W'S College Strength (Approval at 61% Among College Students)

RealClearPolitics.com ^ | 10/23/03 | Tom Bevan

[NYC Republican]

I have to admit I was a bit shocked. A fascinating poll released yesterday by Harvard’s Institute of Politics shows President Bush's approval rating among college students at 61%, well above his most recent national average of 50.5%. Here are the money lines:

Still, students seem to admire Bush’s leadership ability.

“They like the warrior but they don’t like the war,” Glickman said.

Although college students historically have supported Democratic candidates, neither party can take the youth vote for granted, Glickman said.

“The majority of college students elect politicians based on leadership skills, experience and authenticity,” said vice-president of the IOP-SAC Betsy A. Sykes ’04, who oversaw the survey.

Looking at the internals things get even more surprising. The 1,202 students surveyed have a much different impression of which direction the country is headed in than the public at large: 46% saying we're going moving in the right direction vs. 43% saying we're not. That's a +3 spread, a significant difference versus the three most recent national polls that show negative spreads of 18, 15 and 16 points, respectively. Democrats may be inclined to dismiss the discrepancy as "youthful optimism", but it's probably something more than that.

Now compare the IOP results with the recent Democracy Corps poll (Byron York wrote about it yesterday) showing how Dem primary voters in Iowa, New Hampshire and South Carolina feel about issues of national security and the economy. And even though it's considered a bit left of center, I've thrown in the latest CBS/NYT poll to add a national context as well:

You might be inclined to think the war is a top priority among college students because many of them oppose it so passionately. Not true. Fifty-eight percent of respondents support the war in Iraq (including 30% who "strongly support" it) while only 37% oppose the war (with only 17% of those "strongly" opposing it).

And you may think college students have less of a concern about the economy because of their age: they've got plenty of time to make money and few pressing responsibilities. That's certainly a possibility. On the other hand, given the current "jobless recovery" we're experiencing you expect this group - especially the seniors - to be obsessed with the issue of jobs and the economy. Either way, these students are under no illusions about what it's like out there: 71% say it will be "somewhat difficult" or "very difficult" for them to find a job when they graduate.

Maybe the answer is that for this group of people, most of whom were in high school at the time, September 11 really did change everything.

It's hard to say, really. But it is interesting to see a group which has traditionally been perceived to be quite liberal (or at the very least extremely sympathetic to liberal ideals) now so completely disjointed from the base of the Democratic party and even further to the right on issues of terrorism and national security than the country as a whole.

Issue College Students IA Dems NH Dems SC Dems CBS/NY Times War in Iraq 28% 16% 16% 15% 9% Nat'l/Homeland Security & Terrorism 11% 3% 4% 4% 8% Jobs & Economy 17% 35% 29% 35% 32%

[.cnI redruM]

It proves they are smarter than their professors.

[RightWhale]

Conservatism is very popular here. True, many of the profs are Liberals, but they have been fairly quiet about their Liberalism the past few years, and dead silent since WTC911. Even Philosophy students seem fairly Conservative. Music majors, of course, continue to be total Liberals, so if you are Conservative and want to play with the orchestra, better keep your mouth shut.

[NYC Republican]

Absolutely, still, I was surprised by this as well... I read somewhere (earlier today) that his approvals at Dartmouth are 22%. I know it's lib, but that's REALLY low.

[CatoRenasci]

Where are you? Oberlin?

[RightWhale]

Univ of Alaska

[CatoRenasci]

Consider, Dartmouth used to be one of the most, if not the most, conservative of the ivies. However, most of the students come from affluent urban and suburban Northeastern families (and alumni around the country). These are the areas that used to be WASP and Republican, but are increasingly ethnically mixed and liberal. The young investment bankers who were in college in the '70s and '80s and are now successful, tend to be liberal and Democratic: they did real well under Clinton, are too young to remember the Carter years or the Reagan boom.

[RightWhale]

Freeman Dyson is Dartmouth, I believe, but while he is definitely a social radical, I don't know if he is Conservative or Liberal or if he cares about politics.

[.cnI redruM]

I imagine he has poor numbers at Cornell and Hahvad as well....

[CatoRenasci]

My daughters are both musicians. String players especially, for some reason, tend to be lefties, as do woodwinds to a slightly lesser extent. Brass players tend to be relatively conservative, I'm not sure why. Especially at the professional level. Phil Smith, principal trumpet in the New York Philharmonic, is a committed (some would say fundamentalist) Christian, as are a number of other top brass players I know. Curious.

[Toidylop]

Glickman "I have to admit I was a bit shocked..."

Shocked!!! They're only shocked at their inept leftist indoctrination... ya know.

[RightWhale]

String players especially, for some reason, tend to be lefties

I am the only lefty in my chamber orchestra, but Conservative, the rest are right-handed and Liberal. We don't discuss politics at all, or much of anything outside of music.

[CatoRenasci]

OK, smarty, I should have said leftist....

Why would you ever discuss anything except music with the other members of your chamber orchestra? (Although I do remembers some intimate discussions with female flute players (no jokes about 'one time at band camp') and violinists) Are you a string player, a beater or a blower?

[RightWhale]

Stringbass. Thumpa thumpa thumpa. Sometimes some odd screechings using various bowing techniques.

[CatoRenasci]

Well, there you have it...... I should have warned you I'm a tuba player....

Walking bass lines are fun....

[RightWhale]

5/8" tubes, 4 rotating valves, laquered brass? Always wanted one, darned pricey, though.

[Cronos]

you can just hear cnn say: ONLY 61%.......

[CatoRenasci]

Well, I have a few tubas, a euphonium, a sousaphone and a helicon. Some laquer, some silver plated. All piston valves, though except the rotary 5th valve on my F tuba. Bores range from .687" to .734" though some old big rotary horns go up to almost .900".

And, yes, they are pricey. Compared to basses, though? I have cello playing friends with bows worth more than any of my tubas, and cellos worth more than I paid for my house. And the violinists........ at Manhattan School of Music, where my kids are in the prep division, the kid who won the Concerto competition last year was playing on a (his father or grandfather's) Guarnarius. So, I don't complain when a tuba costs $15,000 anymore (but I don't buy one at that price, either).

[RightWhale]

The bow is often more expensive than the instrument and then one might wonder if the bow itself is the true instrument. One of our cellists recently returned from Outside with an ancient $8000 cello, and it does sound good, no doubt about it, but she still uses her old bow. Stringbasses start under $2000, which is why I play that rather than tuba. And my $100 genuine pernambuco wood colored fiberglass bow. The strings cost $200, and they're not bad, but cellists won't touch that brand.

[CatoRenasci]

You should be able to get a very good, playable, 4 valve King 2341 in BBb for under $2,000. A good mouthpiece would be another $50-100 depending on brand. Check out e-bay.