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Posted on 12/02/2025 6:19:26 AM PST by DUMBGRUNT
Tesla’s recall of certain Powerwall 2 units is escalating as affected owners file a class action lawsuit over what they describe as “bricked” batteries. The complaint alleges that instead of promptly replacing potentially dangerous units, Tesla remotely limited or drained the batteries, leaving homeowners without functional backup power. Many customers argue this action has deprived them of the core functionality of their Powerwalls, including backup power and energy storage, essentially turning $8,000-plus systems into non-functional wall decorations.
(Excerpt) Read more at evdances.com ...
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More to the point, what will the technology refit cost?
My apartment lease prohibits ALL battery cars. Will that be lifted or modified with the new technology?
The word on the street is the batteries in the new $16 k Tesla model 2 and I believe Cybercabs ware aluminum ion batteries.
The business of battery interchangeability is to complicated for a short post.
I know people who complain about solar and/or battery backup but didn't do the math ahead of time and are, therefore, unsatisfied. And I'm sure it's possible that the complaint is legit.
For example, the grid in my neighborhood has been down twice this morning (once before the sun came up), and it's a drizzly rain day (currently about 850W coming in through solar). I don't know why: it didn't storm, maybe a car hit a power pole. And my inverters are set to drain the batteries until 30% charge left before pulling from the grid. In a grid-down situation pull from the batteries until 20% charge left. The difference (10%) gave me a 9kWh storage buffer (10% of the 90kWh battery stack is 9kWh). About 5% to 7% loss when converting DC to AC power and call it about 8kWh before I have no power (with multiple back-to-back days of rain not charging my battery stack all the way, thus pulling from the grid at night until the battery stack was 30% charged this morning). Thus, I told my wife that until the grid came back up, no getting in the hot tub this morning or running other heavy appliances we can hold off on. That 8kWh in reserve gave us plenty of power for our more essential things. In other words, I know the strengths and weaknesses of the system.
If yesterday had been a sunny day (and fully charged our battery stack while providing all the power we needed in the home and charging the EV) and we had sunny weather for today, I would have told my wife to run whatever appliances she wants.
—” $16 k Tesla”
Musk tends to exaggerate, but still, I like the guy.
A second-level powerwall costs about that and mostly just hangs on the wall.
The Ford Lightning, many GM EVs, Hyundai, Kia... BUT NOT Tesla, support Vehicle-to-Home (V2H) by directional charging.
Many used ones out there...
But I already have a nice inverter-type generator, safe for my highzoot computerized gas boiler and heat pump.
Our daughter has a Genesis G80, and I like it, but it needs high test and is a thirsty beast-— she has a company gascard.
I have my eye on the Genesus Electric hybrid 70, power out, charge house from the car!
People are not interested in doing all that mental work for something they take for granted. (Engineers excepted, of course.)
“My apartment lease prohibits ALL battery cars. Will that be lifted or modified with the new technology?”
Headline in the near future: EV Owners Are the New Homeless.
“””” Tesla remotely limited or drained the batteries, “”””
If you like Tesla remotely controlling you, then you are going to love Artificial Intelligence when it controls your day to day decision making.
There is a niche market here — a wall thingie that does this thinking for you. After market.
My EV has the V2L (vehicle to load) that you mentioned but only as a single 120V outlet. I've played with it to test it -- good as advertised. It doesn't have the bidirectional charging to power the home (unless I ran backup power from the V2L for one extension cord to power lights or a small appliance). But for this post I'll pretend it does do bidirectional charging for whole house power.
Here's why an EV wouldn't be good in most cases for battery backup (compared to home battery storage).
1) Us EV owners are encouraged to charge the EV at night both to limit how long it holds the charge (keeping it at 50% to 60% is optimum for reducing wear, so if you come home with that much charge, don't charge it immediately to the recommended 80% to give you plenty of range for driving the next day, set the timer to charge it to 80% shortly before you leave for work). The other reason is that some power companies give you a discounted rate at night as an incentive to encourage you to shift your grid demand to when the grid is least being worked. (i.e. if you want to lower your power bill, whatever the EV charge is when you get home don't charge it until night time) End result: when the grid goes down (here that's usually during an early evening storm) your EV is probably not charged much anyway to give you backup power.
2) The other reason is the EV's battery warranty is probably not as long or as deep a discharge as home battery warranties. My EV battery is warrantied for 10 years, guaranteed to not degrade faster than a linear progression to holding 50% as much in the 10th year. My home solar batteries are guaranteed for 19 years / 50%. (Some newer home batteries have 25 year/70% warranties.) Also, the recommended top off charge for my home batteries is 100% (suggested not to drain them below 20%, though I usually cut it at 30% before I start pulling from the grid, and drain them to 20% only if the grid is down). With the EV it's usually recommended 80% to 20% (unless you're about to head out on a long trip and charge it to 100%). So even if my EV's battery capacity (77 kWh) was the same as the home battery stack (90 kWh), I can still get more regular goody out of the home batteries (100% - 20% = 80% recommended regular use) than I can from the EV battery (80% - 20% = 60% use). Unless of course you knew a storm was coming and charged the EV to 100% immediately to be ready for power outage, as long as you didn't do it regularly (don't have the EV's battery sit at 100% all day except for the few hours you're on the road driving it).
Full disclosure, for the statements above, I pretended I didn't use solar to charge my home batteries, again to save on grid pull and lower my power bill. This post is pretending I'd use grid power to keep them 100% charged all the time -- as part of the discussion for home battery vs EV battery for backup power. In real life I use my home solar batteries for both lowering my power bills (thus I drain them some at night and on heavy rain days) and for backup power. But the math is too complicated to post here on how I achieve that balance of leaving enough charge in the batteries for grid backup while draining them enough to keep my power bills averaging $65/month in my all-electric home, including charging the EV for 1,500 miles/month home charged miles, and doing most of the EV charging during sunny days and not charging it on rainy days unless I have multiple rainy days in a row with little free solar power coming in.) If you want to do what I do, it's an absolute must that you first do your homework for your particular use case to make sure solar and/or battery storage and/or EV is good for you. (We also have a gas pickup so we don't have to be fully devoted to EV tech. But it's nice driving 18K miles per year on home charged miles with a $65/month power bill and not worrying about the left's warmageddon doomsday cult raising energy prices and messing up my retirement financial planning, at least not our energy expenses.
If anyone just woke up from a long coma and wants to know if the Dims got their way into convincing/making most people drive EV's, it's simple to determine. The Dims aren't trying to ban EV's yet like they do everything we depend on.
Neuralink, a Musk enterprise,... some good science and helped a few invalids. Just wait for the wearable sensor hat $$$
“Our brain-computer interface translates neural signals into actions. In our clinical trials, people are using Neuralink devices to control computers and robotic arms with their thoughts.”
It didn’t work out for Paul Newman
What A Way To Go | Paul Newman’s death
https://youtu.be/NqOG5TZ-DEI?si=OmL83TVBKojBq3XV|
I wonder if any of the purchasers of these batteries read their contracts before they bought them. I am sure that they would have much preferred to sue over the complete loss of their home, business or property if Tesla identified a potential battery fire and explosion and did nothing.
“Tesla Powerwall comes with a 10-year warranty that guarantees at least 70% energy retention, but this is dependent on the unit being connected to the internet for firmware updates. The warranty covers the hardware and includes labor costs for service, and Tesla will repair or replace the unit at its discretion. Exclusions to the warranty include environmental damage like floods or fires, improper installation, or unauthorized repairs”
Hard to stay connected with a dead powerwall.
With Tesla’s ability to remotely control your property it seems to me that you do not actually OWN it. You will own nothing and be happy!
—”You will own nothing and be happy!”
Lots of sucker bait for the spenders.
The BMW deal, a subscription for heated seats that you paid for.
Onstar will call the cops when you crash, for a fee...
” Porsche Intelligent Range Manager, which optimizes the car’s navigation system to maximize the EV’s range and minimize charging stops. Drivers will have to pay $474 to purchase the feature or $12 per month...”
It ain’t just software and the suckers eat it up.
Kalifornia has, or soon will, mandate that all EV/hybrid have bi-directional charging. While some responses in this thread talk above using their EV to power their house, the democRATS and DemoKKKrats have a very different plan.
They have openly stated that there is all of this electric power just sitting there in all of the EVs. That energy could be put to a better use. So......at night, you plug in your EV, expecting to use it in the morning. At night, Big Brother decides they “need” the electricity more than you do. Come the morning, you only have 20% charge. Oh well. From each, according to the government.
—”mandate that all EV/hybrid have bi-directional charging.”
When disaster strikes and you need to move on...
You are stuck.
Plus, EV battery life is dependent on the number of charging cycles. Something about the Takings Clause?
“Headline in the near future: EV Owners Are the New Homeless.”
Nope. In my hard-left state, the headline will be: “Governor signs Bill Freezing Rents and Requiring Apartment Owners to Allow EV’s and Provide Free Charging.” In addition, the bill would require apartment owners to indemnify anyone injured as a result of an EV burning down the building.
“Headline in the near future: EV Owners Are the New Homeless.”
Nope. In my hard-left state, the headline will be: “Governor signs Bill Freezing Rents and Requiring Apartment Owners to Allow EV’s and Provide Free Charging.” In addition, the bill would require apartment owners to indemnify anyone injured as a result of an EV burning down the building.
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