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Did Trump act unlawfully? (Regarding Intel)
X ^ | Aug 23 | @EdwinLandy

Posted on 08/24/2025 2:05:02 AM PDT by RandFan

@EdwinLandy

It was an appropriation made by Trump unlawfully. The money was supposed to go to Intel's performance of grant objectives, but instead of that, Trump changed it that they just have to give up stock for the money. Grants are not free money. They are a special kind of contact. Anyway, there is no legal authority behind his actions, so he'll handle it however he wants until someone successfully challenges him.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Chit/Chat; Computers/Internet; Conspiracy
KEYWORDS: fascism; governmentchips; mullahloversonfr; multiplenicks; randpaulsucks; randstanding; toobigtofail
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To: RandFan

I’d rather this than let China be controlling how some of our chips are made - better than the old “Cash for Clunkers”


41 posted on 08/24/2025 5:14:16 AM PDT by trebb (So many fools - so little time...)
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To: Liz

I am copying your message to tweet as you make a good point
and I can not explain it any better


42 posted on 08/24/2025 5:20:44 AM PDT by blueyon (God, is who we need)
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To: RandFan

There is precedent from auto bailouts where stock was acquired to “help them out” and eventually sold. No permanent stake was kept. That was never tried in court so legality is debatable.

Nevertheless, I don’t agree that bailout was in line with the intent of the Constitution, nor do I think this Intel thing is.

I also don’t like “crony capitalism” where government sets laws and regulations that benefit some companies but not others, yet this is “legal”.

I also don’t like flat out corruption where companies are given grants and they basically do nothing but go bankrupt (green scams), yet this is “legal”.

I have no problem with government putting out RFPs where multiple companies bid to provide the product or service.

I have no problem for the relatively rare circumstance where only one company can actually provide the particular product or service in a timely way so they are awarded over and over (e.g. Skunkworks)

I have no problem w/government giving grants for research.

I have no problem w/government giving loans that are paid back.

Nevertheless, all the things I “approve of “ can be abused, which I don’t like.

To me, what’s most in line constitutionally, would be to cut the outlandish statutes and regulations that make operating in the US non-competitive. That’s what’s driving business overseas. Until that’s straightened out (which it probably never will be) tariffs can help adjust for that.

The constitution is great. Communism, socialism, fascism, totalitarianism, and authoritarianism are terrible.

We have a little bit of each terrible thing going on in the US today.

The Intel thing is just the latest and falls in the fascist bucket. Hopefully, they’ll sell the shares soon.

In the meantime:

Is anyone going to be casting the votes with that 10%, and if so, who is it, and how will they vote, the next time a voting issue comes to the Board?

What happens to the stock value of other US chip manufacturers like AMD, XiLinx, and Texas Instruments?

Is someone in government going to propose certain backdoors in chips to help spy on the American public?


43 posted on 08/24/2025 5:32:05 AM PDT by fruser1
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To: blueyon

I am copying your message to tweet as you make a
good point and I can not explain it any better.


Be my guest


44 posted on 08/24/2025 5:35:05 AM PDT by Liz (May you be in Heaven half an hour before the devil knows you're dead (Irish blessing))
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To: JayGalt

I agree. This is better than money being spent for illegals food and housing or security assurance for Ukraine using American troops. There’s bad spending and there’s good spending. Intel’s deal sounds like a good deal.


45 posted on 08/24/2025 5:37:59 AM PDT by Trumpette1954 (Live laugh love!cper)
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To: JayGalt

“Trump puts America first in this, as in all things. Without a chipmaker on American soil America is not only vulnerable in time of war but the revival of American industry including defense is problematic.”

Thanks. While I love Taiwan, I’m not sure we should be basing our economic and military security on a tiny island country less than 100 miles from a monster that claims it as its own.

Perhaps it’s time to jettison Ann Rand and GET SERIOUS about national defense, which means on-shoring critical industries (like making ball bearings, for example), and subsidizing those industries as necessary to cope with our TOTALLY SICK labor unions and environmental laws, not to mention our even more sicker judges.

In Russia, when it came time to STEP-UP military production the Ann Rand Groupies over there found out just why the Russian government hung on to their way-underutilized, but still operating, factories. We, on the other hand, turned them into Shopping Malls and Golf Course, particularly in California as they were a drain on “share-holder value”.


46 posted on 08/24/2025 6:30:27 AM PDT by BobL
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To: RandFan

“If Biden did this you’d be screaming about it.”

Nope. But you live in a speculative world. Speculusion (Speculate then Conclude) is for children, and Rand’s followers typically are that childish. Always complaining but never leading, never taking a risk, always quitting before the end.


47 posted on 08/24/2025 6:31:42 AM PDT by CodeToad
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To: RandFan
No, it is not cool.
And if it is NOT illegal, it should be.
48 posted on 08/24/2025 6:43:59 AM PDT by GaltAdonis
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To: GaltAdonis

Thanks for being honest. Refreshing.


49 posted on 08/24/2025 6:52:43 AM PDT by RandFan
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To: RandFan
You are welcome.
Posting deceit is almost pointless.
50 posted on 08/24/2025 7:03:55 AM PDT by GaltAdonis
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To: RandFan

Its not illegal. Read up before you start spewing this stuff.


51 posted on 08/24/2025 7:10:05 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped)
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To: RandFan

Our national security must be taken into top consideration.


52 posted on 08/24/2025 7:21:18 AM PDT by kenmcg (ti hi o)
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To: faithhopecharity

Indeed selective memories in action.

But the left thinks that’s different.


53 posted on 08/24/2025 7:26:03 AM PDT by Vaduz
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To: JayGalt

Thanks for clarifying.


54 posted on 08/24/2025 7:44:10 AM PDT by Tell It Right (1 Thessalonians 5:21 -- Put everything to the test, hold fast to that which is true.)
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To: RandFan

performance of grant objectives

Is not control of stock one way to incentivize the objectives?


55 posted on 08/24/2025 8:03:49 AM PDT by spintreebob
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To: RandFan
Depends on how it was done. Trump was threatening to withhold the money unless Intel gave the US some shares.

There's no case unless Trump actually withheld the money, unless you want to argue extortion. But then it was not extortion on his behalf, since he's not personally benefitting. So it's hard to argue for extortion.

Plus the Intel execs were probably happy to give the shares since it propped up Intel's share prices, from which they would benefit personally.

Unlawful or the bully pulpit?

If you want to argue the US gov should not own shares, that horse left the barn a long time ago with subsidized loans, "green" grants and NGO funding that were recycled to the Dem party, etc., etc. Trump has learned that if you walk away from the game because its corrupt, you still forfeit.

56 posted on 08/24/2025 8:06:00 AM PDT by pierrem15 ("Massacrez-les, car le seigneur connait les siens" )
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To: faithhopecharity

There’s a story going back to “Davy” Crockett’s time as a representative from Tennessee. There was a flood somewhere in the state and Crockett led congress into directing $20,000 towards helping the locals.

Upon his return to Tennessee he started the usual glad-handing and was greeted by one cold shoulder and scowl after another.

He was told by at least one voter he no longer had his and others’ support for what he did with THEIR tax money.

Some say the reason he went to Texas was as much for being in disfavor among the voters as his willingness to go fight for Texas.


57 posted on 08/24/2025 10:03:52 AM PDT by normbal (normbal. Non-native Tennessean.)
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To: normbal

Thanks.
I have to admit to being a bit more flexible about disaster aid if it is a real disaster and all that.
BUT ... I realize that some FRers will say, correctly, that even disaster aid is none of the federal government’s proper business

either way on that, when these huge corporations or banks fail... it sure can cause some disruptive shocks in wider sectors of the economy. A lot of innocent people can get hurt for having done nothing wrong themselves.

With Intel, we DO need reliable domestic chip production capacity. Partly for defense, so that would be a possible justification for “doing something” to “save” Intel.

It having been decided, done already -— I hope it is a successful bailout..... and that the fed govt gets OUT of ownership as soon as feasible. And starts cutting back on those agencies and bureaus that are improperly interfering with our liberty as American citizens.


58 posted on 08/24/2025 10:44:55 AM PDT by faithhopecharity ("Politicians aren't born, they're excreted." Marcus Tullius Cicero (106 to 43 BCE))
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To: Katya

People still don’t seem to understand: it isn’t that Intel is “too big to fail”, it’s that our Nation, the US, must not be allowed to fail.

We grow our own food. We provide our own oil, coal and natural gas. We manufacture our own cars, trucks, trains and planes. We manufacture our own steel, concrete, plastics, wood products and chemicals. We build our own computers, software, telecom, radio/TV and satellites. We invented and deployed the Internet. We *design* state-of-the-art CPUs/GPUs/NPUs.

But, we don’t *manufacture* any of these leading-edge chips: we depend on foreign fabs to do this.

There have been 2 big players in the US. Intel still does this, but has fallen behind. IBM used to do this, but sold off their fabs (to Global Foundries) as the ROI was less than they wanted — another example of the hollowing out of US industry.

So, although I’m not real happy about the government investing in private industry, we can’t afford the risk of not being able to actually manufacture our own state-of-the-art chips.

P.S. We do manufacture many kinds of memory chips (RAM, SSD etc.) in the US.

P.P.S. I am more partial to AMD than Intel, but they don’t manufacture their chips (I think they use Global Foundries).


59 posted on 08/24/2025 11:17:21 AM PDT by powerset
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To: Worldtraveler once upon a time

Just sayin’ if it’s already in the CHIPS act even though ot yet handed out it’s not new money. Does Trump have the right to claw it back? At this point would that be in America’s interest?


60 posted on 08/24/2025 11:40:51 AM PDT by JayGalt (For America!)
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