Rapture Rumble: Catholic Author Debates "Left Behind" Author

Envoy Magazine ^ | 07-22-03 | Carl Olson

[Patrick Madrid]

Envoy Magazine's volume 7.1 features the article, "Rapture Rumble," a lengthy, written exchange between Envoy editor Carl Olson and Left Behind creator and co-author Tim LaHaye. Because of the length of that exchange in Envoy, some of it had to be cut. Here are the sections of the debate that were "left behind" on the editing floor, prefaced by Olson’s initial letter to LaHaye and concluding with a final exchange in which LaHaye tells Olson, "I do grieve for your soul" because of the latter’s entrance into the Catholic Church. (Olson is a convert to the Catholic Church from Protestantism . . .

[Blzbba]

is there any way to link to the article? That link took me to the website, where I was unable to find info. on the subject topic.

thanks!

[Patrick Madrid]

Sure thing. Sorry for the glitch. On the upper left of the main Envoy page -- http://www.envoymagazine.com -- you'll see a big yellow starburst for "Rapture Rumble" -- that opens the article. If it doesn't work, let me know and I can find the URL and post that too.

[Modernman]

finall exchange in which LaHaye tells Olson, "I do grieve for your soul" because of the latter’s entrance into the Catholic Church

These stupid squabbles among Protestants and Catholics seem ridiculous to me. Aren't we all Christians? Seems like some Protestants (certainly a radical minority) have a serious case of anti-Catholicism.

[roylene]

It would depend on what you mean by "Christian". If you use the broad term meaning anyone who believes in God then maybe but if you mean the more narrow term "being save by the blood of Christ", "excepting Christ as your personal Savior", then no. I would argue that in order for one to be a Christian, one must except Christ as their personal Savior. This view does not overwhelm the Catholic church or their members.

[Zavien Doombringer]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/951792/posts

[Zavien Doombringer]

Amen, and the feud between Protestants and Catholics reside in the two faiths, in such as this:

Christians believe in Christ alone for salvation

Catholics believe there isn't any salvation outside the Catholic church

Christians believe that Christ's final sacrifice on the cross is enough to justify the forgiveness of sin

Catholics believe that pennance is the restitution for forgiveness for sin.

Christians rely on faith, not of works

Catholics believe in works to gain favor.

This is just a few of the differences that cause the heated debates

[freedom man4534]

this rapture thing is nothing but fantasies

[Zavien Doombringer]

Do you believe in the bible to be God's Holy word?

[freedom man4534]

I believe in a creator but jewish inclined

[Zavien Doombringer]

Then you believe in the miracles of the Plagues, yes?

[freedom man4534]

yes

[Zavien Doombringer]

Do you believe in Isaiah being taken in a Chariot of Fire, Do you believe in Enoch taken while walking with the Lord?
These are all taken from the Jewish/Hebrew scriptures, and can be linked to "rapture", it isn't a Christian idea...

[Zavien Doombringer]

If you Believe, then you know it isn't impossible for GOd to deliver you from any certain wrath that He will pour on the earth. With man, impossible, with God ALL THINGS are possible!

[freedom man4534]

"Do you believe in Isaiah being taken in a Chariot of Fire, Do you believe in Enoch taken while walking with the Lord?
These are all taken from the Jewish/Hebrew scriptures, and can be linked to "rapture", it isn't a Christian idea... "


kinda but I don't take them literally

[Zavien Doombringer]

When it comes to prophecy, I can see not taking some things literally. However from 1st person experiences documenting the events physically, is totally different than trying to figure out the visions the prophets are seeing.

If you don't take scripture literally, do you think God will take you literally?

If God's presence can be known by a pillar of fire and a pillar of smoke, heal a nation by a serpent on a staff, feed the nation Mana from Heaven and later Quail, why can He not do the other things? If you do not believe in the Passover, you are not Jewish...

[Blzbba]

thanks for the reference. Sorry I didn't see it!

Fascinating article, though - thanks!

[freedom man4534]

i do believe in the passover

[Zavien Doombringer]

Then why do you not believe that with God the rapture can happen, when it happened before? Why can't God ressurect the dead? If you believe in the God of Abraham and Joseph, the very Same GOd who delivered Noah and his Family, Lot and his family and Moses and the entire Hebrew nation, why can't he deliver us in Rapture?

[freedom man4534]

the delivery of Noah and his family, Lot and his family, and Moses and the hebrew nation is nto similar to escapist mentality of the rapture