[EternalVigilance]

FYI...

Another email from my nonFReeper friend:


"Having done much research I was able to focus on the facts and Mr. Schiavo was less than honest in the LK interview.

After the Larry King show where Michael Schiavo talked about Terri having a 2.0 potassium (K) I started asking questions. I already knew that the EKG was normal. I felt that something was wrong with his allusion to bulimia. How can a person have K that low and not have evidence on an EKG?

So, I looked into it.Actually, the potassium (K) was low on admission to the hospital. Terri did not have a heart attack, her cardiac blood enzymes were not elevated, her heart stopped.

There is no evidence that I have been able to find of a history of K imbalance or any other evidence of bulimia such as erosion of dental enamel. There are other tests that go hand in hand with the K being that low. Normal K is 3.5 - 5.3 mEq/L. Below 3.5 mEq/L there are marked changes on the EKG (depressed ST segment, flattened T waves, and prominent T waves).

But, the EKG was normal. It drove me crazy. How could the EKG be normal if the K was so low? Why were other markers normal?

I emailed all the nurses I know and kept asking "Am I missing something"? Finally I got the labs and the interpretation. Blood sugar was 376. K was 2.0. All other labs normal.

The EMS had given Terri IV solution which contains a sugar , probably D5W, before she got to the hospital. She was most likely over hydrated and this influenced the K results.

Dr. Hammesfahr does not think the K was a factor in the cardiac arrest (heart stopped) and heart attack was ruled out.

Now, Michael Schiavo is a nurse that really should know better and he has all the doctor's reports. I fear that he was leading us all down the garden path yesterday with his implications of bulimia and electrolyte imbalance."

xxx xxxx

[truthkeeper]

Out of curiousity, what was it that Claus Von Bulow allegedly did to Sunny? Insulin overdose?

Are there any similarities here? Just wondering aloud.

[Semper Paratus]

Interesting. Last year I was admitted to the hospital after fainting and the admitting doctor said I had no descernible traces of potassium and wanted to know why my heart was still beating?

After 2 days of hydration my reading were all normal and never yet got an explanation other than 'high stress'.

[VxH]

>>Michael Schiavo is a nurse


wow, I was not aware of that. Very interesting.

Thanks for the update.

[stanz]

What I would like to know is why weren't these questions raised 13 years ago? Why wasn't Terri's mysterious collapse investigated by the police? Michael Schiavo sat there during the Larry King interview telling bold-faced lies which King glossed over. How can the courts continue to legitimize these lies in one proceeding after another? How on earth can he keep saying he "loves" Terri when he is living with another woman and has children with her? This is a pitiable travesty of the judicial system.

[nmh]

The more dear Michael talks the more he digs a hole fro himself. Let em keep talking.

[SarahW]

Either her potassium was low or it wasn't.
Electrolyte imbalance can be caused by overhydrating, but what's your point? That her potassium was normal later?


Was Terri being treated for her eating disorder? The jury found her partially at fault for her injury. Why?

[TaxRelief]

Given this info about Terri's lack of heart attack, why did Dr. Igel's legal team do such a lousy job defending him. It just doesn't make sense. I'd love to interview Dr. Igel.

[Saundra Duffy]

Thank you for researching these matters. I love FReepers!!!!!!!!

[GodBlessUSA]

I was convinced Terri most likely did not have bulemia after this interview. Larry King asked Michael S. if she had bulemia. MS said he saw her eat. MS said it's a secretive disease. He was very vague and really had no back-up facts. I thought to myself, who ever diagnosed her as bulemic? Like you posted, I know there are symptoms, like the dental enamel. It doesn’t make sense. Did a doctor ever suggest she had bulemia or did MS. just make this up?

[First_Salute]

An evening, into the night, into the morning hours - argument between two people - can knock your electrolytes silly.

The additional injuries that a person sustains, makes matters worse.

There is no great mystery, here.

Force was applied to cause Terri's injuries, compounding her --- what anybody's electrolyte imbalance would be by 4 o'clock in the morning --- state of stress.

That's why we call it stress.

That's why there's so much written up about stress.

Just as, if you were to go to a swimming pool and swim 5 miles ... well, you couldn't because you'd be exhausted ... your heart will stop, when exhausted, and some sudden trauma is visited upon you, such as that first failed attempt, too late in your laps, to get air.

In some situations, combat, you may even freeze in place, with no wounds. You could be found situated looking over a log, holding your rifle, when you run out of that last ounce of energy. You could be found, kneeling. You could be found, standing. Frozen. It happens.

People need energy to function, and without it, things stop working.

What fails, are usually the weak points.

A wife subject to a husband's hectoring, and then physical battery, might just be found dead in his arms without anything more than "low electroytes." The scene, tragically romantic.

It's incredible what the body can endure --- if it has had good conditioning.

On the other hand, it's incredible how bodies in good condition, from all appearances, suddenly quit.

Pat Anderson should have talked to a lot of corroners and combat medics, to learn what can happen to you.

[First_Salute]

From yesterday ---

At Michael Schiavo pleads case on CNN --- posted at FR on Oct. 28, 2003, by JohnHuang2 ---

Reply 9 ---

"In last night's interview, Schiavo addressed the strangulation testimony by asking why her neck was not bruised and her trachea damaged."

Michael Schiavo assumes "the hands on approach," when that is not required.

In addition, a "rigid neck" that is considered in Terri's case, as a sign of "strangulation," can instead be caused by various other methods of attempting to cut off a person's airways.

For example, a hypothetical couple "having a domestic dispute" ---

A husband "getting carried away" during their argument(s) into the night and early morning hours, enough to "forget himself" ...

He, a large heavy man, sits quickly on the upper back of his relatively smaller, lighter wife, who herself had been sitting on the floor and bent over some, exhausted and crying.

He forces her to the floor face down and causes her to hyperextend her neck as she struggles to raise her head, break free, and get air --- there is a dislocation of certain areas of her neck's connective tissues, the resulting strains and pinching of nerves leading to a severely "rigid neck."

With the immediate presence of his body heat in addition to her diminishing oxygen supply, she goes into shock.

She is forced into unconciousness; then some minutes more pass, of insufficient oxygen (not necessarily a denial of all blood) flow to her brain; her heart beat might be undetectable.

Things go from bad to worse with the time that the husband remains upon her.

The husband regains some semblance of reason and senses her change of state, as well as what may befall him. He gets himself off of her, paces around, then he returns to her and checks, but cannot detect, her pulse ... he calls for help.

Her injuries would be revealed, over a year later in bone scans of the head, neck, torso, and lower body. Her injuries include a compression fracture of the wife's L1 vertebra, which literally plays a pivotal role in support of the upper back.

No heart attack.

Just trauma to tell the tale, in her bones.

 

[Ohioan from Florida]

Here is Syriacus' post 5214 from the first monster Terri thread. I'm not sure if it helps or not, but it is interesting.

Learned a little more about "potassium imbalance" yesterday. It seems it can occur during a struggle and can affect the heart.

During the struggle, not only do the levels of the catecholamines increase in the blood but so do blood potassium concentrations. The increase may be as much a 5 mEq/l or more in some individuals. Following cessation of exercise, there is an immediate, rapid drop in blood potassium to concentrations that approach 2 mEq/l. Five minutes after cessation of the exercise potassium levels may be lower than when they were at rest. There may be a prolonged hypokalemia lasting 90 min or more.

These extremes in potassium concentrations can have cardiac arrhythmogenic effects. The arrhythmogenic effects of the hyperkalemia, however, are neutralized by the cardioprotective effect of the elevated levels of catecholamines.

Thus the danger time for arrhythmias is immediately following cessation of physical activity, when blood catecholamine concentrations continue to rise while potassium levels drop dramatically to hypokalemia levels. This period has been referred to by Dimsdale et al. as the time of post-exercise peril, in that there is a risk of cardiac arrhythmias during this period.

Forensic pathology, 2nd ed., Vincent J. DiMaio and Dominick Di Maio. Chapter 22...Sudden Death During or Immediately after a Violent Struggle. (p 500-501)

5,214 posted on 09/22/2003 10:27 AM EDT by syriacus (Prankin' Al Franken....says he didn't lie to Ashcroft. His letter was only a prank. A Frankenprank?)

[manna]

Prayer sent ...

[countrydummy]

with this post, I too agree. The only thing is, I am still not sure why the bs would be so high, even with d5w. But I need to read up some more!

[JustPiper]

Being the Schindler's will be on LKL next Thursday, you shoulf send LK your finding's EV!

[Ragtime Cowgirl]

Thanks for the ping, EV. There's an army of allies joining the fight for Terri today. It's awesome. I think every question we've had will be examined by others in the coming years. Felos, Greer and MS will not be able to hide behind the hospice and the press any more.

Larry King will give equal time to Terri's side next week - no doubt due to all your emails! Bob and Mary will be on Thur. after next.

Thanks for the heads up, Republic.

[windchime]

Thanks for posting, EV!

[Terriergal]

Terri did not have a heart attack,

I knew that. The original article I read said "mysterious collapse" -- now why would they say that if it was something as common as a heart attack?