Right.... I get that. What are we debating again and why?
As near as I can tell it started around post 5230:
except Elves are a step closer to us than angels are.
It sounded to me Elves were being put above Men and below angels. At least non-fallen angels have no sin whereas Men have sin and are fallen. Where does that leave Elves if they are between Men and angels? Either you sin or you don't. I was trying to use
Letters 181 to illustrate that Elves are fallen ...or have sin...too so are on the same level as Men.