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To: FLT-bird; Rockingham; x; Ditto; ClearCase_guy
Rockingham: "As best as I can tell, about a quarter to a third of all white families in the South owned slaves at any given moment.
There were local variations of course, depending on the strength and nature of the local plantation economy, but the importance of slavery in the South ought not to be minimized."

FLT-bird: "That is a massive overestimate.
Even most PC Revisionists claim 20% to 25% and I doubt it was that high.
They do this by taking the total number of slave owners (5.63% of the White population) and then just extrapolating an average family size.
Of course, they don't account for the fact that there could be multiple slave owners in one family (that would reduce the number of families which owned slaves so it would be inconvenient for them).
The large majority of White Southern families did not own any slaves."

Seriously, almost any % number you want to chose can be justifiably argued, depending on how you define and who you count, or don't count.
The 1860 census numbers are well known and not disputed.
But how those numbers get interpreted can often reveal a person's biases and loyalties.

Here are the actual 1860 census numbers by region showing household sizes and % of slave ownerships:

Average % of Households Holding Slaves, by Region -- 1860 Census

RegionFree populationEnslaved populationFreedmen (free Blacks)Free HouseholdsFree people per household% households owning slavesAvg. enslaved per slaveholding household
Free States / Territories18,810,0000226,0003,610,0005.210.0%
Border States2,710,000430,000129,000490,0005.5615.9%5.55
Upper South2,930,0001,210,00096,000530,0005.5025.3%8.95
Deep (Lower) South2,660,0002,310,00036,000490,0005.3736.7%12.74
TOTAL (U.S.)27,110,0003,950,000487,0005,120,000≈ 5.3≈26% of Southern households≈10

The first thing to point out here is that regional averages hide the extremes:

So, no single number can encompass the entire slaveholding South.

Likewise, it's entirely fair to say that overall ~75% of Southern households did not own slaves, but that number ranged from 97% in Delaware to only ~50% in Mississippi.

Methodologically:

  1. The 1860 census counted households, not nuclear families.
  2. Households did not include slaves but did include anyone living there, related or not.
  3. In the South, households were typically all related, while in the North, households could include borders or hired hands.
  4. Yes, the claim that some households included multiple slaveholders is true, but it's just as true that some slaveholders owned slaves in multiple households.
    But both cases were rare, and so the overall averages remain valid.
Finally, especially in Deep Cotton South states, it's utterly disingenuous to suggest that slavery was not intimately woven into the fabric of the "Southern way of life" in 1860.
So virtually everyone who joined the Confederate army or participated in Confederate government was embedded in the South's "Peculiar Institution".

And yes, there were many white Southerners who strongly opposed slavery and the CSA -- they formed majorities in places like

Such people were often abused and subject to massacres by loyal Confederates.
433 posted on 03/30/2026 7:11:00 AM PDT by BroJoeK (future DDG 134 -- we remember)
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To: BroJoeK; Rockingham; Ditto; ClearCase_guy
The 1860 census numbers are well known and not disputed. But how those numbers get interpreted can often reveal a person's biases and loyalties. Here are the actual 1860 census numbers by region showing household sizes and % of slave ownerships: Average % of Households Holding Slaves, by Region -- 1860 Census Region Free population Enslaved population Freedmen (free Blacks) Free Households Free people per household % households owning slaves Avg. enslaved per slaveholding household Free States / Territories 18,810,000 0 226,000 3,610,000 5.21 0.0% — Border States 2,710,000 430,000 129,000 490,000 5.56 15.9% 5.55 Upper South 2,930,000 1,210,000 96,000 530,000 5.50 25.3% 8.95 Deep (Lower) South 2,660,000 2,310,000 36,000 490,000 5.37 36.7% 12.74 TOTAL (U.S.) 27,110,000 3,950,000 487,000 5,120,000 ≈ 5.3 ≈26% of Southern households ≈10 The first thing to point out here is that regional averages hide the extremes:

Here we go. Where did you get that % of households owning slaves? You definitely did not get that from the 1860 US Census. Statistical tables for each State and Territory include from the 1860 US Census include

Population by age, sex, and color according to counties;

Population by color and condition (free, colored, and slave) by counties;

Population by color and sex of cities and towns and other subdivisions;

Free population, native and foreign, by counties;

Nativities of the free population;

Occupations.

Nowhere in that Census will you find the # or percentage of households owning slaves in each state. That percentage is something you're just making up without evidence.

So, no single number can encompass the entire slaveholding South. Likewise, it's entirely fair to say that overall ~75% of Southern households did not own slaves, but that number ranged from 97% in Delaware to only ~50% in Mississippi.

You have no evidence for your claims about the % of households in each state that owned slaves. Obviously there were differences between states usually depending on the suitability of the land in that state for growing the 2 more labor intensive cash crops - Cotton and Tobacco.

Methodologically: The 1860 census counted households, not nuclear families. Households did not include slaves but did include anyone living there, related or not. In the South, households were typically all related, while in the North, households could include borders or hired hands. Yes, the claim that some households included multiple slaveholders is true, but it's just as true that some slaveholders owned slaves in multiple households. But both cases were rare, and so the overall averages remain valid.

I'm sure some cases of slave owners not owning any slaves in the household they lived in but still owning slaves in other households existed, but I would suspect it far more rare than cases in which there was more than a single slaveowner in one household. Women could and did inherit slaves from their families (like Julia Grant and Mary Anne Custus Lee) so it was not at all a safe assumption to believe only the husband owned slaves. Similarly, in households that owned a lot of slaves, it was not at all unusual for children to be gifted slaves as birthday or wedding gifts (eg a maid who was a childhood best friend, etc). There is simply no way of proving what percentage of households owned slaves based on the 1860 US Census - which was significantly more detailed than earlier Censuses.

Finally, especially in Deep Cotton South states, it's utterly disingenuous to suggest that slavery was not intimately woven into the fabric of the "Southern way of life" in 1860.

It certainly was for some. It wasn't for the majority who did not own any slaves.

So virtually everyone who joined the Confederate army or participated in Confederate government was embedded in the South's "Peculiar Institution".

False. The overwhelming majority of White Southerners did not own any slaves. Laughable to claim somebody was "embedded in" slavery when that person did not own any slaves.

434 posted on 03/30/2026 7:42:32 AM PDT by FLT-bird
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