...If Israel loses this line, it would have virtually no warning of attack, its border would be three times longer than the present one. In the midsection of the country it would be 9 to 18 miles from the Mediterranean. Virtually all the population would be subject to artillery bombardment. The plain north of Tel Aviv could be riven by an armored salient within hours. The quick mobilization of its civilian army -- Israel's main hope for survival -- would be disrupted easily, and perhaps irreversibly."

…………………………

In 1991, Lieutenant General Thomas Kelly, the highly respected chief of Operations for the Joint Chiefs of Staff during Desert Storm, said, "Israel's control over these areas is the only guarantee, however imperfect, of peace. Their loss is a prescription for war." He added that:

"The West Bank mountains, and especially their approaches, are the critical terrain. If an enemy secures those passes, Jerusalem and all of Israel become uncovered. Without the West Bank, Israel is only eight miles wide at its narrowest point. That makes it indefensible."

…………………………

Importantly, the Israeli Defense Forces are under no illusion about the abiding importance of strategic analyses like that performed by the Joint Chiefs. As the IDF Chief of Staff Ehud Barak said in May 1993:

"The 1967 Joint Chiefs of Staff memorandum [is] still applicable. The Arab arms are reaching superiority over Israel with a qualitative as well as quantitative edge....If Israel has to retake the territories proposed to be given up, we cannot do it without tremendous casualties."

…………………………………

The Pentagon Plan - Joint Chiefs of Staff Map (1974)

17 posted on 11/24/2003 11:35:27 AM PST by SJackson
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To: John Lenin
Give up the settlements if Arabs give up the right of return. This has been the plan all along. It's called gradual reparations.

You're right, that's been the plan since 1948. Not one politically important Arab has supported the concept. It's called pie in the sky.

18 posted on 11/24/2003 11:37:30 AM PST by SJackson
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To: SJackson
I don't disagree with anything you posted except this: What do you do with 3.5 million Palestinians? None of the "keep the territories" folks have explained that to me yet.

Nobody (least of all me) is proposing going back to pre-1967 borders here. I've posted about how Alfei Menashe was a Jordanian gun emplacement before the Six Day War I don't know how many times. That is high ground Israel will keep.

The security fence goes a long way towards creating a defensible border and it needs to be completed. The Palestinians need to be excluded from Israel. Israeli firms need to stop using Palestinians as a cheap labor source, something that has been happening steadily but not fast enough.

All the maps are fine. You simply cannot keep 3.5 million hostile Arabs within Israel's borders. The last three years should illustrate that well enough for anyone to see. I am not satisfied to see Israelis living, and way too many dying, with the status quo.
19 posted on 11/24/2003 11:52:08 AM PST by anotherview ("Ignorance is the choice not to know" -Klaus Schulze)
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To: Brookline
Maybe you are the one who is too quick to shed Israeli blood. Maybe a little first hand experience is needed to understand the problems and not just see it as lines on a map.
20 posted on 11/24/2003 11:53:32 AM PST by anotherview ("Ignorance is the choice not to know" -Klaus Schulze)
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