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To: Worldtraveler once upon a time
Even among "Zelensky supporters," one finds some European "supporters" backing away

France, Italy reportedly opt out of US-NATO arms deal for Ukraine Kyiv Independent, 16 July 2025

Your being dishonest, no surprise, by not stating the reason.

France and Italy are not "backing away" from supporting Ukraine, but are going to buy their weapons for Ukraine from European producers, in order to support European industries.

The French government will not join the initiative because of its emphasis on piecing together Europe's defense industrial base,

https://www.newsweek.com/france-italy-donald-trump-nato-weapons-ukraine-2100129

71 posted on 07/18/2025 6:15:51 AM PDT by tlozo
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To: tlozo
France and Italy are not "backing away" from supporting Ukraine, but are going to buy their weapons for Ukraine from European producers, in order to support European industries.

Which makes the U.S. "support" for Ukraine extraneous and irrelevant. See Post #44.

73 posted on 07/18/2025 6:18:13 AM PDT by Alberta's Child ("Although my eyes were open, they might just as well be closed.")
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To: tlozo; Worldtraveler once upon a time

“Thales-Raytheon Systems Company LLC (ThalesRaytheonSystems or TRS) is an aerospace and defence company co-headquartered in Massy, France and Fullerton, California, United States.[1] It is operated as a 50:50 joint venture between Raytheon Technologies (formerly Raytheon Company) and Thales Group.”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ThalesRaytheonSystems

Raytheon:

Ownership

As of December 2014, according to filed reports, the top ten institutional shareholders of Raytheon are Wellington Management Company, Vanguard Group, State Street Corporation, Barrow, Hanley, Mewhinney & Strauss, BlackRock Institutional Trust Company, BlackRock Advisors, Bank of America, Bank of New York Mellon, Deutsche Bank and Macquarie Group.[47]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raytheon_Company

Different country same Military Industrial Complex and profiteers.


80 posted on 07/18/2025 6:36:55 AM PDT by Openurmind (AI - An Illusion for Aptitude Intrusion to Alter Intellect. )
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To: tlozo
--- "Your being dishonest, no surprise, by not stating the reason."

What a limp accusation. I merely posted sources as hotlink URLs. Read them any way you like. I read "opt out" as "opt out."

If you don't buy a product or accept an assertion, your reason may well be different than another's, and yet the decision is the decision.

Macron says he wants to bolster French armament production. Fine. Italy calls "to explore alternative ways to contribute." Also fine. Kyiv Independent reports concerns over "fiscal limitations" for some. Fine too.

State any reason you'd like. That upshot is that the US being paid for weapons from France, Italy, Hungary and the Czech Republik ( I have worked in all of them ) is not proceeding in the moment.

That leaves the UK and Germany and some smaller neighbors to pay for US weapons under the "sell" plan, in the moment. This being an evolving theme, one awaits more events, statements and actions.

But no dishonesty.

Your comment -- "74" -- states "European countries are going to BUY US weapons and ship them to Ukraine.." Some are. Some aren't, in this moment. How long it will take to piece "together Europe's defense industrial base" is a matter of time. Days? Weeks? Months? Years? For today and per Z-media, some are opting out -- for whatever reasons they so state. That's it.

91 posted on 07/18/2025 7:14:38 AM PDT by Worldtraveler once upon a time (Degrow government)
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