It's Not Only About Terri Schiavo

The Village Voice ^ | November 21, 2003 | Nat Hentoff

[Ohioan from Florida]

Thanks for pointing me to your reference. That is most definitely a perversion of Catholic doctrine. While the withholding of food and water isn't completely against Catholic doctrine, I think it is intended to be used conscientiously (which in Terri's case, it is not). These people also seem to not realize that Terri has most likely been misdiagnosed as PVS. She couldn't possibly have just gone into a PVS state unless she had another anoxic episode, because she was talking and communicating with her caregivers early on in her recovery. You're right. I wish there were more good Catholic articles about Terri. There are so many "Catholic" groups these days that have little in common with the Church in Rome.

[Republic]

"Today's actions prove that every attempt is being made to delay proceedings in this case and hasten Terri's death," said Pat Anderson. "However, we will continue to fight for Terri's life and make sure that all of the facts in this case are fully explored."

Ahhhhhh ... the poor vampire Felos, so willing and eager to suck the blood out of innocents, so willing to go to the mat for a client who has consistently shown contempt and neglect for his legal wife, while making babies with his whore. Does Felos have a heart for the full truth, does he care what Carl Iyers or Cyndi Shook or others have to say about Terri and Michael? Does he have a conscience? Or is money and fame and that book just about all he has room for?

Ah yes, that book Felos has talked about writing, just when things were going along so smoothly, and Terri was suffering from starvation and dehydration....it all fell apart. Now it isn't Terri who is hungry....the table has turned and it is Felos who is hungry...he needs an end to his story, and he wants it to be the one HE SCRIPTED!

But alas, suddenly people are becoming aware of his absolute horrific tactics, learning of his unique ability to 'commune with the soul' of those who cannot speak, and therefore able to determine their wishes. ( Gag me....BIG TIME! }

People are learning of the testimony and affidavits and etc. etc. etc that has been thrown out of the courts at Felos's marvelous manipulation of our rule of law. WHY....we have even learned that Felos and MS put medical records of Terri under lock and key.....whatever for???? Yeah....we are learning about this monster, alright.

Felos-if you are aware of this thread and others involving Terri-good. Know that we are praying for you, understand that you get a deep sense of 'satisfaction' from the death of those who are imperfect, and hope deeply, that this time, you lose.

Your smoothness, your connections, your ability to deny the reality of what Terri has suffered, your ability to hide a person who is NOT TERMINALLY ILL or even in a PVS state in a HOSPICE has not gone un-noticed. And we are here to stop you, with God's help, anyway we legally can.

When you and MS get together with the ACLU to plot Terri's death, full of ignorance or devoid of conscience, we are right there, over your shoulder, praying to God Almighty, the giver of life, the One who gave us our souls and is full of love.

And as our President says, we will prevail.

[nicmarlo]

Now I'm assuming that since the judge allowed the deposition to be taken that it can also be admitted in the guardianship hearing(??). Can any lawyer types answer that question?

Is the judge in question "over" Judge Greer? I believe he is. When the judge in question ruled that the deposition could go forward (the doctor answering questions as pertains to the bone scan), did the deposition taken pertain to the case before Judge Greer? (I believe so, i.e., this is the case requesting that MS be disqualified as guardian). If this is true, then, yes, this is part of the DISCLOSURES (the gathering of evidence, i.e., the doctor's testimony AND the bone scan) which will now become a part of this particular case.

[nicmarlo]

Felos may still try to have those "disclosures" stricken from the record at hearing/trial by filing a "MOTION IN LIMINE TO EXCLUDE."

[supercat]

This is the press briefing from Pat Anderson, posted on terrisfight.org. Now I'm assuming that since the judge allowed the deposition to be taken that it can also be admitted in the guardianship hearing(??). Can any lawyer types answer that question?

The admission of the deposition into evidence would be up to Judge Greer or whoever is hearing the case. On the other hand, I would expect that the deposition would become public whether or not Greer admits it. IANAL, but if things are as I understand them, Greer may decide that it would look very bad to refuse the deposition if it contains information that any ordinary person would deem relevant to the case.

[Saundra Duffy]

BTTT

[Pegita]

>>>From the time they (Clintons) were elected, it seems bad things for America have escalated.<<<

I'd add, freekitty, that the Clintons CAUSED bad things to escalate in America and, as such, I have one constant prayer ..

I pray that the Lord would render the Clintons, and all their minions .. powerless and voiceless and nameless and faceless and useless and homeless and penniless .. that He would strip them bare before the world, leaving only their immortal souls, and it is for these souls I pray.

[drhogan]

it hasn't been proven yet that homosexuality is inherited; i'm guessing that there are different patterns of causation and different degrees of heritability. but i also think men are hard-wired to get attracted to and desire many women (i.e., not just their wives). the really tricky one in terms of sin is sociopathy/psychopathy, which has a high degree of heritability. these people essentially have no conscience and no ability to empathize with other people, and they commit lots of crimes.
the issue of heritability, choice, morals, sin, and responsibility is very complex, and i will never figure it out. i think some people have more free-will than others. some people have more factors against them from birth--i would guess that God would judge the sin relative to the person's degree of free-will. but in the end, we each have to focus on our own choices and try to do what is right, rather than taking on God's role and spending our time judging others. Jesus said something about seeing the speck in another person's eye and not seeing the beam/board in our own, and also said "let he who hath not sinned throw the first stone", so as i grow older, i realize i should get my own life in order first.

[appropos]

When Judge Greer decides whether to admit the Bonescan allegations into evidence and decides whether he himself will see the bonescan evidence as presenting a possible glaring conflict of interest for the current guardian - then I guess we'll see whether Judge Greer is bound by some sort of umbilical cord to Felos where the Judge seems to usually always side with Felos. Personally I would hope they could get the case transferred to a different judge. Maybe one in a different state.
Anybody know what's happening with Wolfson? Isn't the 30 days for his report to be up soon - has he been investigating anything?

[supercat]

Personally I would hope they could get the case transferred to a different judge.

I haven't seen Judge Greer do a whole lot since the passage of "Terri's Law", and I don't recall any of it being unfavorable toward Terri. I've wondered whether he's turned a corner, but it's hard to tell for sure.

[terrasol]

Thanks for Nat Hentoff's "It's Not
Only About Terri Schiavo".
The link for letters to the editor:
http://www.villagevoice.com/aboutus/letters.php

Their stand on Terri deserves praise. Here's mine:

Dear Editor,

I cannot begin to express my admiration
for your courageous stand on the side of
truth regarding Terri Schindler Schiavo.
Nat Hentoff is a phenomenally cogent writer
and, in my opinion, a national treasure.

Of those who would obfuscate the vital
need for resisting the deadly marketing of
euthanasia, by reducing it to delusions of
"religious zealots" and "rightwing fanatics",
I ask this: The Village Voice a "rightwing
paper"? Nat Hentoff a "religious fanatic"?
Puhleeze!

Thank you for choosing to serve as a
beacon in this macabre twilight time.
Bravo, and bravo again!



.......................................
Vote for Terri's Law at bottom right of:
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/florida/sfl-1121schiavo,0,3624264.story?coll=sfla-news-florida

[wisconsinconservative]

Is it possible to make this deposition public before the guardianship hearing???

[chas1776]

The truth of it is your afraid of death not all of the world has the resources to keep things living. I live in a retirement home where death is sometimes welcomed.

[freekitty]

How I agree.

[TheSpottedOwl]

thanks for the ping, SW. Great find!

[shezza]

Hi, chas...I'm certainly not afraid of death! However, I AM definitely afraid of manipulative, scheming, self-absorbed individuals who hold the power of life and death in their own fallible hands, those who demand the blood of a completely innocent person to advance their own agenda (or pocketbook, as the case may be). Terri is not old, she is not sick, she is not on a respirator or dialysis machine. She is not comatose, she is not PVS, she is not in intensive care, she is not dying (other than in the sense that we all have been "dying" since the day we were born). The only life support she is on is food and water, again, as are we all. She is mentally handicapped, as are millions of others in this country.

I'm not afraid of DEATH, no. I am afraid of state-sanctioned, court-mandated, estranged-husband-initiated KILLING. See the difference?

If Terri is allowed to be killed, it will set the precedence for allowing others (who are very much alive) to be killed as well. Down's Syndrome children? Yup. Elderly bedridden? Yup. Paralysis victims? Yup. IQ below 50? 60? 90? Where's the line? Who gets to draw the line? Felos? Greer? Mikie? You?

By the way, chas, did you even read the article at the head of this thread? I would suggest you at least scroll back to post #33. It's a real eye-opener.

[lakey]

At this point, Felos could redeem himself by accepting "disclosures" - IF he has been truthful all along. (What the heck does LIMINE mean? I say that so Ohioan from Florida will refrain from referring to me as a lawyer type ) :o)

[nicmarlo]

What the heck does LIMINE mean? I say that so Ohioan from Florida will refrain from referring to me as a lawyer type

LOL; in limine literally means: on the threshold; at the beginning.

It is a motion filed shortly before the hearing (with no trial) or trial (before jury). "Immediately, upon seeing the words Motion in Limine in the motion’s Caption, the judge knows it deals with evidence and with how it will be handled at trial."

This website discusses a bit better than I can:

Motions in Limine are called “threshold motions” that anticipate and seek to control the trial’s conduct. It is equitable in nature and therefore well within the court’s discretion to grant or deny. It is a useful and powerful device to assure a fair trial, but is rarely the basis for a reversal on appeal – indeed, though there may be some, I am unaware of any case reversed solely because the court denied a Motion in Limine.

[lakey]

People in retirement homes, wanting to die, have the choice of eating and drinking liquids, or not.

My elderly aunt chose to die by refusing to eat solid food or drink the milk shakes brought to her by family members, though they tell me she did take a sip of water every now and then. Death came in only two weeks.

Funny thing (wrong choice of words, perhaps) about starvation, within four or five days, the human body no longer feels hunger pangs. The opposite effect occurs when hydration is denied. Extreme thirst is torture.

[lakey]

Thank you! I'll read your link. I did Google the word earlier today but not much of it sunk in.